Docs yelling at nurses....

PMFB-RN, RN · Jun 21, 2007

Hi guys,

I have been reading the several posts about doctors yelling at the nurses. I am wondering:

1. As a male nurse, is it any different?

*** In my experience yes. I have seen docs with reputations for being abusive jerks to female nurses act different to male nurses.

2. Have you ever had to deal with yelling physicians? If yes, what did you do? How did you deal with it? I read several posts stating from mouthing off to cry in the bathroom (mostly women on how they react).

*** When I was young and just out of the army a surgical resident yelled at me. I invited him out to the parking lot for an ass kicking. It scared the hell out of him. I don't recommend it though. I got fired.

3. It is my second career moving from a corporate environment with lots of politics. We cannot tolerate such things. A person can be written up for such behaviors. However, me going into nursing, I carry the same habits. I cannot put up with such behaviors. I am just wondering how to prepare myself. It is something common and have to learn to deal with it or there are ways to handle it without feeling embarrassed such as involving HR,etc...? The politically correct way that I know is to let the physician know that he doesnt realize that he is yelling and to go to a more private place to discuss it and if he doesnt listen, just walk away from him (ignore him).

*** No nurse, male or female should ever tolerate being yelled at by a doctor (or anyone else). Nor should we ever raise out voices to CNAs, house keeping, ect. I currently work at a hospital that does not tolerate such behavior. Docs can and have lots their privileges for being jerks to other staff. If yelled at today I would turn my back on the doc and walk away, directly to my nurse manager to file a complaint. If action was not taken I would move on the a hospital with more respect for their staff.

mediatix8 · Jun 21, 2007

Get HR involved? Haaaaaaaa ha ha ha ha. You COULD write them up but from what I've seen no one is going to do anything about it unless they physically hurt you,sexually harrass you, or act innappropriate in front of patients or families. I have never seen HR get in between nurse/physician issues. That's something more for the nurse manager and higher ups. But seriously, it has to be really bad before people would get involved. You are going to have a real culture shock, coming from the business world. Yes, you will be yelled at. I guarantee it. Probably at some point by other nurses, CNA's, and definately by patients and or families. You will be yelled at for mistakes made by other nurses when you bring it to the doctor's attention. You will be yelled at for calling the doctors for issues that you absolutely have to call them for. For example, I had a pateint in restraints and the doctor's order for restraints runs out after 24 hours. The order ran out in the am so I called the MD at 0730 and was yelled at. I explained it was hospital policy but she was all "why are you bothering me about this at this time." I work night shift and one time i got to work and my patient's BP was something like 205/107 so I called the doctor and was yelled at FOR TAKING THE BLOOD PRESSURE. He asked why was I taking blood pressures at midnight. I said "But doctor, we take everyone's vital signs at midinght... it's hopital routine?!?!" He was still mad that I bothered him and told me to NOT TAKE THE BLOOD PRESSURE ANY MORE THAT NIGHT. Of course, most of my interactions with doctors are either pleasant or at least tolerable.

Working nights, we don't see most of the doctors in person so any yelling is usually done over the phone. I can deal with that better than if it were in person. The bad thing with nights though is that we often are waking them up and sometimes they are just crabby about being woken up. I have definately noticed that ever since I started the call by saying "I'm sorry to wake you up at this time but..." that I have not once been yelled at for merely waking them up.

How to deal with it? You have to remember that they are not your boss. They can't hire or fire you (unless you work in a doctor's office). The ones that are nasty usually have a reputation for being this way. Sometimes it's fun to laugh about it later with the other nurses and they share their experiences too. I personally deal with it more internally. I know who I am. I don't base my self esteem on the actions or comments of others. If someone acts innappropriately, that is a personal defect that they have. I have never yelled back at a doctor because that stoops down to their immature level. When they go into a rant I just quietly wait for them to stop. By showing anger back at them, it shows they have "gotten to you." Most people might think the "manly" thing to do would be to lash out verbally but I think it really shows strength and maturity to compose yourself. I would prefer to handle things by writing them up or discussing with the manager in a calm, professional way. But like I said before, it has to be really bad before anyone will take action.

I don't know if men have it easier but I've definately heard that ICU nurses get treated A LOT better by the doctors. I've heard they really ask for your opinion on things and treat you more like an equal.

PMFB-RN, RN · Jun 22, 2007

I work night shift and one time i got to work and my patient's BP was something like 205/107 so I called the doctor and was yelled at FOR TAKING THE BLOOD PRESSURE. He asked why was I taking blood pressures at midnight. I said "But doctor, we take everyone's vital signs at midinght... it's hopital routine?!?!" He was still mad that I bothered him and told me to NOT TAKE THE BLOOD PRESSURE ANY MORE THAT NIGHT.

*** I hope you wrote that as an order and quoted him word for word.

tferdaise · Jun 23, 2007

I don't put up with it. However, we have one attending that likes to belittle everyone from med students to nurses to fellows. Insinuated a couple of weeks ago that I fed a pt with an ETT GRRRRRRR!!!!! I definately "dished" it back to him. He then half apologized. One thing I have noticed is that the male docs do NOT yell or belittle male nurses like they do the female ones. Then there are some female interns or residents that just give every one an attitude. I think they are trying to prove something or hide the fact that they don't have a clue as to what is really going on.

This isn't true, I had a Nephrologist yell at me because I stopped the IVF on his patient. He tried his best to belittle me, when he was done, I asked the Doctor 2 questions..

1. Are you done yelling at me?

his reply was YES.

2. Can you read...

Then I showed the Dr the MAR's for the patient, in which it stated to DC IVF at 1400... When he read that, I asked him to read it to me OUTLOUD, just to make sure I understoodd it. He told me to go **** myself and throw the MAR book down and left the unit. The Unit manager was there as well as the Director. Besides them and myself, 3 other nurses as well as family members wrote that Dr up for his behavior. Ever since that day he hasn't spoken to me. Which is fine, he is a lousey Nephrologist.

I've had other Dr's try and yell at me, I just usally walk away from them..

Tony

tferdaise · Jun 23, 2007

One other time, I had a patient who was going Septic, I called the on call Dr to get orders, when I started giving the Dr the pt's infomation, the Dr stopped me, and said "That is the Pain in the A$$ family." I'm not going to give you orders for that pt, he need to contact her Dr directly. I explained to the Dr I had tried and haven't gotten a return call. The Dr informed me he well contact the Dr, I waited 15 minutes (it took me that long to chart the whole conversation.) By this time the family is basically standing on top of me, wondering why the Dr hasn't call me back. So I called the on call Dr again, he started yelling at, so I figured what the hell. I started to repeat everything outloud so the family could hear what the Dr is saying. The Dr caught on to this, he stopped his yelling, gave me orders, and threatened me, and of course I repeated that out loud also. All the while, the on coming nurse is sitting next to me in shock on what is happening. After the dust settled on this, the Dr lost his prvilage to work there.... It took me over an hour to chart the whole thing....

EmmaG, RN · Jun 23, 2007

I work night shift and one time i got to work and my patient's BP was something like 205/107 so I called the doctor and was yelled at FOR TAKING THE BLOOD PRESSURE. He asked why was I taking blood pressures at midnight. I said "But doctor, we take everyone's vital signs at midinght... it's hopital routine?!?!" He was still mad that I bothered him and told me to NOT TAKE THE BLOOD PRESSURE ANY MORE THAT NIGHT.
*** I hope you wrote that as an order and quoted him word for word.

I had a doc do the same to me; so I told him I was going to chart I had notified him of the abnormal VS, and that I would be writing his order not to take any more VS during the night.

He backed down pretty quick...

mediatix8 · Jun 23, 2007

I work night shift and one time i got to work and my patient's BP was something like 205/107 so I called the doctor and was yelled at FOR TAKING THE BLOOD PRESSURE. He asked why was I taking blood pressures at midnight. I said "But doctor, we take everyone's vital signs at midinght... it's hopital routine?!?!" He was still mad that I bothered him and told me to NOT TAKE THE BLOOD PRESSURE ANY MORE THAT NIGHT.
*** I hope you wrote that as an order and quoted him word for word.

I did write that as an order. I did repeat the blood pressure. Too bad there wasn't anything I could do about it because I didn't have any orders. I did notice the next day he really changed around his BP meds so at least it was eventually taken care of.

crisis20 · Jul 5, 2007

it really feels embarassing when doc yell at u but what i always my colleagues to do what is professionally right or what is espected of them then any doc cannot yell at them.

if u know your left to right no body can drill u around, but u can report them to the managers of the facility.

keep the spirit high:welcome:

Knoodsen · Jul 6, 2007

My impression is that most physicians are punks. I see a lot of them acting like spoiled children. Some definitely pick on women. Most won't continue their bad behavior if you stand up to them. This can be done in a calm, reasoned fashion. I like to change the subject to something about how I would have thought that the such a smart doctor would have the ability to have a calm, reasoned discussion. "The most educated and highly paid members of the healthcare team should be setting the example, right?" "Wow. You really are loosing control. I may have to call security." (By this time, the doctor's behavior may actually justify physical restraint and medication by force.) I wouldn't want to be an OR nurse. Those surgeons are almost exclusively jerks. Doctors tend to treat ICU nurses better than med-surg ones. They think they're smarter. One of the things that I like about emergency nursing is the close working relationship with our physicians. We get more respect from the attendings and consultants as well, I think. Then there are the individual factors. Do you demonstrate strong professional bearing? Are you well-spoken? Are you smart? Do you work hard? Are you conscientious? Can you justify your actions? If you smell bad or ask stupid questions, then it may be dificult to earn respect. (By the way, ER docs get abused for waking physicians up, too.)

ramboRN, RN · Jul 7, 2007

Hey Guys

I have a standard way I deal with Belittling docs. When a doc corrects me or gives me constructive critism I do not mind as I can always learn. But when a doc feels the need to belittle me. I puff up my chest and respond assertively. " I RESENT YOU TALKING TO ME THAT WAY!" usually they ignore that and keep right on. I persist " I DON'T THINK YOU HEARD ME. I RESENT YOU TALKING TO ME LIKE THAT! I stand my ground until they back down. When the dust clears and time removes emmotions it turns out that these same docs become good friends as they learn that I expect respect. Never Walk Away, Never Back Down. Always Expect to be treated with RESPECT.

iLOVEbees · Jul 9, 2007

Sure some doctors will yell at male nurses.

My advice is to not take any nonsense. If there is a valid point, address the point. If there isn't, stare at them directly without showing any emotion. The point of yelling is to get a reaction. If you withhold this, they'll stop it.

I've never had anyone go completely nuts, but if one did and the above didn't work, I'd calmly say "If you need any more help let me know" and I'd go get a cup of coffee. Then I'd drink it right in front of them, staring at them.

adam90803 · Aug 19, 2007

I am in my last semester of nursing school. I have been in every rotation required over the last few years. The only time I have had a Dr. get "ugly" with me was one time in the Emergency Department. She was a new resident and failed to realize that the RN's where not at her disposal and quickly turned her attitude around and tried playing nice, after she was ignored and walked away from several times during my shift.
The only times I have noticed Dr.'s treating men inappropriately is when the Dr. is a women. Not sure what that is about. I wont put up with it and I don't have to.
Most of the Dr.'s where I am at are friendly and eager to teach when they have time. Everybody has a bad day, so I try not to take it personally.
:monkeydance: see :monkeydance: do!

hell yeah.