GN who fails boards and is still on orientation with RN

DusktilDawn · Sep 1, 2005

I don't think EdieRN is being unsupportive or unsympathetic. She wants to know the legalities of signing off for IVs and assessments in this situation.

Frankie, I've seen many managers who did not know the legalities of a situation. Ignorance of the law is not an accepted excuse for breaking the law. It will not fly. That applies to RNs/LPNs who accept a decision by a manager that may not be legal.

There are many reasons a person may fail the NCLEX that have nothing to do with competence. Test anxiety, second language, personal crisis, etc. Should we be supportive? Of course we should, but we should be doing so in a way that complies with SBONs rules and regulations. Some facilities offer preparation classes for the NCLEX, mine does.

Anyone who is not sure about a situation should definately check with their SBON and find out.

BowlerRN · Sep 1, 2005

In our state our Scope of Practice is clearly defined by the Board of Nursing. A GN is only considered a GN until the 1st time they take the exam. After that they are considered either an RN or a Nursing Assistant. According to our Scope of Practice, at no time is a Nursing assistant EVER allowed to start an IV or administer medications. This is strictly enforced and could cause a hospital to be censured at the very least! I would definitely check this with your BON, as you could also be held liable for going outside your own scope of practice by allowing a nursing assistant to perform these skills on your license. Rest assured that your nurse manager would disavow all knowledge of your actions if the BON came after you. If she is so sure that she is within her own scope of practice to allow a nursing assistant to perforn RN or GN tasks, let her accept that reposibility under her own license. Under those conditions, I'm willing to bet that she will research that decision a little more thoroughly.

I completely agree with you! In the state of Kansas as soon as you are aware that you failed the NCLEX you are no longer allowed to practice as a GN, I failed the NCLEX and had my LPN to fall back on instead of CNA. I don't see anything wrong with having the GN or CNA follow the RN and be oriented as long as they are not practicing like an RN. I would definitely refuse to sign off treatments that were performed by the CNA. It doesn't matter if he's a good nurse or not, the law is the law and I wouldn't put my own license in jeopardy.

hrtprncss · Sep 1, 2005

there wouldn't be much argument about this if all nurses dont treat new grads who failed the boards the first time kinda bad....i've seen alot of new nurses leave because of that, then see them years after working with me side by side and complaining how bad it was when they were orienting because of the way other nurses treated them. kinda sad actually.

ckh23, BSN, RN · Sep 1, 2005

there wouldn't be much argument about this if all nurses dont treat new grads who failed the boards the first time kinda bad....i've seen alot of new nurses leave because of that, then see them years after working with me side by side and complaining how bad it was when they were orienting because of the way other nurses treated them. kinda sad actually.

This is getting off topic. If you read the OP second post you will see his concerns. It's not that the OP is not supporting the new grad who failed, but is concerned that the orientee is being allowed to practice outside of the rules and regs set by the state board. Since the new grad does not have a license, he is essentially practicing under the license of the RN he is orienting with. Just like in nursing school during clinicals we were practicing under our clinical instructors' license. I think the main thing to do here, and I think everyone else agrees, is that the OP should check with the state BON and find out what the guidelines are for this particular situation. I think it is unfair that the OP put his license on the line if the manager is letting this orientee practice against the rules.

meownsmile, BSN, RN · Sep 1, 2005

I have to agree, if they have failed i dont see a problem following you, but to be physically doing nursing procedures is a real problem and could be a liability on your license. You would be the one tagged for allowing an unlicensed or someone without a license pending to "practice", not your nurse manager. I dont think i'd do it.

EdieRN · Sep 1, 2005

there wouldn't be much argument about this if all nurses dont treat new grads who failed the boards the first time kinda bad....i've seen alot of new nurses leave because of that, then see them years after working with me side by side and complaining how bad it was when they were orienting because of the way other nurses treated them. kinda sad actually.

Again, I was asking about allowing someone who does not have a graduate license to start iv's and assess patients. He is technically considered a nursing aide until he does pass. Our department has never had someone fail their boards before so this is new to us. I have been looking for info from Pennsylvania's BON in regards to this - not much I can go by yet. One of my co-workers told one of our supervisors that she wasn't comfortable with this and they just shrugged their shoulders.

LPN_mn · Sep 1, 2005

There was another post here not long ago about a nurse who worked in LTC and allowed a GN who had failed boards to take BS and give insulin injections. She is in real trouble with the BON. I think this is a little more serious than what the other nurse did. I am with you. Check with the BON to see if you are doing something illegal. Protect yourself because you manager is not going to.