How is this fair?????????

[jg11785]

I was wondering how many of you had to or have to take an exit exam (HESI,ATI, ect) In order to graduate from nursing school??? Me as well as many other students in my class right now have known this was the protocal now since we started nursing school. I am a straight A student and I am gearing to graduate in May. Now..... The problem with the school comes in when we are one month from graduating and we get an email from the school saying they changed the percentage required to pass the ATI exit in order to graduate. It went from a 64% to a 74%. How is that fair??? According to the administration the state boards have changed as of March of 2008 and therefore the ATI had to be changed to????? I don't understand how one month from graduation this can happen???? Oh yea and you can only fail one class. If you fail two you are permnantly kicked out of school!!! The exit ATI is linked to a class so if you fail it and retake the class it is attached to then you fail again you are permanantly out of the program and done forever!!!!! That means 15,000 dollars down the drain. How is that fair if you pass all the classes with an "A" average????? Some of us are raising a coniption and before we do this, we just want to see if we are alone in this????? Please respond. Does your school require an exit score to graduate or are you permnantly kicked out if you fail?????

[mountainnurse]

My school has integrated the ATI tests into our core classes as our final exams. We had to take the comprehensive ATI before graduating and pass with a 95% probability rate of passing NCLEX (I think this translates somewhere in the high 60% range). If we pass we are placed in a two week review course and if we don't pass we are placed in a month long review course for the NCLEX. Ultimately they are preparing you for taking your boards and I am grateful for that. However, I do think it is unfair of them to change the requirements on you so late in the game.

If you have not already taken this test I recommend studying from the Saunders NCLEX review book. This is how I studied for all of the tests and I did very well on all of them and passed the BKAT (critical care general knowledge test) for the hospital I will be employed at after graduation. Good luck, at this point complaining may not get you too far, so I would start preparing so you will do well.

[Lovely_RN, MSN]

This was also made a requirement in my program after the fact. At first the ATI was introduced as a way to study and then all of a sudden we were obligated to pass the test to graduate!

Nope it wasn't fair but truthfully the exams really aren't that difficult. The focused ATI are a little difficult but the proctored exams are not very hard.

It's not fair to change the rules mid-semester but I have to question what a student has learned if they cannot pass the ATI with at least a 75%

[locolorenzo22, BSN, RN]

We get 3 chances to pass, but aren't even sure which system we're using....We either pass in 3 or we fail the entire semester and have to come back next year...It was given to us in a quickly rushed through addendum for our handbooks, and we were told to sign and give back acknowledgements...when I thought about refusing, I was told "oh, no big deals for you guys..." NO, it is a big deal....

Last year, students who failed 3 times only had to show enrollment in a nclex review class and they got their paperwork sent off...Now we are changed because of the high number of first time failures....go figure, it just seems like my class gets the changes in the middle of everything....ARGGHGHH.....

ok, 6 more months to go....

[O2WSW, ADN]

I just graduated this month and my school used the ATI tests. We took them on different subjects each semester and the graduate predictor near the end of the program. We had to take all of them in order to graduate, but they did not have any impact on our grades. It was more or less our responsibility to take the information from the tests, and to see what areas we were weak in to study for NCLEX.

I don't think that changing the passing rate ten percent is fair to your class. And being out of the program for good after two failures - wow! I thought my school was bad with two failures you had to wait two years, then reapply.

Well, the best of luck to you and to to your classmates!

[Daytonite, BSN, RN]

hello, jg11785, fellow buckeye, and welcome to allnurses! :welcome:

there has been concern in the nursing profession for some time that students coming out of nursing schools were sadly lacking in critical thinking and problem solving skills. a number of tests have been developed to try to bring out problems with this. ati and hesi are two of them. another is the pbds (performance based development system) which is a test that was developed for new graduates and is often used by facilities to test the critical thinking skills of nurses who are already licensed and just hired at new jobs.

i think that this is going to become an industry standard as time goes on because of the complexities of rn work. the test writers are working to standardize and evaluate the test takers ability to think and reason out problems which is what an rn must be able to do on their job. this is because each school focuses on critical thinking and problem solving differently. all those care plans, nursing process and problem solving exercises you have been doing all through nursing school is really what nursing school is ultimately about. learning the technical hands-on skills are just the fluff. as a licensed rn your value is going to be your ability to problem solve, not put in foley catheters and start ivs, although these are also important things. they can get lpns to do them. ati also provides test result feedback to the schools and boards of nursing and advises on areas where there is weakness or strength. this is to help each program buff up their curriculum where it is weak. again, this is to help schools reach the level of attaining standardized teaching goals.

i get that you are upset and worried. the best thing you can do for yourself is to periodically review what the nursing process is. it is a problem solving method that you must know. chapter 5 of saunders comprehensive review for the nclex-rn examination, 3rd edition, by linda anne silvestri pretty much defines what goes into answering a nclex question, which is a critical thinking, problem solving type of question. what you have to provide is the background information to be able to answer these questions. that's all those pre-requisite courses you took that contribute some information to the understanding of the underlying pathophysiology of what is going on with a patient's disease. you also need to know how a doctor goes about testing for and diagnosing specific medical diseases and why they order the treatments and medications they do. you need to understand that they primarily treat the patient's symptoms and, when possible, the underlying cause of the disease. as nurses, we assess the patient as well and we also independently treat those symptoms and responses to illness that the patient's exhibit. these are important points that you must know by the time you finish school. and, you must know how all these pieces fit together when trying to solve a problem that comes up. that is partly why you are asked to write care plans. it is a start at learaning the process of problem solving. in reality, on the job, you are problem solving every minute of your working time.

and, because new grads across the country are just not able to handle this critical thinking and problem solving business at their new jobs is why you are having to undergo this testing. my advice is to do your best to prepare yourself as i have suggested and you should come through this ok. ati also publishes study manuals for these tests. you might want to invest in one. they are listed on their website.

as for you school's rules. . .that is something the school has deemed it must do. some schools are very nurturing and take struggling students in hand and work with them. with others, it's a sink or swim proposition. you really have no control over it. the powers in charge hold the reins. when they say "jump!" you can only respond with "how high?"

[SusanKathleen, RN]

Wonderful post, as usual Daytonite.

This change in standards is not happening just in nursing. It is happening in education, which I am leaving now to go into nursing. On the Federal level, it's called 'No Child Left Behind'. Many newer teachers were coming in less prepared, or not prepared well enough, and additionally, many, many teachers were being placed (by administrators) into positions they were not qualified to teach - this seemed to be the worst at the middle school level.

Many teachers were outraged when this became law, but in hindsight, it IS better for the kids. Teachers did at least have time to adjust, and get proper credentials in place by getting a major in their area of expertise, or else were placed into the subject area they were actually qualified/certified for.

Changing times can be difficult, but you can get through it by making sure you keep up all along the way. It is harsh to find out about a killer test right before it must be taken. I hope you can find some comfort in knowing that your post will alert those of us that are coming up behind you. So I thank you for that!