Need advice on a situation

crazin01 · Jan 20, 2020

Is it possible the lender & lendee knew each other before being a patient? I find it odd that somebody would lend to a complete stranger simply because they were a care provider. (which seems to be the norm on Judge Judy)

Are you concerned the employee pressured the patient? How do you know that reporting it would improve things for the patient? Also not sure how a different co-worker telling you is really either of your concern.

I wouldn't report it, as you don't know all the facts and doing so could cause harm to your colleagues livelihood.

JKL33 · Jan 20, 2020

I turn these things back to the person who told me (although my first preemptive measure involves not being around to hear gossip if at all possible. It isn't usually too difficult to figure out who always has something to say about others. Avoid these people and don't hang around to give them an audience).

Anyway, if something like this is dropped on me I turn it right back to the person from whom it came. In this case I would say, "It sounds like you know something about whether it's true or not. I'm staying out of it." And walk away.

I don't act upon hearsay unless there is some exceedingly compelling reason for me to do so; I have a pretty high bar for deciding what meets that qualification.

That is all.

allnurses Guide · Jan 23, 2020

In situations like that I remind myself "Not my circus, not my monkeys!" People who do the wrong thing eventually get theirs when Karma comes around!

Hppy

kp2016 · Jan 23, 2020

.....Honestly as much as I would love to agree that you should mind your own business being a patient advocate is our responsibility so if we come to know or suspect that a co worker is taking advantage of a patient I feel we have an ethical duty to report it.

In a somewhat similar (but completely different) situation a Tech I worked with approached me and told me she was very disturbed by a situation she knew of between and RN and one of our patients. She told me that as she wasn't an RN she didn't know if it was against the rules, but was worried so could she tell me what she knew and let me decide if anything needed to be done. With hindsight I realize I probably should have just directed her to our manager. The fact was it was a very small unit and she had already chosen for whatever reason not to go to the manager.

When I heard the exact issue (wildly wildly inappropriate and also illegal) I was very glad I listened and didn't risk her not reporting the issue. I spoke with our manager and laid out exactly what I was told. Manager interviewed RN in question who admitted the information was correct and was escorted out by security shortly afterward.

caliotter3 · Jan 23, 2020

I wish I could find somebody that would lend me $3000. Agree with the others, stay out of this. You did not witness anything yourself. At least that is the excuse the cops always give when they are telling a person that they can't do a thing about an incident.

JKL33 · Jan 23, 2020

6 hours ago, kp2016 said:
With hindsight I realize I probably should have just directed her to our manager.

? Ha. While reading your post that is exactly what I was thinking...then I got to the part where you said it. Direct this type of situation to the manager before it even gets started.

That is the best basic policy whenever possible IMO. I would preempt people and tell them that I don't want to know about the matter but that if the information in question involves illegal or highly unethical activities, they have an obligation to use the chain of command.

There are exceptions.

6 hours ago, kp2016 said:
The fact was it was a very small unit and she had already chosen for whatever reason not to go to the manager.

I just don't tolerate this very well; in general this "seeking alternative counsel" too often just turns into a way for the person to falsely relieve their conscience while doing nothing, or (worst case scenario but all too common) even just becomes a gossip network. In a certain workplace it was known that a certain Susie Q was great friends with the manager and that every "interesting nugget" mentioned in her presence would be going straight to the manager, through her. This became a great way for people to get coworkers in trouble of varying degrees...by casually mentioning untoward or even more accusatory statements about coworkers in Susie's presence, because the manager took everything she said for god's honest truth.

Because things like ^ this (and permutations of it) seem to get going with very little effort, I am an advocate of the idea that people need to do their own reporting.

Another reason I would advocate people doing their own reporting is because theoretically the second person has even less obligation to report it through proper channels than the first; after all it it factually is nothing but hearsay to them. But if they are told anyway, then the first person is likely to feel at least some relief from their obligation, meanwhile the second person doesn't have the same (first-hand) knowledge, and because of that arguably doesn't have the same degree of obligation.

The "whatever reason" is the thing (from your quote) that isn't okay. It is not okay. Think about it, she then informed you of this illegal and wildly inappropriate activity--so she simply had zero business approaching you instead of the proper chain of command.

One time a person did report some significantly concerning info to me and I didn't have the opportunity to redirect them before they could do it. So I told them they are obligated to tell so-and-so (manager), and that they needed to do it today and that I was going to check with so-and-so later to "make sure you've had a chance to connect." So, take your pick: Go tell her now, or else later she will know that you chose not to.

I don't know. I just don't handle the muddied waters and the various shenanigans that arise around this in general. I hate games and I dislike emotion-based excuses. You don't get off the hook by telling someone who has no authority to attempt to validate your statements. Go tell someone who does. Overall, strict expectations about this are what is theoretically most likely to protect a patient.