How would you compare your undergrad/grad nursing experience?

SteveNNP, MSN, NP · Apr 30, 2008

I'm not sure if my BSn program was just super-rigorous or what. I'm finding that my Ivy League grad program so far (basically core classes and general sciences) are less detailed, less demanding, and far more lenient, especially as far as APA format. Undegrad, if you messed up your APA, it was major points off. Here, it doesn't seem to get docked.

I'm sure this fall when I start neonatal didactic/clinicals, and my class size drops to 5, it'll get a lot rougher.

yellow finch, BSN, RN · Apr 30, 2008

I find grad school to be challenging but not impossible. Take, for instance, Theory. Our class expanded upon what was taught in undergrad where we broke down theories to the nitty gritty then devised our own personal practice framework which we now use in our expanded SOAP notes.

Research wasn't just about looking at research papers. We had to take papers apart piece by piece in order to thoroughly understand how evidence based practice affects advanced practice.

Attending to patients is more comprehensive as well but I'm sure you knew that already. Charting has to be accurate and encompassing in order to make the right dx and differentials.

Granted, theory and perspectives are a bit of a waste of time for a clinically focused degree but who's going to change that?

I'm definitely spending a lot more time studying and documenting for grad school compared to undergrad.

Oh, and I'm not attending an Ivy League school.

llg, PhD, RN · Apr 30, 2008

I found graduate school to be much, much easier and more fun than my undergraduate program. I went to a very rigorous private university for my undergraduate degree -- and the process of education was very stressful, designed to "weed out" those who were not worthy. For my MSN, it was assumed we were basically competent nurses who just wanted to learn more, become better, and prepare to be leaders.

My PhD program was my favorite. It was a blend of the other 2 approaches. It was rigorous and there was a "weeding out" process to be able to be considered among the elite scholars of the discipline ... but it was assumed that we were all competent leaders and the atmosphere was that it was fun to be exploring such sophisticated material in-depth.

BChapp3182 · May 19, 2008

I find grad school to be very difficult, way more than undergrad. My class started with 36 people, we are down to 8 people and still have a year to go. It's way, harder. I go to a private university, not sure if it's Ivy League or not. My school acts like they want you to fail. Tests are only 25 questions, so miss 3 and you fail. There are only 2 tests the whole semester. It's so easy for smart people to fail! Many very smart nurses flunked out. We have to do perfect APA, attend confrences, serve as research assistants, perform community service in addition to regular clinicals, have at least one paper and one presentation due every semester. Plus we have to locate our own clinical sites. It's soooo much information to learn. I don't think it's anything like being an RN.

Had I known better I would have never gone to my school and would have gone to a public university instead. I've talked with students there and they have it so easy, even make their own test questions. But on the flip side I was in my first clinical with a public univ. student who was in her last clinical and I knew more than her. So, you will learn but with the failure rate is unjust.

JaimeeG · May 24, 2008

My BSN program was cake. I currently attend a state university FNP program, and it's not bad. Research was a bit tough and time consuming, and the thesis work is extremely detailed. I have found the biggest difference to be that in grad school we are expected to be very self-motivated and self-sufficient. There is little direction given for papers and such, and we are expected to be APA experts by this point. Every instructor I have had so far has been super picky about APA. I have discovered that what I thought was correct APA, from my BSN program, was totally wrong!

Of my ADN, BSN, and now grad school, the ADN program was probably the toughest. My instructors were the most demanding and rigid. Grad school is probably the most time-consuming and definitely has the most hoops to jump through.

Jaimee

Spacklehead, MSN, NP · May 24, 2008

I guess from the various replies you can see that it kind of depends on where you go to school.

I am completeing my MSN at the same school where I did my BSN, and I have found that the MSN program is both easier and more difficult than the BSN program. Confusing? Let me explain.

I find the MSN program easier because I already have knowledge of the basic concepts and terminology, as well as a basic understanding of various disease processes, so things don't appear so foreign to me. Plus, it is much more interesting to me now because all of my courses deal specifically with nursing - no more general ed requirements like philosophy and ancient history which I totally was not in to as an undergrad. Plus, now I feel like I have the desire to learn so much more since I am no longer 17 - 21 years old and looking to go out and have a good time.

I find the MSN progam to be more difficult, though, due to the amount of work I need to do and the amount of time I need to devote to clinicals. One thing I have found (at least is my program) is that you absolutely can not get behind in the assigned readings because there is just so much information to learn and absorb. Plus, our finals are cumulative so I need to make sure I retain the info I learn. Also, plan on spending many hours doing research, writing papers, and preparing presentations. I can easily say that in each class so far (I have one year left to go), I have had at least 4-6 papers, 3-4 exams, and at least one presentation. Also, my professors have been very strict regarding APA format and using current (within the past 3 years) research for writing papers.

I must say, even though we have a lot of papers to write, they have definitely contributed to my education in a huge way due to all of the research I have had to do to write them. In a weird kind of way I am actually thankful for attending a tough MSN program.

My list of "do's" and "don'ts" for you:

1. Don't neglect or fall behind in your readings.

2. Don't leave papers and assignments to the last minute.

3. Don't purge your brain of the info you studied after you take one exam - you will need that info somewhere along the lines later on.

4. Don't forget about family and friends.

1. Do take advantage of study groups, if possible.

2. Do try to find at least one person in your class who you can become friendly with - it definitely helps when you know someone who is in the same boat as you who you can talk to and provide support for each other, as well as providing an ear for listening or for venting.

3. Do try to read ahead or start projects early, since this can only help you.

4. Do establish a decent relationship with your professors - they are there to assist you and are wonderful sources of information and guidance.

5. Do set aside some time to have somewhat of a social life - you will need time where school is not the only thing on your mind.

CardioTrans, BSN, RN · Jun 20, 2008

I guess from the various replies you can see that it kind of depends on where you go to school.
I am completeing my MSN at the same school where I did my BSN, and I have found that the MSN program is both easier and more difficult than the BSN program. Confusing? Let me explain.
I find the MSN program easier because I already have knowledge of the basic concepts and terminology, as well as a basic understanding of various disease processes, so things don't appear so foreign to me. Plus, it is much more interesting to me now because all of my courses deal specifically with nursing - no more general ed requirements like philosophy and ancient history which I totally was not in to as an undergrad. Plus, now I feel like I have the desire to learn so much more since I am no longer 17 - 21 years old and looking to go out and have a good time.
I find the MSN progam to be more difficult, though, due to the amount of work I need to do and the amount of time I need to devote to clinicals. One thing I have found (at least is my program) is that you absolutely can not get behind in the assigned readings because there is just so much information to learn and absorb. Plus, our finals are cumulative so I need to make sure I retain the info I learn. Also, plan on spending many hours doing research, writing papers, and preparing presentations. I can easily say that in each class so far (I have one year left to go), I have had at least 4-6 papers, 3-4 exams, and at least one presentation. Also, my professors have been very strict regarding APA format and using current (within the past 3 years) research for writing papers.
I must say, even though we have a lot of papers to write, they have definitely contributed to my education in a huge way due to all of the research I have had to do to write them. In a weird kind of way I am actually thankful for attending a tough MSN program.
My list of "do's" and "don'ts" for you:
1. Don't neglect or fall behind in your readings.
2. Don't leave papers and assignments to the last minute.
3. Don't purge your brain of the info you studied after you take one exam - you will need that info somewhere along the lines later on.
4. Don't forget about family and friends.
1. Do take advantage of study groups, if possible.
2. Do try to find at least one person in your class who you can become friendly with - it definitely helps when you know someone who is in the same boat as you who you can talk to and provide support for each other, as well as providing an ear for listening or for venting.
3. Do try to read ahead or start projects early, since this can only help you.
4. Do establish a decent relationship with your professors - they are there to assist you and are wonderful sources of information and guidance.
5. Do set aside some time to have somewhat of a social life - you will need time where school is not the only thing on your mind.

:yeahthat:

Spacklehead, MSN, NP · Jun 20, 2008

OMG Cardio!!! How the heck are you???!!!! I've missed you!

marachne · Jun 20, 2008

I am in a BS to PhD program, so my answer may not relate...that said, the few masters level courses I have taken have not been that much more arduous than the undergrad classes. The PhD classes/program has been another kettle of fish. First of all I have to say that I LOVE being in a PhD program. I love being immersed in the world of ideas and the discourse that goes with it. The conversations and discussions can be so exciting! I love what my adviser once said to me: "Working on your PhD is the only time where the main activity that is expected of you is to think." It feels quite indulgent and luxurious...if deep thinking is something that gets you excited. The hard part is the lack of structure. Yes, while I was in core courses there was some structure, and I even had a couple of exams, but mostly it's a matter of "this is the general context, now figure out something related to it and your area of interest, research it, synthesize it, and write it up in a logical, concise way that adds to the discussion." A heck of a lot easier to say than do! Also, once you get to dissertation phase, the only structure is that which you create for yourself -- procrastination (like writing here) is a mine field. You will only progress as fast as you push yourself, and it is a bit of a shock to suddenly not have the regular company of that tight group of people who were/are your cohort (or, as a friend of mine puts it, "litter mates.")

Finally, there are a lot of hoops to jump through, and while it helps to have milestones, sometimes they feel like so much nonsense. And the intensity of getting that point is often met with deflation afterwards when you realize that you're not done, you just have to work on the next hoop (even defending your dissertation isn't the end point, 'cause there's always edits to do).

Having watched some people come into the program and leave, I have to say that doctoral education is not for everyone, and it's ok to realize that and call it quits if it isn't working for you. The career path isn't a bed of roses either -- teaching has a large learning curve and no clear delineation of work/nonwork time. Research is even worse as you are always thinking about how to get the next project funded as you're working on this one. Frankly, if I don't get paperwork in for a post-doc in time, I'm thinking of taking some time off after I'm done and just doing some clinical work for the break of being able to leave my job at the end of the day.

Sorry to have gone on so long. I'm really glad to be doing what I'm doing, but in some ways it's the hardest thing I've ever done -- while there are people who are supporting me along the way, this is one situation where the only one who ultimately can do the work is me.

CardioTrans, BSN, RN · Jun 21, 2008

OMG Cardio!!! How the heck are you???!!!! I've missed you!

LOL.......... I'm good!!!! Glad somebody missed me!!!! :clown: