Englewood Hospital & Medical Center Locks Out Nurses

PICUPNP · Jun 7, 2009

Just another reason to not unionize. It has no position in this industry. We do not need others to speak for us! Sounds like a money making opportunity to me...might just head north for a spell.........

nicurn001 · Jun 8, 2009

Just another reason to not unionize. It has no position in this industry. We do not need others to speak for us! Sounds like a money making opportunity to me...might just head north for a spell.........

There we have it in a nutshell , your only concern is the possible financial gain you can make !.No concern as to why the nurses voted for a possible strike and were locked out , no assessment of what lead up to the present situation .Only " Sounds like a money making opportunity to me ".

One of the factors the nurses wanted was better ratio's , but maybe you don't care about that , only appearing to be concerned that individuals stand up to Management by themselves , I'm sure that works !,any time that happened where I've worked , you could count the days till some reason was found to fire that nurse .

You may (as you have said you do on other threads ) go to administration ,with your day to day problems ,but wait for the day you have a moral /ethical problem at work , which will either cost money to fix , or can be swept under the table , will you allow it to be swept under the table , or risk your job when managment has made it clear they will can you if you don't drop the matter ?. That would not be a money making opportunity for you , so I guess I know the answer !.

PICUPNP · Jun 8, 2009

I certainly do care but unionization is not conducive to the nursing philosophy. I think that ANY nurse that goes out on strike is abandoning their patients and should be summarily fired! All unions are good for are to force a wedge between the admin and the nurses.

ps- don't take it so personally!

lindarn · Jun 8, 2009

Just another reason to not unionize. It has no position in this industry. We do not need others to speak for us! Sounds like a money making opportunity to me...might just head north for a spell.........

Nurses have tried for years to, "speak for themselves", concerning working conditions, wages, benefits, etc. All they have to show for it, is being the lowest paid group of healthcare professionals, the least respected, (spare me the, "nurses are rated the most trusted profession"). Trust does not equate salary, control of the professsional education, working conditions, etc.

It seems to me that you are all kidding yourselves into believing that you REALLY HAVE CONTROL AND A VOICE IN YOU WORKPLACE, AND PROFESSION. Speaking for yourselves has been a big collossal failure, and very overrated! JMHO and my NY $0.02.

Lindarn, Rn, BSN, CCRN

Spokane, Washington

blue'smom · Jun 8, 2009

I certainly do care but unionization is not conducive to the nursing philosophy. I think that ANY nurse that goes out on strike is abandoning their patients and should be summarily fired! All unions are good for are to force a wedge between the admin and the nurses.
ps- don't take it so personally!

Sounds like they weren't on strike but were forced out when they couldn't come to an agreement with the hospital. Most of us do take these issues personally because it is our personal commitment to our career and the care we show to our patients. I read my state's BON rules and abandonment occurs if you left in the middle of your shift. If the facility fails to properly staff and cover shifts, it is abandonment by the facility. Although I do concede that covering for striking workers would be quite the burden, it should have a backup plan as this could be a foreseeable event if an agreement is not happening and issues are contentious.

nicurn001 · Jun 9, 2009

It takes two to Tango , so when Management was not willing to negotiate upon an important healthcare issue ie.adequate staffing . The union canvassed it's member to see if this was something they felt strongly about , the membership voted to say yes they would strike . At this point management had the opportunity to address staffing , but chose not to , instead it prepared for a strike and then locked the nurses out .

I personally prefer not to strike ( without the ability to withdraw our labor we have no leverage ) . I feel it is unethical to perpetuate the poor even , dangerous staffing that some administrations impose in their hospitals , whilst others feel withdrawing labor for a short period ( which is covered by strike breaking nurses )is unethical .

A wedge can only be driven into a weak point , if managment valued their greatest asset , their staff , there would be no need for a union in that facility

momatwork · Jun 12, 2009

HPAE, the union representing the nurses at Englewood, issued a 10 day strike notice. When HPAE did not rescind that notice by midnight, the hospital has no choice but to hire agency nurses. There are patients in the community that still require care. When the agency is contracted, the hospital is not about to pay salaries to nurses from HPAE as well. The nurses at Englewood, by majority, voted for a strike. Its unfortunate that the union uses this measure to achieve what they want in a cointract. Its administrators continue to be paid, and its the nursing staff that suffers. The hospital immediately stops paying them, and their healthcare benefits, and can permenantly replace them. In this economy, not the smartest move. Also, to tell people not the use the facility, will only serve to decrease revenue, and potentially put the hospital at a loss. HPAE in a strategy move, has I believe 8 union contracts all up for renewal at the same time, and use the strike card as a means to an end. Does anyone remeber Pascack Valley? While I am not blaming the union for its entire eventual closure, the strikes and union demands were certainly a contributing factor. As a lockout at Bayonne Medical Center (also HPAE) started this week, I hope this hospital does not fall victim to closure as well. Its future is precarious to say the least, and would be hardfelt in the community.

momatwork · Jun 12, 2009

new jersey law requires hospitals to compile and report information on the number of staff involved in direct patient care.

hospitals must post staffing information daily in the facility, provide the information when requested by the public, and report monthly to dhss.

here are englewood's. perhaps i'm missing something, but they don't look bad to me.

report of hospital patient care staffing

englewood hospital and medical center

hospital profile; quality indicators and servicesstaffing for quarter ending december 31, 2008 overview inpatient units: average daily ratiosadult intensive care unit/critical care unitstaff typenumber of patients per staff registered professional nurse 1.4 licensed practical nurse 0.0 unlicensed assistive personnel 44.8

adult open psychiatricstaff typenumber of patients per staff registered professional nurse 5.9 lpn/certified psychiatric screener 11.6 unlicensed assistive personnel 5.5

intermediate carestaff typenumber of patients per staff registered professional nurse 2.0 licensed practical nurse 0.0 unlicensed assistive personnel 25.5

medical-surgicalstaff typenumber of patients per staff registered professional nurse 5.4 licensed practical nurse 0.0 unlicensed assistive personnel 11.2

neonatal intensive bassinetsstaff typenumber of patients per staff registered professional nurse 1.7 licensed practical nurse 0.0 unlicensed assistive personnel 0.0

neonatal intermediate bassinetsstaff typenumber of patients per staff registered professional nurse 2.6 licensed practical nurse 0.0 unlicensed assistive personnel 0.0

obstetrics (post partum)staff typenumber of patients per staff registered professional nurse 5.1 licensed practical nurse 0.0 unlicensed assistive personnel 16.5

pediatricsstaff typenumber of patients per staff registered professional nurse 2.6 licensed practical nurse 0.0 unlicensed assistive personnel 3.7

hospital-wide and special units: average daily patients and staffemergency department number of patients: 108.6staff typedaily staff registered professional nurse 8.2 licensed practical nurse 0.0 unlicensed assistive personnel 3.5

other licensed health care professionals staff typedaily staff respiratory care practitioner 3.9

*care for mothers and care for babies is provided on the obstetrics (post partum) inpatient unit for this hospital.

morte, LPN, LVN · Jun 12, 2009

new jersey law requires hospitals to compile and report information on the number of staff involved in direct patient care.
hospitals must post staffing information daily in the facility, provide the information when requested by the public, and report monthly to dhss.
here are englewood's. perhaps i'm missing something, but they don't look bad to me.
report of hospital patient care staffing
englewood hospital and medical center
hospital profile; quality indicators and servicesstaffing for quarter ending december 31, 2008 overview inpatient units: average daily ratiosadult intensive care unit/critical care unitstaff typenumber of patients per staff registered professional nurse 1.4 licensed practical nurse 0.0 unlicensed assistive personnel 44.8
adult open psychiatricstaff typenumber of patients per staff registered professional nurse 5.9 lpn/certified psychiatric screener 11.6 unlicensed assistive personnel 5.5
intermediate carestaff typenumber of patients per staff registered professional nurse 2.0 licensed practical nurse 0.0 unlicensed assistive personnel 25.5
medical-surgicalstaff typenumber of patients per staff registered professional nurse 5.4 licensed practical nurse 0.0 unlicensed assistive personnel 11.2
neonatal intensive bassinetsstaff typenumber of patients per staff registered professional nurse 1.7 licensed practical nurse 0.0 unlicensed assistive personnel 0.0
neonatal intermediate bassinetsstaff typenumber of patients per staff registered professional nurse 2.6 licensed practical nurse 0.0 unlicensed assistive personnel 0.0
obstetrics (post partum)staff typenumber of patients per staff registered professional nurse 5.1 licensed practical nurse 0.0 unlicensed assistive personnel 16.5
pediatricsstaff typenumber of patients per staff registered professional nurse 2.6 licensed practical nurse 0.0 unlicensed assistive personnel 3.7
hospital-wide and special units: average daily patients and staffemergency department number of patients: 108.6staff typedaily staff registered professional nurse 8.2 licensed practical nurse 0.0 unlicensed assistive personnel 3.5
other licensed health care professionals staff typedaily staff respiratory care practitioner 3.9
*care for mothers and care for babies is provided on the obstetrics (post partum) inpatient unit for this hospital.

most of this i can not understand.....but the first ratio seems to be 4:1 in the icu....and you dont have a problem with that>???!!!!....

nicurn001 · Jun 12, 2009

Morte ,hopefully momatwork will clarify those numbers ,but I interpret that figure re. adult ICU as 1 Nurse to 1.4 patients . As it is an average I would be interested to know , the number of patients the unit can take and what RN's are included in coming to that average ie. does it include Charge nurse and case manager , or other RN's scheduled for that floor but not directly involved in patient care ?, as they could skew the average .

nicurn001 · Jun 12, 2009

hpae, the union representing the nurses at englewood, issued a 10 day strike notice. when hpae did not rescind that notice by midnight, the hospital has ( "has "should be had, as they already had already hired the agency nurses , at this point ) no choice but to hire agency nurses. there are patients in the community that still require care. when the agency is contracted, the hospital is not about to pay salaries to nurses from hpae as well. the nurses at englewood, by majority, voted for a strike. its unfortunate that the union uses this measure to achieve what they want in a cointract ( it is indeed unfortunate that a majority of the nurses voted for a strike , nurses do not like to strike , so it should tell you something about this hospital administration , that the nurses tokk this action ). its administrators continue to be paid, and its the nursing staff that suffers. the hospital immediately stops paying them again you make my point , even with this knowledge , the nurses voted to strike ., and their healthcare benefits, and can permenantly replace them. in this economy, not the smartest move. also, to tell people not the use the facility, will only serve to decrease revenue, and potentially put the hospital at a loss. hpae in a strategy move, has i believe 8 union contracts all up for renewal at the same time, and use the strike card as a means to an end the threat of a strike is used as a last measure , when administration will not negotiate ,the only options available , is to allow administration , as in this case staff inadequately ( for some reason the staff must feel this is a reality,or they would not have voted for the strike ) , or to threaten a strike in order to get administration to negotiate . . does anyone remeber pascack valley? while i am not blaming the union for its entire eventual closure, the strikes and union demands were certainly a contributing factor. as a lockout at bayonne medical center (also hpae) started this week, i hope this hospital does not fall victim to closure as well. its future is precarious to say the least, and would be hardfelt in the community.

lets just think of this from a business point of view (as many opposed to unions say all they are interested in is gaining money through more dues ), if the unions systematically bankrupt all these facilities , they end up with less members , less members leads to less income which is not in their interest .

both sides of the workforce deserve praise when a facility does well , both sides should be chastised when facilities are performing badly , but all we seem to hear is that it's the unions fault when a facility failed .i just wonder why we don't ask where , were the managment and what part did they play in the failure ?.