Excelsior BSN vs BS Health Science

Cyndee, MSN, NP · Aug 27, 2006

If you're going on to be a PA, then there is no reason to get your BSN first. Although, if you can't find a job as a PA, then you're gonna wish you had that RN after your name!

MedictoRN · Aug 28, 2006

I haven't met a PA without a job, but I'm sure they are out there. I already have my RN. Just looking toward the future.

Cyndee, MSN, NP · Aug 29, 2006

I haven't met a PA without a job, but I'm sure they are out there. I already have my RN. Just looking toward the future.

Why aren't you doing the RN to NP route? There are schools where you totally skip the BSN and got right to the Master's degree. There are plenty of PA's out there without a job. Go to the PA forum and look at some of their threads. I live in TX and we work independently/collaboratively with a physician. Doctors prefer NP's over PA's in my area strictly because they feel we are less of a liability. If a NP screws up, he/she stands alone, but if a PA screws up, the doc will be pulled into the lawsuit every single time.

MedictoRN · Aug 30, 2006

All of the literature I can find leads me to believe that PA's have a more w comprehensive scope of practice if not a more autonomous practice than that of a NP. At least here in Michigan the scope of practice laws seems to be this way. Also I've talked to several NP's that wish they had the clinical experiences their conterpart PA's had in school.

It may be all just a matter of perspective, but that is essentially why I have chosen the PA route.

Cyndee, MSN, NP · Aug 30, 2006

all of the literature i can find leads me to believe that pa's have a more w comprehensive scope of practice if not a more autonomous practice than that of a np. at least here in michigan the scope of practice laws seems to be this way. also i've talked to several np's that wish they had the clinical experiences their conterpart pa's had in school.
it may be all just a matter of perspective, but that is essentially why i have chosen the pa route.

you need to go to the physicianassistantforum.com and check out the new thread: when i grow up i want to be a np...here's a little excerpt.

oh, and don't forget to look for the post about the np having to cosign for the pa - ha ha ha ha!!!! these are all new posts (within the past 3 weeks).

when i grow up i want to be an np

i know that we've had this np vs pa discussion, but today . . . i wish i were an np.

a year ago i started working on creating an urgent care clinic on our island. i did a lot of footwork putting things together. my bottle neck came when i started to recruit a md to sign on as sp (paid well for chart review etc.). the mds on the island belong to one of two large groups. both, came out opposed to an urgent care clinic . . . seeing it as a competitor.

while i was in limbo, looking outside our area for a willing md, the office i was looking at to rent . . . suddenly was leased out to a mysterous renter.

after renovation behind closed doors . . . suddenly it opened as "[color=#496690]fidalgo (our island) walk in clinic." it was started by a np.

i shared with her if it grew to the point that she need a partner (which, according to my research, i knew that it would) to give me a call.

well, she has reached that point and today started looking for a partner . . . but an np only. why . . . nps in the state of washington need no . . . that is no relationship with an md. i know that i may sound dumb, but i didn't know that before today. i went and read all the legislation on the books and learned that in the state of washington, nps have had the freedom to open their own clinics since 1972!

this urgent care clinic will be a great business success and it is a little disappointing that i, as a pa, could not realize this dream.

makes me wonder again if the aapa took the right path thirty years ago to make sure we stayed dependent.

okay, maybe tomorrow i will awaken and be glad i am a pa instead of a np . . . but for tonight . . .

mike

Ginger's Mom, MSN, RN · Aug 30, 2006

Yes, I live in Mass and NP do not have to work under the supervision of a MD. Also if I had a choice between NP or PA, I would choose the NP since they have the nursing background wear as the PA only know the medical model.

In answer to your original question a BS would be the shorter route and if you decide to continue with Nursing you could get your MSN.

Draken · Sep 4, 2006

I live in northern cali and I have seen a huge pay spread with the PA's here.

I have seen some of the local (Del Norte) clinics pay a dermatology PA 130k but have seen a private doctor pay a PA 1500 a month based on the commision the PA gets per patient.

I know as soon as I am done with my RN I will never take less then I will make as a RN.

I know of atleast one program that accepts ADN for their 18 month PA program and at the end you can take the test for Nurse Practitioner. You can then take these college credits to San Francisco have them applied to a BSN if you do their masters program.

When I go to apply, if they tell me "well we raised the standards we just had too many RN's applying since last year" I am gonna be upset. =p

http://pcap.stanford.edu/program/

http://pcap.stanford.edu/admissions/prerequisites.html

http://pcap.stanford.edu/program/np.html

Cyndee, MSN, NP · Sep 4, 2006

I live in northern cali and I have seen a huge pay spread with the PA's here.
I have seen some of the local (Del Norte) clinics pay a dermatology PA 130k but have seen a private doctor pay a PA 1500 a month based on the commision the PA gets per patient.
I know as soon as I am done with my RN I will never take less then I will make as a RN.
I know of atleast one program that accepts ADN for their 18 month PA program and at the end you can take the test for Nurse Practitioner. You can then take these college credits to San Francisco have them applied to a BSN if you do their masters program.
When I go to apply, if they tell me "well we raised the standards we just had too many RN's applying since last year" I am gonna be upset. =p
http://pcap.stanford.edu/program/
http://pcap.stanford.edu/admissions/prerequisites.html
http://pcap.stanford.edu/program/np.html

It's important that you know that there are only 2 states (that I know of) where you don't have to be nationally certified to be a nurse practitioner. Those states are California and Florida. In order to get certified by the ANCC you MUST have a Master of Science degree to become a NP. I know of someone who went through that Stanford program (your degree won't say "Stanford"...only the lab classes are held there) and then moved to Rhode Island and can NOT work as a Nurse Practitioner. Until you obtain a MSN degree and become nationally certified, you will only be able to practice in 2 states and that is going to change in the near future. Also, I know several older NP's who only have an ADN and went through a NP certification course here in Texas. While they have been "grandfathered in" and can practice in Texas, they can NOT practice in other states simply because they can't meet their educational requirements. Also, NP's from other states who were "grandfathered" in their states will not be able to practice here in TX, because they won't meet our educational standards. If I were you, I would definitely go straight through the MSN program so you can practice in every state.

Draken · Sep 4, 2006

"Two California State Universities allow credit and advanced standing for a higher degree upon completion of the PCA program. San Jose State University allows credit toward a Bachelor of Science in the Health Sciences or a Bachelor of Science in Nursing for nurses. San Francisco State University allows credit toward a Baccalaureate or Master's degree in Nursing. The amount of additional time and schooling involved in pursuing advanced degrees varies and depends on coursework completed by a student prior to entering the Primary Care Associate Program."

I thought i posted that they accept the units toward the masters program required by the other states.

ADN-BSN or BSN-MSN what ever you wanna do if you feel you need to be somewhere else there is always a way.

http://www.sfsu.edu/~bulletin/current/programs/nursing.htm#3453

"CERTIFICATE IN FAMILY NURSE PRACTITIONER

The Family Nurse Practitioner Certificate enables master's and doctoral prepared nurses to change roles and attain certification. The certificate is a 30-unit course of post-graduate study. Completion of the certificate verifies to the California Board of Registered Nursing that the students meet all requirements for licensure as nurse practitioners and also provides documentation to professional organizations that all requirements for national certification examinations were completed. The certificate program includes the courses listed under the concentration in family nurse practitioner and additional courses chosen in consultation with an adviser."

This accepted well over Excelsior BSN as far as i can tell you can't even work in cali with a Excelsior BSN.

But to each his own everyone does their own path if you want to be a NP in cali this is the shortest route and if you want to move you can take 2 semesters (unless you have some obscure vocational path to RN) and meet national requirements.

EricJRN, MSN, RN · Sep 5, 2006

note from your friendly moderator:

we've veered off topic here. as the op has already selected a career path, please try to stay on the topic of 'excelsior bsn vs bs health science.'