MSN or MSNA for future Doctorate

air · Feb 2, 2005

I am contemplating getting a PhD/Doctorate sometime in the future after completing a CRNA program. So, my dilemma is...should I attend a MSN or MSNA program? I eventually (much later in my career) think I would like to teach anesthesia/nursing at the college level. If I choose the MSNA program, will I be able to get my Doctorate in Nursing, since it is non-nursing? Or will I have to choose a anesthesia related field to get a Doctorate? If so, what related areas are common choices? Thanks in advance for any information.

Valid question.

I also had that concern too.

It all depends on the program. I spoke to several PhD program heads. They informed me that if you are coming in with an anesthesia background, they will recruit you into their program irrespective of what type of degree you have. I remember some of the programs told me that you may have to take a class or two though, but you will still be enrolled as a PhD candidate/student and may be required to get those class prior to taking certain Phd classes. UC,OSU, JHU, GMU program directors made that clear to me. The details will be in what classes you take while in your masters program. They will find that out from your transcript. They told me that they are very familiar across the board with what an MSN entails. But you are can always check with some of the PhD program directors just to know how things will turn out. Remember you are talking about an MSNA Vs MSN, which I think is not much different. When I was making my enquirers I was trying doing the MSN Vs MHS.

I am also open to see how others respond to this question

loisane · Feb 2, 2005

My experience was a little different from air's.

My understanding is that you absolutely must have a nursing degree to teach in a program that is within a school of nursing. Since that is at least half of the programs (or maybe a little more than half, depending on who you talk to), that makes a MSN a bit more attractive for someone considering a future in education. A different masters limits your choices.

Same thing for a doctorate. If it is a nursing program, your degree has to be in nursing. I think departments are developing more flexible policies to allow for non-nursing masters prepared people to enter nursing doctorates. But in my mind, it is easier to just get the MSN to avoid any extra hoop jumping later. Another option would be to get a non-nursing doctorate. But again, you are limiting your choices of programs you are qualified for.

for me, I decided that a nursing degree will work for everywhere. Any other degree eliminates some employment opportunities.

loisane crna

meandragonbrett · Feb 2, 2005

This is something of interest to me as well. The program that I'm interested in offers a MS with a focus in anesthesia. I want to teach, but only as adjunct faculty.

air · Feb 2, 2005

MeanDragon, If you are in TN you can best double check with some of those Phd programs there. I had checked with them early 2004, and all of them were insistent that MSN is the prefered route, I was not sure if any bias was at play.

I personally made to decision to take the MSN route. It is adding another month to my program and some change$. Thinking about it now, the MSN/MHS was the second biggest draw.

jewelcutt · Feb 2, 2005

You can always get a DNSc and teach, and don't forget that by 2015 years they want all CRNAs to be entry level clinical doctorates. There are plenty of MS CRNAs that teach anyway and probably get doctorates.

meandragonbrett · Feb 2, 2005

You can always get a DNSc and teach, and don't forget that by 2015 years they want all CRNAs to be entry level clinical doctorates. There are plenty of MS CRNAs that teach anyway and probably get doctorates.

It's not just CRNAs that the ANCC wants to make a clinical doctorate entry level, it's all APRNs. I think it's a good idea professionally, but it may put off many future APRNs. I've noticed that some nursing schools are dropping the DNSc and are now offering the DNP.

jewelcutt · Feb 2, 2005

I did know they've created a doctorate in NP but I wasn't aware they were dropping the DNSc. I always thought the DNSc was a good option for those that didn't want to do a ton of research and stay more clinically based but it makes sense if they're making a new clinical doctorate.

CRNA, DNSc · Feb 2, 2005

I did know they've created a doctorate in NP but I wasn't aware they were dropping the DNSc. I always thought the DNSc was a good option for those that didn't want to do a ton of research and stay more clinically based but it makes sense if they're making a new clinical doctorate.

Just to clarify- the DNP is a clinical doctorate and the DNSc is a terminal research doctorate. In the world of academia those are two very different animals. :rolleyes:

mwbeah · Feb 2, 2005

I respectfully disagree with Loisane on this one. Your doctorate program does not need to be in nursing to teach in a nursing program (i.e A&P, Pharmacology, etc). Master's prepared nurses are in non-nursing doctorate programs and upon graduation do teach in CRNA and other nursing programs.

Mike

mwbeah · Feb 2, 2005

Just remember that not all doctoral programs are the same, educational or nursing doctorates take anywhere from 2-3 years to complete while the hard science doctorates will take anywhere from 4-7 years (or beyond) to complete. A doctorate is not a doctorate is not a doctorate................

Mike

loisane · Feb 3, 2005

I respectfully disagree with Loisane on this one. Your doctorate program does not need to be in nursing to teach in a nursing program (i.e A&P, Pharmacology, etc). Master's prepared nurses are in non-nursing doctorate programs and upon graduation do teach in CRNA and other nursing programs.
Mike

Interesting, I have not run into any such programs. All the programs I have encountered require a degree in nursing, if their CRNA program degree is a MSN. The only CRNA programs I have encountered that employ CRNA instructors/professors whose degrees are not in nursing, are those programs who grant a non-MSN degree in their CRNA programs.

I agree with CRNA, DNSc. The "new" DNP is a clinical doctorate. It stands for Doctor of Nursing Practice, and will be open to all APNs. It is being suggested to replace other clinical doctorates (like the ND, Nursing Doctorate).

loisane crna