Did the title catch your attention? Good, I was hoping it would.
I've seen people talk about this attitude on allnurses quite a bit, and I find the reactions fascinating. I'm amazed at the passion, care and professionalism of the nurses on this board and really about every nurse I've ever met.
BUT, everyone-from the most seasoned nurse to the student- knows that nursing is changing and will probably continue to change dramatically over the years to come. There are CNAs and MAs who seem to have an increasing role in the healthcare system and nurses themselves have more responsibility (all the charting etc.) and demanding jobs as new diseases, new medicines and standards of care make their way into our lives.
My question is, do you think their should be a change in what nurses do? Will there come a time when basic hygiene and certain other tasks often done by nurses in the past will be the responsibility of CNAs and others in similar roles? Would this be a good thing for nurses? Is there really anything wrong with nurses who feel that four years of education + all of their other demands and responsibilities should mean that they shouldn't have to do these tasks?
Oh boy not again! When will nurses stop trying to put themselves up just a bit higher than someone else by sidelining a smelly job as one that anyone can do. Yup you do need education for the job its one of humilility and willingness to help another in distress and a knowledge of infection control and promotion of dignity.
My first ward....pt returns to ward mid physiotherapy post stroke because he needed the toilet!! Were there no toilets on the physio dept ,perhaps no one had any hands to help him there. Were there no people with brains on the physio dept able to work out how to wipe his bum. By the time the pt came half way across the hospital to go to the toilet he...you guessed it he had been in his pants!
He found it scary to go to physio again. Surely the physio had a role in teaching him how to get on the loo safely and before he had an accident.
Pray God theres enough Cna.s around if nurses reach the dizzy heights of "no bum wipes physio and other paramedics"
Mad Cecilea
If no ones around you gotta do it even if you are a doctor.
hi i am a cna and a nursing student in wv.. during our training i came across alot of rn's & lpns that had the same attitude as yours. i now work in a nursing home, with a much better staff than where i took my cna course. here cnas are responsible for the charting, feeding, mouth care, showers, nourishments, clean catheters, nasal canal & feeding tubes, emptying catheters, transporting res., dressing the res. getting up & putting down the res., i & o charting, nail care, changing the resident, shaving, making the beds, filling & passing out ice pitchers, assisting our lpns & rn's & the list does go on. also ,on top of that any extra tasks our lpn or rn delegates. our lpns & rn's are happy to help out whenever there is a need. i have seen them yes wipe butts & give mouth care as well as clean fingernails. i have also seen our administrative nurses stop in there busy day to help out whenever needed. you need to remember the patients needs come first. maybe i am lucky to work at a place that we do have team work. anyway, i do realize that you have had 4 years of training & i respect that, in the nursing world you think a person would choose this career to help others who maybe can't help thereselves? maybe i am wrong this is just the way i feel. hopefully i won't get that kid of attitude when i finish nursing school. if you don't like resident/patient contact or if you think you are above that, then maybe you should choose another profession.
Research supports better outcomes for patients with more RN's at the bedside. It amazes me they had to do a study to realize this. What scares me is that my hospital seems decades behind, they are hiring more aids and techs when other hospitals are moving in the opposite direction.
Sue
Hello,
I am a student nurse extern and know that we have to wipe butts sometimes. However, we should realize that the current flow is to the magnet status hospitals. For example our school is weeding out LPN program because most of our hospitals will no hire LPN's. Currently the hospitals are moving toward only RN's giving direct care, which means we will be wiping a lot more butts in the future :) Btw the hospital I work at has no CNA's and only a few LPN's. Within 5 years they hope to have only RN's on the floor.
I just figure that one day I may need wiping up and I don't care what their title is. If there's a backside needing to be cleaned and I am there and others are busy I'll do it. On the other hand I wouldn't seek it out but sometimes you're just the one who's on hand and what's the big deal? I just know I could leave anyone soiled and uncomfortable. One day in a dementia ward one of the men had soiled and done some decorating, bed rails sheets everything, We had to strip and clean him and the bed up. The charge nurse gloved up and got stuck into the job with me. The worst job though that I have ever had to do was empty sputum mugs. After those open bowels are nothing.
I have a little different perspective working in a ICU. We do everything for our patients, wiping butt, everything..... In fact, going straight for nursing school to the CCU- I do not even know how to do a complete and continuing assessment of a patient without doing everything including their bath and butt, and everything. I mean, it is very improtant to see what the poo looks like, and how their backside is doing. And with our pts, they can't just be flipped over to be wiped willy-nilly. So I appreciate that part of the job, as long as it is say-- no more than three poos a day. Then I stop appreciating it so much. But for me, it is a crucial part of my job, and I feel priviledged that is so.
Specializes in Med/surg,orthopedics,emergency room,.
You know, I am going to get on my soapbox about this because this really irritates me. Okay, first off, just because you ARE a nurse that doesn't give you the right to think that you have too much education to perform patient care, and all you should do is dictate to others and do paperwork. I'm not sure why you came into nursing,but nursing isn't about the paperwork. Too many nurses today feel they are above and beyond performing patient care, and simple nursing tasks, that we want to turf it 'meanial ' jobs to someone else. When I work and someone's call light goes off, IF I don't see the CNA,in the immediate area I'll go and see what the patient wants, and yes I have had my share of empyting bed pans and cleanig pateint up, and to be honest with you, I didn't find it demeaning to my education, and it made me feel more connected with my patients,(when I'm doing hands on care) I have seen nurses go into a patients room, just to come out and hunt DOWN a CNA to change a patient, or give them water, etc. That's not right, and it's not fair. What is so wrong with all of us helping each other out to make ALL of our jobs easier?
Let us not forget that while wiping those backsides, we have an excellent opportunity for a skin assessment. How many of us have picked up a developing pressure ulcer while doing routine hygiene and were able to intervene before there was a major problem? I've always thought going in to take care of those "code browns" is also an opportunity to see what's going on underneath.
My pants immediately bunched when I saw the title of this thread. I'm a CNA/Nursing Student (07 BSN Grad). I feel that a nurse all patient care is your responsibilty, from charting, med pass, communication, feeding and yes wiping behinds. CNA' can't be held solely responsible, why? Because really there is no patient vs. CNA ratio. Often times a CNA can have anywhere from 6 - 12 patients. There's no way that CNA could be everywhere at everytime a patient needs to be cleaned. That CNA has to deal dressing and cleaning contracted patients, showers, bed baths, feeding, vitals, blood sugars. And mutiply that by 12. Care of patients is the responsibilty of all nursing staff. We didn't got to school to only to the glamorous part of nursing. We went to provide the best possible care and give our patients the utmost respect without comprimising there dignity.
RN2bKatie said that patient may not view a nurse the same, after the patient has witnessed them giving there meds and cleaning them up. I totally disagree, the patient will respect you more. Why, because you took the the time to make them feel better in a situation that's already hard for them. Think how hard, and maybe embarassing, it would be for you to not be able to clean yourself. You'd be extremly grateful to the person that did it for you. It's called a complete realm of nursing.
We didn't got to school to only to the glamorous part of nursing. We went to provide the best possible care and give our patients the utmost respect without comprimising there dignity.
Did the title catch your attention? Good, I was hoping it would.
I've seen people talk about this attitude on allnurses quite a bit, and I find the reactions fascinating. I'm amazed at the passion, care and professionalism of the nurses on this board and really about every nurse I've ever met.
BUT, everyone-from the most seasoned nurse to the student- knows that nursing is changing and will probably continue to change dramatically over the years to come. There are CNAs and MAs who seem to have an increasing role in the healthcare system and nurses themselves have more responsibility (all the charting etc.) and demanding jobs as new diseases, new medicines and standards of care make their way into our lives.
My question is, do you think their should be a change in what nurses do? Will there come a time when basic hygiene and certain other tasks often done by nurses in the past will be the responsibility of CNAs and others in similar roles? Would this be a good thing for nurses? Is there really anything wrong with nurses who feel that four years of education + all of their other demands and responsibilities should mean that they shouldn't have to do these tasks?
The part that bothers me the most is "they shouldn't have to do these tasks." Nursing is about more than giving drugs that ultimately do more harm than good. Nursing is about touching, healing, and caring. Healing and caring involve making the patient comfortable. If a nurse is busy with another patient and another patient needs a clean up, I don't care who does it. I feel nursing has totally lost the pulse of what nurses do and why they entered a healing profession in the first place. If you don't want to wipe butts, then teach or manage. Patient care is the heart of nursing and always should be so. Patient care is not more procedures and more drugs to keep people quiet or to satisfy the need to "do" something to justify the huge costs in medical care. Do you know what the number 3 (the Life Extension Foundation says number one) cause of death is in the United States? Western medicine. NSAIDS alone kill 30,000 people a year. Great Britain has come out saying our ridiculous drug company invented "normal" cholesterol levels are going to kill more people with treatment than they save from heart disease. Here's where the madness is, and nursing is worried about who wipes butts. Sheesh.
I always try to put my patients needs first. I will admit that there are times though, when to a patients family it may look like I'm sitting at the desk doing "nothing", but I may be looking at critical lab values and determining course of action or taking orders from a doctor over the phone, or writing orders so that I can scan them to pharmacy and get an urgent medication. If a family member has approached me at the desk and I truly can not assist them at the moment, I will usually apologize later. Most are pretty understanding. What floors me is nurses that wont put their personal phone call on hold to answer a buzzer, another phone call or to deal with a patient or family requesting assistance. Nothing like having someone standing at the desk, waiting for you to finish your story so that you can assist them (even if it is to get a box of tissues from the supply room).
Sue
well here is a great case in point from TODAY!!!
i was helping a nurse transfer a pt via bed to another floor in the hospital. while in route i got a page.."pt needs to use bathroom." i also got two other pages. i get back to the floor and literally ran from room to room changing pts, took pt to restroom, then when i went to my last room, the daughter of pt was upset because her mom needed to use the restroom. no one came. she ended up wetting the bed then her daughter put her on the bsc. twice she went out to talk to her mom's nurse at the desk and pleaded with her to come and get her mom off of the bsc. didn't happen! so now i come in clean up pt and apologized. pt's family said they knew i was busy because she SAW me running room to room. she thanked me and i apologized again, but she said she understood that i was busy, but that her mom's nurse was just sitting at the desk (she said she was standing in the hall watching her, that's how she saw me running room to room). NOW THIS IS WHAT BUGS ME!!!!!!! she asked to speak with the charge nurse...the charge nurse came in and said "well it's not the nurses job to put pt on bsc or take off!!!":angryfire
and this is my problem!! since when is pt care not a nurses job! like i said in a previous post, if it does not require a license somehow nurses think it is not their job. i know i can not change minds, especially as a lowly cna, but one day i intend to try and make changes. not for me, i'm not lazy, i've worked hard my whole life. however, i love taking care of patients, and for my patients and all patients this has got to end. PUT THE PT FIRST!!
i expect all nurses to give the best care. and that means wiping a butt or two. if you are a nurse that has left a pt like this i say shame on you and i hope that one day you realize the harm you cause. this is the same kind of nurse that "stands watch" when a loved one of theirs is in the hospital and ends up driving the staff crazy. forcing the staff to follow every procedure by the textbook because they "know how patients are treated in the hospital." (yeah one of their pts maybe!)
Cecilea
16 Posts
Oh boy not again! When will nurses stop trying to put themselves up just a bit higher than someone else by sidelining a smelly job as one that anyone can do. Yup you do need education for the job its one of humilility and willingness to help another in distress and a knowledge of infection control and promotion of dignity.
My first ward....pt returns to ward mid physiotherapy post stroke because he needed the toilet!! Were there no toilets on the physio dept ,perhaps no one had any hands to help him there. Were there no people with brains on the physio dept able to work out how to wipe his bum. By the time the pt came half way across the hospital to go to the toilet he...you guessed it he had been in his pants!
He found it scary to go to physio again. Surely the physio had a role in teaching him how to get on the loo safely and before he had an accident.
Pray God theres enough Cna.s around if nurses reach the dizzy heights of "no bum wipes physio and other paramedics"
Mad Cecilea
If no ones around you gotta do it even if you are a doctor.
:angryfire