Get NP in Australia or US?

ceridwyn · Jun 21, 2013

Put it bluntly, NP not recognised in Australia as Australian NP's are RN's with much experience and have worked as advanced practise nurses in their specialty BEFORE they complete a Master in NP or similiar and therefore once competed and ENDORSED as an RN with NP endorsement are already working in that capacity, no graduate NP positions etc.

The US +++ study to qualify as an NP with no working experience in their specialty area as an advanced practise RN need graduate supervision etc etc.

Does either nursing boards except the endorsement of NP, well no one has ever really come to the boards to tell us, though as you can see a Nurse Practitioner, means different things in either country.

Australian board should not except NP from the US as has no experience as an RN working for at least 3 years in advanced role.

On the other hand would a state nursing board in America except the degree of Master of Nurse Practitioner from Australia - who knows most likely not, they do not except Bachelor of Nursing from Australia as they find it incomplete compared to that of the US.

You do not state where you are coming from: if its the US....stay there do your degree get at least 2-3 years experience, then you would most likely qualify to work at NP level in Australia, on the basis of probabilities.

greyL · Jun 21, 2013

I am currently in the US. What does advanced practice role mean to you? Over here an advanced practice nurse is usually one that has her Masters already, so I'm wondering what an advanced practice role is before getting a master's degree.

I looked it up and it still isn't very clear to me.

"Advanced practice nursing defines a level of nursing

practice that uses extended and expanded skills,

experience and knowledge in assessment, planning,

implementation, diagnosis and evaluation of the

nursing care required. Nurses practising at this level are

educationally prepared at postgraduate level and may work

in a specialist or generalist capacity. However, the basis

of advanced practice is the high degree of knowledge,

skill and experience applied in the nurse-patient/client

relationship to achieve optimal outcomes through critical

analysis, problem solving and accurate decision-making

(Australian Nursing and Midwifery Council (ANMC) 2006)."

ceridwyn · Jun 21, 2013

Grad certificate, diploma or a masters and working in that specialty . As a clinical nurse specialist/educator

greyL · Jun 21, 2013

I see. So if I get an NP here in the US, and then work in the US for 3 years, that would possibly qualify me to be an NP in Australia?

ceridwyn · Jun 21, 2013

No one knows for sure, understand that as a Nurse Practitioner, you need to know the legislation for drug administration - this differs for each state and you will need to know about our health system PBS, medicare - as you will/could have provider number and as a prescriber, you will not learn all this from a Masters in the US.

Therefore no doub,t there will need to be a subject to pick up, our medications, orders, health system are all completely different and there would need to be a bridging course of some sort to learn about those. I do think though going on past assessments by AHPRA and the nursing boards over there, that AHPRA is far more lenient and completing your masters and experience would be better than doing it here and trying to be recognised in the USA.

iamnomad · Jun 22, 2013

I don't know much about NPs in Australia. But I worked with NPs in the US (particularly in Kansas) and they pretty much do what doctor's do (except of course the highly specialized procedures, etc). They can prescribe meds, order labs, attend to emergencies, do minor sutures, etc. In order to qualify, you don't even need a bachelor's degree in nursing. They have entry-level master's degree in nursing. Graduates of programs other than nursing can go through this route. RN registration is required, though, and RN course requirements are part of this entry-level MSN. I was going to apply for an MSN degree admission but thought of having RN experience first.

As I'm in Australia now, I found that the requirements are different. One needs to be practising in advanced level capacity before actually qualifying for NP degree. So in a sense, you need to be really experienced and more of like a senior-level staff before you can qualify. And by the looks of it, people from my place are not familiar with NPs. Whereas in US, almost everyone knows about them, alongside PAs (physician assistants).

I don't know up to what extent the shortage of doctors here in Australia is, but US-style NPs and PAs is an advantage if there's a critical shortage as they can fill in the gap. That's what they do in rural USA.

So I guess, for job opportunities, based on my experience, you'd be better off taking your MSN in USA as the opportunities are plenty. And if you happen to decide moving to Australia, the worst case is AHPRA or ANMAC will not recognise you as an "NP" in the strictest sense, but hospitals/employment will still regards your experience highly and might employ you in advanced specialty position. And I guess in the long run, that will lead to NP recognition here in Australia.

ceridwyn · Jun 23, 2013

In Australia the RN is the base nurse, no trying to divide no making an RN the less person in the health care team, hell, how many different educated- designated people do you want looking after you. Thank goodness the Australian RN is important and therefore to 'be' anything else you need to have been an RN first, then specialise. Unless you want to be a midwife.

Nurse Practitioners are also well known in the acute sector here as well, they are found in Remote areas, ED departments etc etc. diabetes, icu,I know of one even in aged care.

All hail the Bachelor of Nursing RN.

ANnot4me · Jun 23, 2013

I am in NZ and to be a Nurse Practioner here one must work in the field in which they are seeking to practice as an NP and also have a MN with an endorsement in prescribing. So, if a nurse wants to be an NP in the ED, she will have practised in ED and have worked in an advanced role as a Clinical Specialist, Nurse Educator or a Charge Nurse. What is confusing is that any RN here can do course work (one year) to get a PG Diploma and then study a further year to get a Masters (they do not need a Bachelors degree). So, a nurse here may have a hospital diploma or an Associates degree and study two more years and she will be granted a Masters degree. While in the US, a person cannot get a Masters without a Bachelors.

Furthermore, a Bachelors degree in Australia and NZ is only a three-year program and the degrees here are Bachelor of Nursing or Bachelor of Health Sciences degree. Down here there is less focus on humanity and biological sciences. Nurses who work in NZ as Clinical Specialists or Educators, etc often do not have a Bachelors degree. Promotion here is based more upon (in my opinion) who you know rather than what you know as a nurse with a BSN and a PG Diplomma (5 years of study) will compete with for any other RN for an advanced position.

While I have known a few NPs from the US who have qualified to practice as an NP here in NZ, the reverse is unlikely as NPs here in NZ sit no exams and are granted their status based upon their portfolios and an interview by the Nursing Council of NZ. The cultures and systems are way different. Australia is more similar to NZ than to the US.

ceridwyn · Jun 23, 2013

Take a big breathe and leave this one alone...Ceridwyn, no have to say something - only to say so sorry you think poorly of a 3 year nursing degree after all completing 13 years of secondary education and then attend a proper research focused university, taught by well experienced educated nurses, a degree that does not have subjects such as military service and folk dancing or languages from the islands, but 24 subjects of pure nursing focused subjects that do include biological, wholistic, cultural sensitivity subjects as well as practical nursing, most of the time done concurrently for the best way of learning the art of those nursing subjects then you can be a critic of another countries nursing program.

BTW all nurses in Australia and NZ since the early 90's must have a "crappy" 3 year nursing degree to be an RN to even go on to post graduate study unless given exemptions for their "crappy grad cents or grad dips" from the university if hey still have a hospital certificate.

And there are differences between NZ and Australia, is there differences between the US and Canada, the Phillipines and India? before one starts clumping areas together best experience it first hand.

You maybe as well have been talking to nurses with diplomas from the UK or Associates from the US, not locals with their poor 3 year degree.

I still state though even with their poor 3 year degree or poor diploma with grad cents or hrs diplomas they are first of all RN's with experience before they become advanced practitioners and have even more experience before they can study and be considered NP's

What's the hang up with not having exams? Maybe their courses required a thesis!

greyL · Jun 23, 2013

Take a big breathe and leave this one alone...Ceridwyn, no have to say something - only to say so sorry you think poorly of a 3 year nursing degree after all completing 13 years of secondary education and then attend a proper research focused university, taught by well experienced educated nurses, a degree that does not have subjects such as military service and folk dancing or languages from the islands, but 24 subjects of pure nursing focused subjects that do include biological, wholistic, cultural sensitivity subjects as well as practical nursing, most of the time done concurrently for the best way of learning the art of those nursing subjects then you can be a critic of another countries nursing program.
BTW all nurses in Australia and NZ since the early 90's must have a "crappy" 3 year nursing degree to be an RN to even go on to post graduate study unless given exemptions for their "crappy grad cents or grad dips" from the university if hey still have a hospital certificate.
And there are differences between NZ and Australia, is there differences between the US and Canada, the Phillipines and India? before one starts clumping areas together best experience it first hand.

I understand that you want to defend nurses in Australia, but it doesn't have to be at the expense of US nurses. I did not take folk dancing classes in nursing school. >_>

ceridwyn · Jun 23, 2013

Was the poster that is quite happy to put down a Nursing degree of 3 years from the US? Or originally from elsewhere and this is the NZ/Australian forum.