artificial feeding-Terri Schiavo - page 9

I posted this here becaue I think this subject is something that we as nurses deal with on a regular basis.....Many many people state that they have a big problem with the feeding being stopped... Read More

  1. by   Pammie
    Quote from fergus51
    I can suspect someone all I want, but there is NO proof. Barring conviction for a crime, I don't think anyone has the right to declare his marriage null and void.

    I also suspect the parents motivations btw.
    Are any of you aware that he had been awarded quite a sum of money after her incident because he told the courts that he would need it to care for her the rest of her life? He told the courts that he was going to quit his job and spend the rest of his life caring for her, that he would stand by her the rest of her life.
  2. by   BeachNurse
    Schiavo's Husband Rejects $1 Million Offer
    LAST UPDATE: 3/12/2005 10:30:09 AM

    United Press International

    A California man has offered Terri Schiavo's husband, Michael, $1 million if he turns over custody of his brain-damaged wife to her parents in Florida.

    Robert Herring Sr., 63, of San Diego deposited the cash into an account at his attorney's bank, the St. Petersburg Times reported.

    Michael Schiavo's attorney George Felos said the money would not be accepted. He said another offer of $10 million was turned down two weeks ago.

    In another development, Clearwater Circuit Judge George Greer refused to allow the Florida Department of Children and Families to intervene in the case. The department had asked for a delay in the March 18 deadline for removing the woman's feeding tube, which has been keeping her alive since she suffered cardiac arrest 16 years ago.

    In Washington, Congressional leaders have fast-tracked a bill that could lead to a federal court review of the case. Nearly a dozen conservative groups have been lobbying to prolong Terri Schiavo's life.
  3. by   medsurgnurse
    Quote {Again, if these parents had such a close relationship with their daughter, wouldn't they have known that her husband was beating her? Wouldn't they have known about an eating disorder? }

    Those are two things the a person would be extremely secretive about. Someone could have an eating discorder without anyone being aware especially if that person did not become underweight. As the parents were not living in the same house they were probably not aware of her purging activities. Second, women will go to great lengths to hide spousal abuse.
  4. by   Pammie
    A friend of mine had a daughter whose husband was abusive. The mom never knew about it until the night the daughter's life was in danger and she got away and went to her mom's. It was THEN that the daughter told all to her mom. They were both close, but she did not want her mom to know this was going on until she had to secretly run from her husband.
  5. by   Kyriaka
    Quote from Jerry Falletta
    What a husband!!!!!! Before she was hospitalized, he probably awakened each morning, headed for the refrigerator to check the milk carton, hoping to find her picture.

    The media is not questioning the husband's intentions (which have become quite obvious), but seems to be in favor of D/C'ing the tube feedings. Most of the general public probably thinks that would result in an instant and painless death.

    As for the term "heroic measures", I have actually seen where patients have used this incredibly vague term in stating their wishes in writing. Ask any ten doctors, nurses, and/or lawyers what this term really means, and you will likely receive at least a thousand answers.
    Yeah. He is a piece of work.

    But probably the one lesson from all of this is let people know your wants and your beliefs. Write it down. Make it known.
  6. by   jeepgirl
    Quote from medsurgnurse
    Quote {Again, if these parents had such a close relationship with their daughter, wouldn't they have known that her husband was beating her? Wouldn't they have known about an eating disorder? }

    Those are two things the a person would be extremely secretive about. Someone could have an eating discorder without anyone being aware especially if that person did not become underweight. As the parents were not living in the same house they were probably not aware of her purging activities. Second, women will go to great lengths to hide spousal abuse.
    i thought that with bulemia the women were normal sized?
  7. by   underwatergirl
    I have watched this case off and on now since the me there appears to be alot of accusations from the family...I am sorry but when Terri said her vows she gave away her families rights as number one advocates. I am kinda of sided with the husband here, who has to be the medical bills??? There are lots of bills even after health long has he been paying this??? When I was married I told my husband I would never want to be kept alive...I told him that because he had the say, my family knew it too but I would have been upset to know of their interverences(sorry bad spelling).

    Then on the topic of the husbands new fiancee and kids, how long was he to wait??? He had no relationship with her..he had nothing to grow with? How could he be expected to hold on to a wife who honestly doesn't exist anymore??? How long must he wait??? I can understand that..maybe that is wrong of me but I can.

    Then the parents continuely bring up these accusations against him, to me it is alot of hearsay...including that sworn statement...anyone can make a sworn statement even to a lie. Again hearsay...why do the parents say Terri interacts with them but nobody but them see doctors testify to it...Yes scans have been done but nothing conclusive, a spark here a spark there...that happens in stroke patients...The part of the inactive brain, may spark once or twice but nothing that would be life sustaining.

    Now I would have issues with this man if the parents said ok we will pay the medical bills...we will do this...they signed legal documents and allowed him a divorce, with a payment of all the things he has payed for threw it all. But to the best of my knowledge this hasn't occurred. They want him to be the husband on one aspect but on another they don' does that rate.

    The courts really had no buisness stepping into this unless foul play(abuse). Next of kin who is that the husband...

    Just take the facts not hearsay....
  8. by   leslie :-D
    i certainly hope they keep her comfortable when they stop the fdgs.

  9. by   ValerieB
    I think it's a very tragic situation for all concerned with Terri. I firmly believe that her government needs to stay the heck out of it. None of us really know what her husband is going through. I have a dear friend who suffered massive brain damage from an MVA. She is only 48 years old and living in a nursing home. Her husband was given advice to actually divorce her because of the financial burden. Do any of us know what we would do if this happened to us? Her parents are probably in denial and see what they want to see. Is it such a terrible thing for her husband to want to go on with his life? I think everyone needs to have these discussions with their family because it ends up tearing them apart at a time when they need each other the most. From the pictures I've seen on TV, what kind of quality of life is she living? If they remove her feeding tube, she will be in God's hands.
  10. by   icyounurse
    i think that they should just let that poor woman die with some dignity. i can understand where her parents would have a hard time letting go--but my god its been over 10 years. shouldn't they start the greiving process? i mean, does anyone see the irony in the fact that she ended up like this because of anorexia and now her parents are force feeding her brain dead body? i really don't think anyone with body issues that severe would want to be on cnn with a bad haircut drooling on themselves. i personally WOULD NEVER WANT TO LIVE LIKE THAT and neither would most people.
    who is paying fort his anyway? just curious. :angryfire
    Last edit by icyounurse on Mar 17, '05
  11. by   RN34TX
    As nurses, we've all seen the devastating effects of keeping someone alive for people's own selfish reasons.
    Families do not think rationally, decisions are made based on guilt, prior conflicts, ignorance, etc.
    It's interesting that almost no one, when asked, would want to be kept alive with contractures, feeing tubes, diaper changes, vent, etc. and at the same time will fight the courts to keep a loved one alive under the same circumstances.
    It seems that everyone is sympathetic to the loved one trying to keep them alive with the old "You don't know what they are going through" routine, which is echoed often.
    It's time to take back some control and stop letting people with personal interests, be it financial or whatever, have the final say.
    They are not looking out for the patient, they have personal interests and the patient's fate is all about what is going to make the family feel better, not the patient.
    Last edit by RN34TX on Mar 17, '05
  12. by   James Huffman
    Some interesting information I found this morning:

    Jim Huffman, RN

    Michael Schiavo's former girlfriend speaks: Excerpts From Cynthia Shook's May 8, 2001 Deposition given in fear

    In a previous Hyscience post, Carole Lieberman, M.D., M.P.H., Psychiatrist and expert medical witness, and the author of the book, Bad Boys: Why We Love Them, How to Live with Them and When to Leave Them, was quoted as saying, "I have studied men who exhibit pathology in their relationships with women. Profiles of the twelve different types of bad boys are explained. Michael Schiavo fits the profile, described in the book as the Prince of Darkness (see chapter 13). O.J. Simpson was cited as a classic example of this type, and there are indeed similarities between the two men. It is especially significant to note that O.J. flew into a homicidal rage when he realized that Nicole was totally abandoning him, as is characteristic of these impulsive men who most dread being abandoned by their woman. Similarly, Michael Schiavo was likely to have known that Terri had begun making plans to divorce him, since she had told a coworker and family member. Stalking is characteristic of this type of man, as well. And a girlfriend of Michael's, Cindy, accused him of stalking her in 2001."

    This is the story of "Cindy," and the deposition that she had to be forced to give, out of her fear of Michael Schiavo. Terri was also afraid of Michael, but of course Michael has been hard at work to make sure that she can't give a deposition as Cindy has!

    In late 1991, 1 years after Terri's collapse, Michael Schiavo became involved in an intimate relationship with Cindy Shook. The romance continued for approximately one year. It can be documented that the two spent a weekend at the Don Caesar hotel in St. Petersburg Beach and they also contacted a Century 21 Realtor on the premise of purchasing a home.

    In May of 1992, at the apex of the romance, Schiavo had Terri's 2 pet cats euthanized to clear the way for his moving in with Cindy and her pet dog.

    In the summer of 1992, Schiavo moved into his parent's home. We can speculate with reasonable accuracy, it was at the instructions of his attorney, since the living arrangement would be contrary to Schiavo's "loving husband" image they were projecting for the upcoming November 1992 malpractice trial.

    In April 2001, Cindy Shook (married name Brasher) was interviewed by an investigator working in Terri's behalf. Unwilling to come forward because of her immense fear of Schiavo, Cindy had to be subpoenaed and was then subsequently deposed on May 8, 2001 to try and learn more regarding her intimate knowledge of Michael Schiavo's character traits.

    Excerpts; May 8, 2001 Deposition:

    Cindy Shook describing Schiavo's possessiveness.

    "he's very jealous. He stalked me at where I worked after I stopped dating...when he would get mad at me he would tell me, I would rather be laying in bed in the nursing home with her than with you. I mean he can be the most incredibly mean person"

    When asked if she were afraid that Michael would physically harm her or if he would harm children.

    "I am concerned about retaliation because I have a child -I have children and a husband. I know him, I know what he told me I said he could be a very mean person."

    She spoke of how Schiavo stalked her for close to a year after the breakup and that she received repeated phone calls.

    "He came on the floor looking for me several times. I felt it was out of character for him to get a job as an orderly at the hospital That was concerning to me. When he would come up to the floor looking for her she was not scared the first time but later was scared.

    In town I would look up when I was driving...not at my work- she would look up in the rear view mirror and there would be Michael Schiavo. I would look up and he would be behind me in traffic. It continued for several months after he didn't work at the hospital. She would change lanes, try to make a turn and he would do the same. He did this about ten times.

    One time he was behind me in traffic he got next to me in a two-lane going the same way, and he changed lanes basically right on top of where I was at, and I had to swerve not to be hit. I had to swerve off the road. Michael ran me off the road. I considered it as stalking, dangerous and guessed potentially life threatening."

    Cindy thought about getting a restraining order. She talked to an off duty police officer in her building

    They discussed marriage. She said Schiavo asked what would you do if I asked you to marry me. He never discussed getting a divorce.

    Cindy said Schiavo got angry when asked questions about Terri saying:

    "this had destroyed his life and he was being robed of a normal life."

    Regarding Terri's care, according to Cindy Shook, Michael Schiavo said,

    "How the hell should I know we never spoke about this, my God I was only 25 years old. How the hell should I know? We were young. We never spoke of this."

    THEY NEVER SPOKE OF THIS! Yet now Michael claims that Terri's wish was to die of starvation and dehydration, and the infamous Judge George Greer rubber stamps it. Why?

    A case for Criminal Investigation of Michael Schiavo:

    1) Nurses' testimony: Heidi Law, Carla Sauer-Iyer, Carolyn Johnson have been ignored and dismissed without hearing; each testified that Michael was abusive to Terri and may have attempted to kill her by insulin injection and attempts to induce pneumonia by turning the thermostat in her room to 64 degrees.

    2) Michael Baden, top forensic pathologist in country and interviewed on Fox News National Television broadcast October 25, 2003 on Terri's bone scan and injuries states that:

    a) Terri's injuries are not consistent with a heart attack; no cardiac evidence to support it
    b) Extremely rare for potassium imbalance on woman her age and in her good health
    c) Injuries are consistent with severe trauma possibly caused by a beating
    d) The injuries in medical records warrant an immediate investigation

    3) Dr. William Hammesfahr, Nobel prize nominee and neurologist testified that Terri's neck injuries are consistent with only one type of injury: that of strangulation.

    4) Terri's doctor, Dr. Gambone resigned; he had previously testified Terri would die within a few days of starvation/dehydration. Terri has an obvious will to live.

    5) Michael has enlisted the services of a new doctor, Stanton Tripodis, who has 5 malpractice suits against him. Clearly, Michael is attempting to provide sub-standard care for his wife.

    Case no. 97007946C1 filed 11-25-97
    Case no. 94003739C1 filed 6-27-94
    Case no. 95000873C1 filed 2-14-95
    Case no. 96001434C1 filed 3-6-96
    Case no. 98002289C1 filed 4-7-98

    6) Michael is committing adultery by living with another woman who has already born one child with another on the way, thereby creating an obvious conflict of interest as guardian.

    7) Michael has committed both perjury (2 counts) and insurance fraud by promising to provide care and therapy for his wife in exchange for the court award of 1.2 million dollars in 1993. No care has ever been provided to Terri.

    8) Michael Schiavo has also prevented Terri from undergoing a barium swallow test, a procedure necessary to ascertain the consistency of foods able to be taken by mouth.

    9) Co-conspirator George J. Felos combined and conspired with Michael Schiavo to arrange for Terri's "free" stay at Hospice Woodside as part of an "exit protocol" designed to advance Felos' self-perceived messianic mission of "helping" incapacitated people to die by categorizing them as "terminal," warehousing them, and depriving them of therapy and rehabilitation services. (Attorney Felos is Director of Florida Right to Die and has testified that he can ascertain a person's desire to die by "looking into their eyes and letting their spirit speak directly to him")

    10) Investigate Insurance company established in Jan 2001 at the home of Michael Schiavo and his girlfriend/fiancee Jody Centonze. (Jerger and Centonze Insurnace Agency Inc.) Michael is listed on the Board of Directors for the corporation. Note: Insurance is deliberately misspelled in the State of Florida Corporate filing, possibly to avoid investigation.

    11) Michael continues to deny Terri the right to receive Holy Communion as part of her Catholic and civil right.
  13. by   snowfreeze
    Anorexia woman's family wants to keep her alive forever. Hey, where did the anorexia begin. Self acceptance starts with a stable family environment. The husband married a slightly unstable woman also and did he know she was anorexic or was he just drawn to a very skeletal type profile? Was his mom anorexic and he saw that growing up in a stable home and thought that was what was normal?