I am very new here, and right now only a high school Junior. I was hoping to persue being a NP in my future. although I was shadowing a doctor, and mentioned it to him and he apparently gave me a big lecture about the lack of training they have in the medical field blah blah. He told me to look into PA programs. I went home and checked it out, and I just had a question. Why are NP & PA's on the "same level"? Based on the curriculums and seeing how most PA programs have about the same prereqs as med school and require alot of prior medical experience, it seems that PA's recieve far more thorough and much more medically relevant training then NP's, then I was just wondering, why are PA's looked down apon by NP's? It had been a dream of mine to be an NP for a couple years now, although I am not so sure now, it seems I can just work a little harder to become a PA, but then I don't want to be "less respected" by the people I work with. Any and all opinions will be appreciated. Thanks.
Both models have their strengths although I think Z derides the value of science way too much for my comfort. I have taught both NP and PA students and, in a gross oversimplificiation, would say that the nursing model overemphasizes the psychosocial aspects of patient care at the expense of hard science, while the PA/medical model emphasizes hard science/pathophysiology over the psychosocial.
I don't deride science, it's just that it changes every few years and the biomedical point of view dominates all others. I just prefer the importance of relationship and stories in healing. Course I focus on healing versus curing so we probably differ in our approach. But, I do like science even more now that it's finally catching up to what indigenous peoples knew all along.
I don't deride science, it's just that it changes every few years and the biomedical point of view dominates all others. I just prefer the importance of relationship and stories in healing. Course I focus on healing versus curing so we probably differ in our approach. But, I do like science even more now that it's finally catching up to what indigenous peoples knew all along.
Would you be kind enough to define healing and curing please? Not being sarcastic; I'm genuinely curious. Because as far as I understand, science is moving further and further away from voodoo medicine, not closer to it. I shudder to think how bad the state of medicine would be if shamanistic medicine was predominant.
Would you be kind enough to define healing and curing please? Not being sarcastic; I'm genuinely curious. Because as far as I understand, science is moving further and further away from voodoo medicine, not closer to it. I shudder to think how bad the state of medicine would be if shamanistic medicine was predominant.
In all seriousness, you should genuinely be checking it out. Here's a physician's take on it:
I said that neuroscience was finally catching up to what indigenous people knew long ago, that social experience can alter gene expression, sometimes within minutes. Try studying more than one system. Many physicians have had their world view turned upside down by someone who never heard of a cat scan.
Wow, there are so many things wrong with this statement. Equivalent to 6 years of undergrad. In one year you squeezed in 18 semesters worth of classes (3 semesters equals 1 year). You also had 3 pharm classes (you said one year)? Please give a citation for your curriculum because I've been to NP school and have seen hundreds of plans of study and never have I seen anything like it.
I'm not saying that a PA is always better than an NP, but embellishing does not help your case.
The 6 years was a joke, what I meant was the physical sciences course that built was a nightmare that felt 6 years long. Sorry you misunderstood what I was saying, but I am the last one who would ever discredit any PA. What I meant to say was in the accerlerated program I went to, they condensed the physical sciences down to one class, which was a nightmare for some to get through. Also, I didn't say I took 3 pharm classes. What I said was that our pharm course was 2 semesters long, or one year. Not including the pharm course I took in the RN portion of my program.
I'm also not sure where I said NPs were better than PAs??? I was not trying to embelish anything, only to state that the training for APRNs is quite similiar to PAs. And, with the dozens of PAs I have worked with, we each had our own strengths that we brough to the job, and I would let any one of them care for me. No need for sarcasm, next time just ask me to clarify and I'd be more than happy to.
I'm sorry I misunderstood your post. When you say "equates" instead "feels like" it seems as if you are trying to be factual. Also I see what you mean by the "1 year" but to me you should've said "1 academic year" because I read it as "1 calendar year" which is three semesters. I say I have a year of pharm because I have taken 3 semesters worth in Anesthesia. If you count the RN pharm that is one calendar year, but I thought you meant just in NP school. I find it hard to count that RN pharm anyway since you are being more instructed on it's administration than say isoniazid is a enzyme inhibitor and can have interaction with phenytoin.
I'm not sure where I used sarcasm and I never said that you thought NP was better than PA. You were saying they were equal in hard sciences and I thought you were trying to prove your point by inflating your academics (which now I see you were not).
I'm sorry I misunderstood your post. When you say "equates" instead "feels like" it seems as if you are trying to be factual. Also I see what you mean by the "1 year" but to me you should've said "1 academic year" because I read it as "1 calendar year" which is three semesters. I say I have a year of pharm because I have taken 3 semesters worth in Anesthesia. If you count the RN pharm that is one calendar year, but I thought you meant just in NP school. I find it hard to count that RN pharm anyway since you are being more instructed on it's administration than say isoniazid is a enzyme inhibitor and can have interaction with phenytoin.
I'm not sure where I used sarcasm and I never said that you thought NP was better than PA. You were saying they were equal in hard sciences and I thought you were trying to prove your point by inflating your academics (which now I see you were not).
All good... Probably just another 3am post from work where my eyes are crossed and I think I am typing clearly but it looks like a chicken walked across the page!!
Thank you for your replies. I've been shadowing both NP's & PA's lately and from my (relatively naive) impression after 2 weeks, I agree with Zenman in the I see NP's doing more of what I would define as healing and PA's doing more of "curing." The way I see it, at the end of the day, both help the patient, even while taking different paths to get there. Personally, the more I look into it, I seem to connect more with the medical theory as opposed to the nursing theory, so I will look into PA & MD programs. Although, from my shadowing, I've gained a respect for NP's which I will certainly carry forward.
Hey Zenman, do you think PA is a great field or would you suggest NP way over it?
Yes, PA is a good field. It just depends on what you want mostly. I was already a nurse, had a masters, wanted distance education and ability to work while going to school so I did post-master Psych NP. Plus I wanted all my hours in one area. Before I was a nurse, and after training as a medic, I was looking at PA programs.
2 issues with this discussion:-PA and NP education are in general not equivalent (looking at it as the process, not regarding the product)-What patients NEED and what they WANT are interpendent, and one never completely supercedes the other. I think I know where zenman is coming from based on his posting in this thread, but there are plenty of other zealots that place "patient satisfaction" at the acme, a philsophy that can lead to a path in the wrong direction.
Dixiecup
659 Posts
Why does it make you cringe? It's what we are.