Health Care: The Ticking Time Bomb - page 7

Our health care system hurts everyone. Premiums are expensive and increasing every year. Doing nothing today will cost taxpayers 2-3 times more in the next few years. Currently, the "public... Read More

  1. by   dlatimer
    ACU.....I am totally against 'feeding on the government', mostly because the government is us. On the other hand, if we could trust the captains of capitalism, then we wouldn't need government regulation at all. The greedier, more corrupt the are, the more we need government regulation. In economic models the government is the regulator and protector of the worker, otherwise the producers would continue to lower wages, force us to buy all our products from them and lobby for increased taxes for their subsidies. Are you familiar with Adam Smith, John Galbreath, W. Edwards Demings?
  2. by   AZ_LPN_8_26_13
    Quote from Joe V
    Our health care system hurts everyone. Premiums are expensive and increasing every year. Doing nothing today will cost taxpayers 2-3 times more in the next few years.

    Currently, the "public option" is the biggest obstacle when it comes to health care reform. Many believe that it will be the end of health care as we know it today - others think that it is long overdue.

    Would you support a public health care option?

    Yes, I would support a public health care option, for those who could not afford the cost of coverage on their own. My wife and I would not qualify for such a program because we have excellent health care and insurance where we work now (we both work for a hospital) but we both believe that no one should be shut out of the healthcare system because they lack money. I'm willing to see more of my tax dollar go to this - I have no problem with it.

    Concerning that little poll with the three choices: I put down yes, I support it, but that doesn't mean I don't care how it's set up - of course I do - all of us do. Having the the third choice "depends on how it's structured, etc." appears to be an attempt to "water down" the "yesses" somewhat - maybe that wasn't the intent, buttt ....... I am going to count response #3's as a "yes"....
  3. by   AZ_LPN_8_26_13
    Take a look at the line up of people who are opposed to this, and why. Insurance companies, lawyers, stockholders and CEOs of for-profit healthcare entities..... I think it's time to throw out the fear/scare-mongering and just get down and do something about all this. Somewhere along the line many people in this country were brainwashed into believing that the government is our mortal enemy. It's not. Sometimes the government is the only thing that stands for justice and fair play for the average guy. I shudder to think of what things would be like if there were absolutely no regulations on anything (a lassiez-faire capitalists wet dream) and many people were actually working tirelessly to try and make this a reality. Can anyone say Bernie Madoff????? Where was the SEC while all of this was happening? Not a medical example, but you get the message (I hope). This is what happens when we give people a blank check and a do-as-you-please free pass to do anything. I myself welcome the pendulum-swing back in the other direction. Maybe more people will be held accountable. And no, I don't trust big business - at least with government we have elections from time to time, and in theory they are supposed to be accountable - private business is top-down & proprietary - what they do financially is supposedly none of your business or concern. One of the biggest lies of the last half of the twentieth century - that the "for profit/business model" is the way to go for everything, including healthcare.
  4. by   ptadvocate81
    Just a quick question... I have debated this with my spouse over and over again... We both agree 100% that healthcare should be a right not a privilege. But my question for fellow healthcare workers is this. Would you be for this plan even if it meant that your pay was cut to say $12/hour? It is my belief that there would be cost cuts to support a plan of this nature and I think that pay would be one of those. Just a little something to ponder....
  5. by   ShayRN
    The thing everyone is missing here is that under Pres. Obama's plan the gov. healthcare plan would be OPTIONAL. If you already have insurance, you keep what you have. I think this is a fantastic option for people who have to decide between taking their medication or eating that month. We have people on this board who are telling us that is their reality and they are getting flamed for it.

    My uncle is a truck driver and has a beef farm (his wife takes care of it when he is on the road.) Guess what, no insurance. What a fantastic way for them to get health insurance. You will not find two harder working people in the world, they DESERVE the option to buy affordable health care and not worry about losing everything. To me this is simply a no brainer. Unless ofcourse you have never lived with the uncertainty of tommarow and just don't get it. (I am not talking those of you who were without insurance when you were 21 and in college, I am talking about people, HARD WORKING AMERICANS that are 45, 50, 60 and cannot afford or cannot get insurance.) Seems to me the congressmen who are most vocal about opposing this plan have gov. supplied health insurance and their loved ones are protected. Shame on them all.
  6. by   misswoosie
    Quote from ptadvocate81
    Just a quick question... I have debated this with my spouse over and over again... We both agree 100% that healthcare should be a right not a privilege. But my question for fellow healthcare workers is this. Would you be for this plan even if it meant that your pay was cut to say $12/hour? It is my belief that there would be cost cuts to support a plan of this nature and I think that pay would be one of those. Just a little something to ponder....
    Well we are all in nursing for the love of the job aren't we

    This is what I was trying to convey here.There will never be a bottomless pot of money for any UHS, and if people think that nurses lose out compared to Drs then why do they think it would be any different with UHS?
    Same with CEOs of hospitals- we were given a 2.5% pay rise this year, negotiated (ha ha) by our useless unions.Our CEO got a 30% pay rise-and this is in a public funded system.UHS is no Nirvana and I think that many who say they want the system would be apalled at our hospitals,staffing levels and pay.

    There was a post some where from someone who had gone to see a Dr in Sweden whilst visiting relatives.They were suffering from diarrhoea and had a fever.They were apalled that there was no blood work and they were sent away being told it was a virus. Yup-sounds about right. In a UHS you will not get bloods done -they are saving their money for the patients with multiple risk factors for CVD,asthma,diabetics and a multitude of other things that the government has set targets for.Unforunately you don't feature. I would love to know how many people each year are wrongly diagnosed by their GPs crystal ball as having Irritable bowel or UTIs.

    Quote from misswoosie
    But even in a UHS those that work and pay contributions (ours are about 7% plus the employer pays about another 7%)
    the people who pay are still paying for those who don't ie those who don't work or claim benefits, or work without paying tax and contributions becasue they don't declare the work and work for cash in hand.

    There will always be compromises for a UHS and I think a large part of the spending in healthcare in the US goes on hospitals and state of the art technology-which can't be said for here in the UK.

    Depends if people want to compromise on access to investigations and treatment, salaries for those who work in healthcare and hospital facilities, cleanliness and age. Of course you may end up with a far better system than ours, but remember, nurses in the US are among the best paid in the world.
  7. by   ShayRN
    Again, you all keep saying Universal Health Care. That isn't what is being proposed. A government option to BUY insurance. There are people out there who cannot get insurance due to preexisting conditions and excesive cost. That is NOT fair. I would not want UHC, I do want everyone who wants insurance the ability to BUY it without fear of not eating.

    How many of you went to college on a FEDERAL subsidized student loan? How many GI's in the 50's were able to buy homes because of a government sponsered program that gave them low interest loans. Yes, we have a big government. But that is a fact of life, it isn't going to change. At least with our new administration I don't have the fear that my government is protecting me by torturing others. I am hoping and praying out Americans overseas no longer have the fear of the CIA listening in on their conversations.
  8. by   dlatimer
    Regarding the public plan cost. If all 40 million without health insurance would sign up the policy holder base would be so huge, the cost (and therefore the premiums/copayments) would be much less than today. Also, there would be no profit involved, saving more - and all those collecting medicaid (from state coffers) would be transferred to this public plan. If the quality of health increased in the general population - would more people work? Hopefully someone smarter than me (that includes about anyone) can figure this out.
  9. by   misswoosie
    Quote from ShayRN
    Again, you all keep saying Universal Health Care. That isn't what is being proposed. A government option to BUY insurance. There are people out there who cannot get insurance due to preexisting conditions and excesive cost. That is NOT fair. I would not want UHC, I do want everyone who wants insurance the ability to BUY it without fear of not eating.

    How many of you went to college on a FEDERAL subsidized student loan? How many GI's in the 50's were able to buy homes because of a government sponsered program that gave them low interest loans. Yes, we have a big government. But that is a fact of life, it isn't going to change. At least with our new administration I don't have the fear that my government is protecting me by torturing others. I am hoping and praying out Americans overseas no longer have the fear of the CIA listening in on their conversations.
    How is a government option to buy insurance any different from us paying 6.5% of our salary towards our UHC?
    Doesn't really matter what name you give the system. I didn't say it was fair that some people didn't have access to health care-I was pointing out that a government run scheme will ration care and resources and may lead to cuts in wages,facilities and technology.
    Or maybe you think their will be a 2 tier system, 1 for those that have good healthcare insurance and a government run one for those who cannot afford other insurance? If this is the case I can imagine which hospitals will pay the highest wages,staffing levels, shortest wait times and the best technology.
    I wonder where most people will chose to work?
  10. by   misswoosie
    Quote from dlatimer
    Regarding the public plan cost. If all 40 million without health insurance would sign up the policy holder base would be so huge, the cost (and therefore the premiums/copayments) would be much less than today. Also, there would be no profit involved, saving more - and all those collecting medicaid (from state coffers) would be transferred to this public plan. If the quality of health increased in the general population - would more people work? Hopefully someone smarter than me (that includes about anyone) can figure this out.
    If the 40 million without health insurance suddenly have access to disease management programmes, preventative and in patient care which they have not previously had, and the government sets targets for those aspects of care, then there will need to be a hell of a big pot of money!
  11. by   Fuzzy
    I cannot get health insurance due to pre existing conditions. The only time that I have ever had adequate healthcare was when I was on disability. I choose to go off of disability and go back to work. I know many people on disability who could work but don't due to the fact that they would lose their health care. Funny some of them are RN's with severe back problems. I would like affordable and available health care. Right now it is neither for me. The key word is affordable. I don't expect free but affordable. Right now health insurance if I could get it would cost one-half of my monthly income before taxes. That's not affordable.

    I'm nearly 50 and I've never had a mammogram, I've only had two pap smears, and I have had very few medical screenings that are not related to my current medical issues. I tell my friends, that if I get cancer I'm just going to have to die as I certainly could never afford the chemo, radiation, or surgery. Same goes with a heart attack or stroke. Only the insured or the wealthy can afford medical care in this country. For the rest of us it's unavailable.

    Fuzzy
  12. by   K98
    Quote from Fuzzy
    I cannot get health insurance due to pre existing conditions. The only time that I have ever had adequate healthcare was when I was on disability. I choose to go off of disability and go back to work. I know many people on disability who could work but don't due to the fact that they would lose their health care. Funny some of them are RN's with severe back problems. I would like affordable and available health care. Right now it is neither for me. The key word is affordable. I don't expect free but affordable. Right now health insurance if I could get it would cost one-half of my monthly income before taxes. That's not affordable.

    I'm nearly 50 and I've never had a mammogram, I've only had two pap smears, and I have had very few medical screenings that are not related to my current medical issues. I tell my friends, that if I get cancer I'm just going to have to die as I certainly could never afford the chemo, radiation, or surgery. Same goes with a heart attack or stroke. Only the insured or the wealthy can afford medical care in this country. For the rest of us it's unavailable.

    Fuzzy
    My daughter is a nursing assistant/nursing student. She is covered under my insurance until age 25, but she could afford her own insurance through her employer. She makes 10.50/hr. I keep her on my policy because she is eligible. My point is, she is self-supporting on 10.50/hr and she can afford a decent plan that her employer offers. One of her friends doesn't pay for her employer plan because she chooses to have cable internet/BlackBerry instead. These kids are not wealthy.
  13. by   ACU_RN
    Quote from K98
    My daughter is a nursing assistant/nursing student. She is covered under my insurance until age 25, but she could afford her own insurance through her employer. She makes 10.50/hr. I keep her on my policy because she is eligible. My point is, she is self-supporting on 10.50/hr and she can afford a decent plan that her employer offers. One of her friends doesn't pay for her employer plan because she chooses to have cable internet/BlackBerry instead. These kids are not wealthy.


    When I was in nursing school I worked a min wage job that didn't provide health insurance. My wife, son and myself could have milked the government and used the .gov medicine, but we didn't want to add to the problem. We went without health coverage for three years and paid as we went, some of which I am still paying. Not a lot though. It can be done WITHOUT the government.
    Last edit by VivaLasViejas on Jul 11, '09 : Reason: crude term

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