Hi, my only experience is in med-surg nursing, so I was wondering if I could run a possible birth plan by you guys and get professional opinions on it. I kept it short and sweet because I know you guys don't have a lot of time to read an essay:) Also, do most hospitals put the erythromycin ointment in the babies eyes right away? I don't want to go as far as to refuse it, even though I know I'm std neg, but I did want to wait until after I had a chance to do my first feeding before it was applied. Anyway, here is what I have so far...
I would like to have the baby placed on my stomach/chest immediately after delivery.
I would prefer that the umbilical cord stop pulsating before it is cut.
I would like to hold the baby while I deliver the placenta and any tissue repairs are made.
I would like to hold the baby for fifteen minutes before he/she is weighed and measured. I would also prefer the evaluation of the baby be done with the baby on my abdomen.
I plan to breastfeed the baby and would like to begin nursing shortly after birth.
I do not wish to have any bottles given to my baby. If supplements are needed I would prefer syringe or finger feeding.
While I would like minimal interventions, the health of my baby (first) and I (second) are the priorities. Thank you for being here and helping us achieve these goals.
It is a shame that you assume that bottle feeding parents engage in behavior that is neglectful of their babies' safety and developmental needs. That is painting with a pretty broad brush.
I honestly don't know how you could come to that conclusion based on what I have posted. I have posted facts and tried to back things up with personal stories. I haven't slandered any individuals or organizations, and I have said nothing in any of my posts that is negative toward bottle feeders. I actually agreed with the person I was quoting regarding holding a baby while bottle feeding, it was our pediatrician that didn't. I even tried to give that example to back up what I was saying.
I agree with you that babies should be held during each feeding, especially since it promotes eye contact and physical touch. However, this still doesn't mean it's a "bold-faced lie" to claim all babies are encouraged to hold their own bottles..
The book did NOT say bottle fed babies are encouraged to hold their own bottles. It said, "All bottle fed babies will have their bottles "propped" at some time." "Propped" meaning the babe is left in a crib or on the floor next to a wall and the bottle is wedged in some way so that mom/dad can leave the area. THAT phrase is what I referred to as a bold-faced lie. Why? Because of my own personal experience as a bottle-feeding mom, which I would hope the breast feeders would deem to be as important to me and my kids (now in their 30's) as their own feeding experiences are to them.
The intent of the presentation my school partner and I were giving was to compare how nursing supports or does not support whatever choice a mom has made. Even then, when bottle feeding was more popular, the literature or help available to a bottle feeding mom was scarce. And now that breastfeeding is more popular, it's even more so. I feel we as nurses are "encouraged" to support the breast feeding mom far more than the bottle feeding mom, and in some cases, there are extremists who deliver sermons to the moms who aren't yet decided and even to the ones who are. This is wrong.
If breastfeeding is not established within the first few days (and many give it weeks), a baby will not latch on.
Really? Because I see a lot of babies in the NICU that go from being NPO for the first few days of life, then going to gavage feeds, then going to PO bottle feeds, then going and latching on and breastfeeding. The breastfeeding obviously isn't in the first few days.
Really? Because I see a lot of babies in the NICU that go from being NPO for the first few days of life, then going to gavage feeds, then going to PO bottle feeds, then going and latching on and breastfeeding. The breastfeeding obviously isn't in the first few days.
We have nurse who came to the US from Korea about 30 years ago and when she left there, the standard practice was for babies to stay in the nurseries, without contact with their mothers at all, for the entire hospital stay (5 days I think she told us) and when they went home, guess what? they all breast fed.
One has to choose just how far onto a bandwagon you want to sit.
We have nurse who came to the US from Korea about 30 years ago and when she left there, the standard practice was for babies to stay in the nurseries, without contact with their mothers at all, for the entire hospital stay (5 days I think she told us) and when they went home, guess what? they all breast fed.
One has to choose just how far onto a bandwagon you want to sit.
As someone else already mentioned - our Hispanic moms do not breastfeed in the hospital, they bottle feed. But they do go home to start breastfeeding and at follow up are doing well.
Anyone, on any side of this issue, just can't make generalizations.
And moms need our support, regardless of their choice.
As someone else already mentioned - our Hispanic moms do not breastfeed in the hospital, they bottle feed. But they do go home to start breastfeeding and at follow up are doing well.
Anyone, on any side of this issue, just can't make generalizations.
And moms need our support, regardless of their choice.
steph
Our Hispanic moms do both while still in the hospital. We are charged to be culturally aware and supportive, yet are told to make sure all the moms are "educated" about how breast is the only thing. Those two things cannot be done at the same time.
Moms do need our support, and I applaud you putting it so succintly. I am not for or against one or the other. But I REFUSE to preach to a mom who obviously is uncomfortable for whatever reason that she should breast feed. That is totally ignoring 1/2 of the picture, the mom, and being browbeaten (and I've seen new moms in tears because someone told them they were a Bad Mom) could lead to poor bonding. Believe me, bonding can and does occur with bottle babies and their moms:)
Our Hispanic moms do both while still in the hospital. We are charged to be culturally aware and supportive, yet are told to make sure all the moms are "educated" about how breast is the only thing. Those two things cannot be done at the same time.
Moms do need our support, and I applaud you putting it so succintly. I am not for or against one or the other. But I REFUSE to preach to a mom who obviously is uncomfortable for whatever reason that she should breast feed. That is totally ignoring 1/2 of the picture, the mom, and being browbeaten (and I've seen new moms in tears because someone told them they were a Bad Mom) could lead to poor bonding. Believe me, bonding can and does occur with bottle babies and their moms:)
I agree with you . . . . and I've been to all the breastfeeding classes where there is a tendency to be a little militant about it. I have to admit to "manning" a table at one conference with a friend and we both breastfed our sons. Of course, we didn't unveil ourselves . ..
However, I won't make a woman feel bad about not choosing to nurse her child.
And I encourage a mom to go with her birth plan - explaining, as I think we have all done on this thread, that things do not usually go exactly as planned. And if that is in your birth plan, all the better.
It can be very easy for any of us to assume that because one thing has been OUR experience that it must be that way for everyone, and it isn't.
It seems to me that a big indicator of whether a mom will be successful at breastfeeding is whether or not she gets support from somewhere - culture, family, LLL, wherever. Our Hispanic moms breastfeed successfully because it's the norm in Hispanic culture. Someone else mentioned Korean moms. Ditto. They receive support, and it's expected that they will. I breastfed successfully, not because of a lactation consultant (I never saw one), but because my family supported me at home.
I want to clarify here that nobody here has anything against LLL. What a lot of people have a problem with is fanaticism. I think we've all seen people on both sides of ANY issue stretch the truth a little to promote their side. I've seen some wonderful LLL members who are great resources, and I've seen some who I want to run the other way from because they can come across as too militant. But you can find this issue with circ vs. no circ, hospital vs. homebirth, Republican vs. Democrat, or Pepsi vs. Coke. Really.
We have strong feelings but that doesn't make any of us bad people. And we all would support a breastfeeding mother. Agreed?
Thanks, Arwen. and as an aside, although I love Roy Williams, it's Rock Chalk Jayhawk for me!
I also would like to add that when any group, such as LLL, which does a lot of good, begins to publicize all the stuff that can go bad, the emphasis goes from "I'm going to breast feed" to "this isn't going to work and I'm going to have trouble and I need a lactation consultant" and on and on and on. We're emphasizing the negative so much that it becomes a much bigger problem than it really is. JMHO, of course.
The emphasis goes from "I'm going to breast feed" to "this isn't going to work and I'm going to have trouble and I need a lactation consultant" and on and on and on. We're emphasizing the negative so much that it becomes a much bigger problem than it really is. JMHO, of course.
Yes, yes, yes.
One of the first things I tell any parent is to assume that BFing is going to work, because it does. I think this is a big difference between the US and other cultures - most other cultures assume breastfeeding is going to work and so don't get worked up about it. They just do it. I see American women more frequently than I'd like who want the lactation consultant in there every single time they put baby to breast.
Edited to add: TNT, I was SOOOOO glad the day they got rid of Doherty & put Roy at the helm. He don't take no crap, and he wins games.
i want to clarify here that nobody here has anything against lll. what a lot of people have a problem with is fanaticism. i think we've all seen people on both sides of any issue stretch the truth a little to promote their side. i've seen some wonderful lll members who are great resources, and i've seen some who i want to run the other way from because they can come across as too militant. but you can find this issue with circ vs. no circ, hospital vs. homebirth, republican vs. democrat, or pepsi vs. coke. really.
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:yeahthat::yelclap::yeahthat:
i had the only baby in my lll group that slept in his own bed, while his 2 year old brother ate kraft mac'n'cheese and drank bottled apple juice instead of homemade veggie soup and home baked 7 grain bread!!:hrnsmlys:
take what you can use, ignore the rest (sweetly).....
they both are perfectly healthy grown men, and my bottle fed grandson (not my baby, not my choice!!) is a full tilt three year old whirlwind (even if he does seem to live on cheerios, banana, and chicken nuggets:uhoh21:)
Of course, we didn't unveil ourselves . .. 
kythe, LPN
262 Posts
I honestly don't know how you could come to that conclusion based on what I have posted. I have posted facts and tried to back things up with personal stories. I haven't slandered any individuals or organizations, and I have said nothing in any of my posts that is negative toward bottle feeders. I actually agreed with the person I was quoting regarding holding a baby while bottle feeding, it was our pediatrician that didn't. I even tried to give that example to back up what I was saying.
I'm not sure what else I can say.