Group project issues

smf0903 · May 22, 2016

Group projects...the worst part of school!! Do what you have to do to get the project done. As much as that sucks it's also YOUR grade on the line. And don't dumb it down for the numbnuts of the group. Good luck!

pmabraham, BSN, RN · May 22, 2016

I think the only one who loves group projects are the ones in charge of forcing such projects onto others. Why someone thinks they are of value, I don't know. Even when you get to pick your group members, you'll find you picked at least one or two wrong ones (if not the lot of them -- at least if you are the one wanting to contribute, do well, etc.).

What I do recommend doing is approaching the professor promptly if you notice anyone not doing their fair share, letting the professor know along with how important it is to get a good grade. Ask them what you can do so that you get a grade you've worked for and are not punished by the others (which isn't fair). BTW, on a side note, group projects should also teach us socialism doesn't work either; lol.

In terms of the audience, do remember the average reading level of your audience. Don't dumb it down for your group, but do dumb it down for the audience.

Purple_roses · May 22, 2016

Wow. I can't believe people are having a hard time reading that. No, do not change it.

Also, I would perhaps talk to the instructor about giving separate grades out. Your grade was lowered 20% too? And you're the one who reported it?

Unfortunately, I would advise you to do the extra work that your partners are failing to do. It's not fair, but if you don't pull their load, nobody will and your grade will suffer for it.

This is why group projects suck. For my group project last year, I ended up having to do all of the research and writing. I simply asked my partner to come up with a theme for the poster presentation and she failed to do that as well. So I literally did everything and our final grade was marked down because the presentation wasn't stellar (because I had to come up with the theme and do everything last minute).

Anonymous865 · May 23, 2016

Schools assign group projects, because almost everyone will work on a team or committee in their careers. The goal of a group project is for you to learn how to do this.

Some suggestions for making a group project work -

The minute you get assigned a project and the group members, get your group together.

Divide the work among the team members.

Establish a timeline. This is where most groups fail. e.g. decide what the first 25% of the work is and get everyone to agree to having their first 25% completed by a specific date. Then do the same for the next 25%. etc. You might say that everyone has to have their citations to the group in 5 days. Then everyone has to have a completed outline to the group 5 days after that. Then everyone must have their final draft to the group 5 days after that.

Send out an email to the group after the first meeting outlining what each person's task is and the timeline.

Meet at each point on the timeline to determine that everyone is on schedule and everyone is on the same page.

You may still have trouble with people not completing their tasks or not doing as thorough a job as you would, but you will know about the problem early. It will also put you in a favorable position if you need to go to the instructor.

Leonardsmom,LPN · May 23, 2016

Schools assign group projects, because almost everyone will work on a team or committee in their careers. The goal of a group project is for you to learn how to do this.
Some suggestions for making a group project work -
The minute you get assigned a project and the group members, get your group together.
Divide the work among the team members.
Establish a timeline. This is where most groups fail. e.g. decide what the first 25% of the work is and get everyone to agree to having their first 25% completed by a specific date. Then do the same for the next 25%. etc. You might say that everyone has to have their citations to the group in 5 days. Then everyone has to have a completed outline to the group 5 days after that. Then everyone must have their final draft to the group 5 days after that.
Send out an email to the group after the first meeting outlining what each person's task is and the timeline.
Meet at each point on the timeline to determine that everyone is on schedule and everyone is on the same page.
You may still have trouble with people not completing their tasks or not doing as thorough a job as you would, but you will know about the problem early. It will also put you in a favorable position if you need to go to the instructor.

Great advice here ^^^

Most people unfortunately if they don't have a timeline in which to complete parts of the project will put it off until the end, or you get those who do nothing at all and just ride the coat tails of the members who do what needs to be done.

As for the example of the slide you gave, I don't see any problem with it at all and had no issues in understanding the information that was being presented. I have a hard time believing they don't understand what footnotes are, or is it that they are not teaching that type of stuff in high school anymore. I graduated high school in the late 90's and my junior and senior years of high school we had to do research papers. In my college writing classes I had to do papers in APA and MLA format, and even in some of my prerequisite science classes I had technical papers I had to write. Don't "dumb" yourself down for others, however if they genuinely don't understand what something means, I would offer to explain to them what it is.

pmabraham, BSN, RN · May 23, 2016

Schools assign group projects, because almost everyone will work on a team or committee in their careers. The goal of a group project is for you to learn how to do this.

Yes, that is the thought process. Sad part in a field that's supposed to be (in part) based on evidenced-based research and best practices, there is NONE when it comes to group projects.

Let's look at reality...

1. At work, one is paid; at school, one is the customer paying vs. being paid.

2. At work, there's a team leader who has authority. In a group project, everyone's equal with zero authority.

3. At work, if a given team member isn't doing their job, this can be reported to the team leader who has the authority to put the team member(s) who are not doing their fair share in line. In a group project at school, individual team members lack any authority to put a fellow team member (or members) in line because they have no authority. Teachers often refuse to take any leadership (authority) and want the group to take care of it; yet each student is equal (no authority, no leadership). And if a student decides to lead, they lack any authority.

4. At work, if an employer penalized an entire team because of a handful of people on the team not doing their work, they would end up with people leaving, work-place bullying, and other negative issues. Yet, at school a teacher can punish an entire team on a whim which doesn't match the reality of the work force.

This is why it is common for people who are forced to engage in school group projects to learn the ONLY thing that a school group project is teaching is TRUST NO ONE. The sad part is that teachers refuse to get that group projects DO NOT mimic real world experiences, and do not provide any valuable teaching other that school group projects outright suck, no one likes them, no one appreciates them, and it's not teaching what the teachers want to teach.

Now, if the teachers (at least in nursing sciences) believe that evidence-based practices matter, and evidence-based research matters, then they should re-evaluate how group projects are structured, their real (or lack of) benefits, etc.

Anonymous865 · May 24, 2016

Yes, that is the thought process. Sad part in a field that's supposed to be (in part) based on evidenced-based research and best practices, there is NONE when it comes to group projects.
Let's look at reality...
1. At work, one is paid; at school, one is the customer paying vs. being paid.
2. At work, there's a team leader who has authority. In a group project, everyone's equal with zero authority.
3. At work, if a given team member isn't doing their job, this can be reported to the team leader who has the authority to put the team member(s) who are not doing their fair share in line. In a group project at school, individual team members lack any authority to put a fellow team member (or members) in line because they have no authority. Teachers often refuse to take any leadership (authority) and want the group to take care of it; yet each student is equal (no authority, no leadership). And if a student decides to lead, they lack any authority.
4. At work, if an employer penalized an entire team because of a handful of people on the team not doing their work, they would end up with people leaving, work-place bullying, and other negative issues. Yet, at school a teacher can punish an entire team on a whim which doesn't match the reality of the work force.
This is why it is common for people who are forced to engage in school group projects to learn the ONLY thing that a school group project is teaching is TRUST NO ONE. The sad part is that teachers refuse to get that group projects DO NOT mimic real world experiences, and do not provide any valuable teaching other that school group projects outright suck, no one likes them, no one appreciates them, and it's not teaching what the teachers want to teach.
Now, if the teachers (at least in nursing sciences) believe that evidence-based practices matter, and evidence-based research matters, then they should re-evaluate how group projects are structured, their real (or lack of) benefits, etc.

I agree with some of the points you made.

I disagree that you will always have a team lead. Sometimes you have a lead. Sometimes you don't.

I have worked on many committees and teams that had no lead. Often the teams were inter-departmental, so we would have had to go pretty far up the food chain to find a manager over every team member.

The big difference is that everyone was a professional and had a professional stake in the success of the team.

The biggest problem I see with group projects in school is that the school does not provide any training on how to work on a team. They just throw you into a group and expect you to figure it out.

In business if you are struggling with getting a team to function well, you can get coaching from management on how to handle any issues. Businesses also usually send professional employees to classes on dealing with difficult personalities, working though issues, etc.

If schools are going to assign group project, they should also provide direction on how to work as a group. At a minimum the teacher should be available for coaching group members in working through issues.

pmabraham, BSN, RN · May 24, 2016

I disagree that you will always have a team lead. Sometimes you have a lead. Sometimes you don't.

Would I be correct in stating there is always someone in management or the person / party who assigned the project can be sought out, and that person / party has the authority required?

I completely agree that professors should provide coaching, but even then that wouldn't deal with the other issues mentioned. Even if everyone had training in how a team operates, the mechanics would not mimic real life.

Ginja85, LPN · May 24, 2016

Thank you everyone for your responses. I guess as someone who didn't even complete 9th grade and got a GED many many years ago, I was expecting my classmates to be at a higher level academically and this is not the case, while its a relief its is also sad because many of my classmates are recent high school graduates. I will continue to complete the group projects on my own and swap my information for the information of contributors. It is also nice to know I am not the only person who is not a fan of group projects.

Tank you again for your responses.

**NICU Guy, BSN, RN** · May 25, 2016

I had a group project in my Nutrition class. The group arranged a meeting outside of the class to do research and divide up the sections between the members. One of the group did not show up. Each member that was present was assigned their section. The missing was called and advised of their section and that each member was to have their section done by at certain date and time (the night before the presentation). They were to email me their section so that I can create the Powerpoint. The date and time had come and I hadn't received the section from the person that was missing from the initial meeting. I called the person and was told "It's late and I am going to bed, so I can't do that." She then hung up. I ended up doing her section also. The next day before class, I went to the instructor and told him the story. He ended up not allowing her to coattail our grade and given an individual assignment.

Anonymous865 · May 25, 2016

Would I be correct in stating there is always someone in management or the person / party who assigned the project can be sought out, and that person / party has the authority required?
I completely agree that professors should provide coaching, but even then that wouldn't deal with the other issues mentioned. Even if everyone had training in how a team operates, the mechanics would not mimic real life.

You know, I'm sure that is true, but I don't remember having to go to someone's manager. I thought the biggest challenge was the different personalities.

I do agree too that school cannot mimic real life in any way.

I also didn't mean to imply that I agree with the group projects assigned to nursing students. I was just explaining the rationale.

Personally I don't think a teacher should assign a group project unless the assignment wouldn't be possible to complete alone.

My niece is studying engineering now. She has group projects in almost all her engineering classes. The projects are too large and complex for anyone to do alone, and they will be working on teams when they are in the real world. Seniors actually do a project for a real company. The group projects in that program make sense.