I read this, and even knowing what LTC facilities are like, even I am shocked, and that is saying something.
I work for a 911 dispatch center for EMS in Florida. Last night a recieved a call from and assisted living facility. The person on the phone was asking for lifting assistance for a patient that had fallen on the floor. I then asked if there was a nurse on duty that could come in and help the patient up off the floor. The man told me there was no staff on duty. This was around midnight. Assuming it was the patients roomate suffering from dementia, I called the main line number to the ALF. The same man answered the phone and told me he was the only one there. Of course we sent out an engine to assist the woman and when they got onscene they said there actually was NO staff on duty! The man who answered the phone was a maintenence man.
We promptly sent a deputy over there to see what was going on. The maintenence man explained to him that he was CPR certified and had been authorized to watch the pts for a full two hours every night when there was no staff on duty. The deputy wrote an information report and called us back saying he didnt know enough about nursing home laws to make any criminal charges.
So my question is, is this legal?? Do assisted living facilities have seperate laws than nursing homes do? Is this something I should report? I know if that was my mother and there was no qualified staff on duty for any amount of time at any hour I would be outraged.
Just another note, the deputy was told by the maintenence man that the patients he was supervising were "independent livers" and at low risk of injury during the night. The deputy told me the lady who fell out of bed was 98 years old. And who knows how long she was on the floor. Can she really be an "independent liver" if she was on the floor unable to get herself up?
the concern with what is legal? i dont give a rats ***. (not mad at any person, mad at the asst living facility-- the one mentioned in the original post)). the thing is, it is not right. so i dont care if it is legal or illegal, you know? if nobody would help me or do something decisive, i would call the local news station and sic them on the asst living facility's ***. of course, i guess it gets way more awkward when you learned of the situation while at work, cause i guess if you did "the wrong thing" then it could have implications for your job, which-- cause the whole thing sounds so wrong and extreme--- is unfair to you... am i making any sense? i feel like i am ranting. (sigh). i guess my only real idea here is that probably there is a journalist out there who might want to snag something so newsworthy... if not local then national news program... and it does not have to be trashing just on that facility, but something like: asst living facilities: how safe are your loved ones? its not like you personally would have to be involved at all, other than planting a bug in someones ear. and also-- since there was no one in the building to assist at a building professing to be, oh i dont know, an asst living facility? that has to be somehow a breach of contract (cant contracts be implied,-- like a reasonable expectation, or something? not necessarily just written?) or something. it has to be! (sigh. i would hope, anyway).
the concern with what is legal? i dont give a rats ***. (not mad at any person, mad at the asst living facility-- the one mentioned in the original post)). the thing is, it is not right. so i dont care if it is legal or illegal, you know? if nobody would help me or do something decisive, i would call the local news station and sic them on the asst living facility's ***. of course, i guess it gets way more awkward when you learned of the situation while at work, cause i guess if you did "the wrong thing" then it could have implications for your job, which-- cause the whole thing sounds so wrong and extreme--- is unfair to you... am i making any sense? i feel like i am ranting. (sigh). i guess my only real idea here is that probably there is a journalist out there who might want to snag something so newsworthy... if not local then national news program... and it does not have to be trashing just on that facility, but something like: asst living facilities: how safe are your loved ones? its not like you personally would have to be involved at all, other than planting a bug in someones ear. and also-- since there was no one in the building to assist at a building professing to be, oh i dont know, an asst living facility? that has to be somehow a breach of contract (cant contracts be implied,-- like a reasonable expectation, or something? not necessarily just written?) or something. it has to be! (sigh. i would hope, anyway).
Personally, I am beginning to think that nursing homes should be abolished.
They are so understaffed and the residents needs go unmet so often that they would probably be just as well off at home alone, even if they are unable to help themselves. Sad to say. Maybe a neighbor or someone would drop by once a day to help them, that is probably more than they are going to get at your average LTC facility. :angryfire
Personally, I am beginning to think that nursing homes should be abolished.
They are so understaffed and the residents needs go unmet so often that they would probably be just as well off at home alone, even if they are unable to help themselves. Sad to say. Maybe a neighbor or someone would drop by once a day to help them, that is probably more than they are going to get at your average LTC facility. :angryfire
Specializes in Med/Surg, ER, L&D, ICU, OR, Educator.
Assisted Living is a rather iffy environment. I have seen residents moved in and placed on the assisted-living unit when they clearly should have been on a secured Alzheimer wing on in a skilled-care facility. Why?? They have not been properly evaluated, but the family wants their loved one placed SOMEWHERE with a vacancy.
I suppose some can be "iffy", but what a broad generalization. If a family wants granny placed "somewhere", they are the ones choosing. If skilled care is needed, all AL facilities are not providing it because all do not get liscensed for it. It depends on the liscense you apply for. And a preadmission screening is required for all potential residents (at least in my state) that gives each potential resident a score and classifies them as to how much assistance they will need and how much $ the AL facility will receive each month for providing that care.
They vary greatly. In my small town alone, there are 3 types of facilities that call themselves Assisted Living. One is for pretty independant folks and the services offered are bathing assistance, laundry, med reminders (med tenders are filled weekly), meal service and housekeeping. They all have separate apartments and are not "supervised". They have only a call light to use in emergencies. The second type is more communal, with residents each having their own bedroom, but community bathrooms and dining room. There is 24 hour in house attendance or supervision, but these workers are not liscensed personnel. A RN is required to do supervisory visits (visualize the care being provided) every 60 days. No skilled care is being done, unless a Home Care Nurse is involved on a particular case. The third one is very professional, and liscensed to do skilled care. There is a RN there 5 days/week (and one is always on call), a LPN there 16 hours a day, and CNA's there 24 hours a day. They do tube feedings, intermittent IV meds if needed, dressing changes, etc. It is also quite beautifully furnished, warm and homey. Vast differences, and not iffy at all. Families are told specifically what they can expect, so let's not paint the facilities as being the bad guys here.
Specializes in Med/Surg, ER, L&D, ICU, OR, Educator.
Assisted Living is a rather iffy environment. I have seen residents moved in and placed on the assisted-living unit when they clearly should have been on a secured Alzheimer wing on in a skilled-care facility. Why?? They have not been properly evaluated, but the family wants their loved one placed SOMEWHERE with a vacancy.
I suppose some can be "iffy", but what a broad generalization. If a family wants granny placed "somewhere", they are the ones choosing. If skilled care is needed, all AL facilities are not providing it because all do not get liscensed for it. It depends on the liscense you apply for. And a preadmission screening is required for all potential residents (at least in my state) that gives each potential resident a score and classifies them as to how much assistance they will need and how much $ the AL facility will receive each month for providing that care.
They vary greatly. In my small town alone, there are 3 types of facilities that call themselves Assisted Living. One is for pretty independant folks and the services offered are bathing assistance, laundry, med reminders (med tenders are filled weekly), meal service and housekeeping. They all have separate apartments and are not "supervised". They have only a call light to use in emergencies. The second type is more communal, with residents each having their own bedroom, but community bathrooms and dining room. There is 24 hour in house attendance or supervision, but these workers are not liscensed personnel. A RN is required to do supervisory visits (visualize the care being provided) every 60 days. No skilled care is being done, unless a Home Care Nurse is involved on a particular case. The third one is very professional, and liscensed to do skilled care. There is a RN there 5 days/week (and one is always on call), a LPN there 16 hours a day, and CNA's there 24 hours a day. They do tube feedings, intermittent IV meds if needed, dressing changes, etc. It is also quite beautifully furnished, warm and homey. Vast differences, and not iffy at all. Families are told specifically what they can expect, so let's not paint the facilities as being the bad guys here.
Cruise ship care for elderly? Why not, say experts
Last Updated: 2004-10-27 12:54:05 (Reuters Health)
NEW YORK (Reuters Health) - With some minor adjustments, cruise ships can provide elderly people with every amenity they get from assisted living facilities -- and a lot more fun -- suggest two doctors at Northwestern University in Chicago, Illinois.
"Seniors who enjoy travel, have good or excellent cognitive function, and require some assistance with (activities of daily living) are the ideal candidates for cruise ship care," say Drs. Lee A. Lindquist and Robert M. Golub.
The duo presents a compelling list of arguments in favor of the idea in the Journal of the American Geriatrics Society.
As it stands, cruise ships offer practically the same services older adults receive at assisted living facilities, Lindquist and Golub argue. For instance, ships provide meals, 24-hour access to nurses and physicians, housekeeping and laundry, meal escorts and assistance.
Moreover, cruise ships cost roughly the same amount as assisted living facilities and nursing homes, often in a much nicer setting, they write.
The number of employees on major cruise ship lines is typically one for every two or three passengers -- a much more favorable ratio than that seen in assisted living facilities, they note.
With a little extra training, some of these staffers could easily provide elderly passengers with the help they need in getting around, Lindquist and Golub add. Instead of memorizing pre-dinner drink orders, for instance, dining room staff could keep track of elderly passengers' medications.
Even though cruise ships provide 24-hour access to healthcare workers, elderly residents who need more medical care can disembark at the next port, or get airlifted from the ship.
Ideally, ships would carry both elderly residents and younger passengers going on vacation, which would provide the older adults with a mixed, changing environment that might provide more stimulation and ward off depression, the authors note.
And more relatives might be inclined to visit their older family members if they lived on a cruise ship, they add.
"If this option succeeds, seniors could have a much more enjoyable experience and, for a change, look forward to the time when they become less independent," Lindquist and Golub conclude.
SOURCE: Journal of the American Geriatrics Society, November 2004 .
Cruise ship care for elderly? Why not, say experts
Last Updated: 2004-10-27 12:54:05 (Reuters Health)
NEW YORK (Reuters Health) - With some minor adjustments, cruise ships can provide elderly people with every amenity they get from assisted living facilities -- and a lot more fun -- suggest two doctors at Northwestern University in Chicago, Illinois.
"Seniors who enjoy travel, have good or excellent cognitive function, and require some assistance with (activities of daily living) are the ideal candidates for cruise ship care," say Drs. Lee A. Lindquist and Robert M. Golub.
The duo presents a compelling list of arguments in favor of the idea in the Journal of the American Geriatrics Society.
As it stands, cruise ships offer practically the same services older adults receive at assisted living facilities, Lindquist and Golub argue. For instance, ships provide meals, 24-hour access to nurses and physicians, housekeeping and laundry, meal escorts and assistance.
Moreover, cruise ships cost roughly the same amount as assisted living facilities and nursing homes, often in a much nicer setting, they write.
The number of employees on major cruise ship lines is typically one for every two or three passengers -- a much more favorable ratio than that seen in assisted living facilities, they note.
With a little extra training, some of these staffers could easily provide elderly passengers with the help they need in getting around, Lindquist and Golub add. Instead of memorizing pre-dinner drink orders, for instance, dining room staff could keep track of elderly passengers' medications.
Even though cruise ships provide 24-hour access to healthcare workers, elderly residents who need more medical care can disembark at the next port, or get airlifted from the ship.
Ideally, ships would carry both elderly residents and younger passengers going on vacation, which would provide the older adults with a mixed, changing environment that might provide more stimulation and ward off depression, the authors note.
And more relatives might be inclined to visit their older family members if they lived on a cruise ship, they add.
"If this option succeeds, seniors could have a much more enjoyable experience and, for a change, look forward to the time when they become less independent," Lindquist and Golub conclude.
SOURCE: Journal of the American Geriatrics Society, November 2004 .
I've worked in group homes for MR/DD residents and ISL (individualized supported living, same thing as assisted) homes/apts for years, and it just gets worse by the day, seems like. But reading about LTC here and in the LTC forum simply scares the hell out of me. 1 to 20, 30 or more people? How can the field possibly survive is beyond me!
By all means go to the damned paper and tell them what happened. I loathe 'journalists' with a passion since I used to work as one in college, but tell you what - they can hang on like bulldogs when they smell a rat. Needless to say, legal technicalities aren't something they'd pay attention, and given the mood I'm in today, I couldn't really care either. SOMETHING has to whip the industry into shape sooner or later....nursing homes and the like are inhumane to both residents and employees alike. It's espescially sad as it ruins so many good folks who thought they could make a difference and help people, then a year or three later they've either been turned into evil monsters or semi-catatonic zombies. The smart ones are the ones getting out.....but that's another story altogether.
FWIW - I wouldn't be suprised if its legal somehow, that still doesn't make it right (unless the residents are REALLY self-sufficient, which doesn't appear to be the case).
I've worked in group homes for MR/DD residents and ISL (individualized supported living, same thing as assisted) homes/apts for years, and it just gets worse by the day, seems like. But reading about LTC here and in the LTC forum simply scares the hell out of me. 1 to 20, 30 or more people? How can the field possibly survive is beyond me!
By all means go to the damned paper and tell them what happened. I loathe 'journalists' with a passion since I used to work as one in college, but tell you what - they can hang on like bulldogs when they smell a rat. Needless to say, legal technicalities aren't something they'd pay attention, and given the mood I'm in today, I couldn't really care either. SOMETHING has to whip the industry into shape sooner or later....nursing homes and the like are inhumane to both residents and employees alike. It's espescially sad as it ruins so many good folks who thought they could make a difference and help people, then a year or three later they've either been turned into evil monsters or semi-catatonic zombies. The smart ones are the ones getting out.....but that's another story altogether.
FWIW - I wouldn't be suprised if its legal somehow, that still doesn't make it right (unless the residents are REALLY self-sufficient, which doesn't appear to be the case).
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merricat
138 Posts
the concern with what is legal? i dont give a rats ***. (not mad at any person, mad at the asst living facility-- the one mentioned in the original post)). the thing is, it is not right. so i dont care if it is legal or illegal, you know? if nobody would help me or do something decisive, i would call the local news station and sic them on the asst living facility's ***. of course, i guess it gets way more awkward when you learned of the situation while at work, cause i guess if you did "the wrong thing" then it could have implications for your job, which-- cause the whole thing sounds so wrong and extreme--- is unfair to you... am i making any sense? i feel like i am ranting. (sigh). i guess my only real idea here is that probably there is a journalist out there who might want to snag something so newsworthy... if not local then national news program... and it does not have to be trashing just on that facility, but something like: asst living facilities: how safe are your loved ones? its not like you personally would have to be involved at all, other than planting a bug in someones ear. and also-- since there was no one in the building to assist at a building professing to be, oh i dont know, an asst living facility? that has to be somehow a breach of contract (cant contracts be implied,-- like a reasonable expectation, or something? not necessarily just written?) or something. it has to be! (sigh. i would hope, anyway).