Do You Want Universal Healthcare?

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I know this topic has been discussed before on this site..but, I was curious for an updated response. How many of you would be willing to pay more taxes for universal healthcare? I find it egregious that the US has put a cost on maintaining/saving ones life! I traveled to Europe and the thought of them having to bring their checkbook to the hospital aroused literal laughs. It's the same notion that we'd have to whip out our debit card to firefighters before they turned the hoses on our burning homes. It's sad. I think the overall costs of UH would be beneficial...in fact, the raised taxes would still probably be lower than our rising premiums every 2 weeks! Thoughts?

1. it is a social welfare entitlement program.

i guess this is where we agree to disagree because i feel that everyone should be entitled to medicaid or something similar. rich, poor, black, white, christian, satanist, gay, straight... whatever.

2. fraud consumes more than 10% of monies.

fraud on who's part? the patient's? or the hospitals/doctors? because i gotta tell ya...fraud is happening on a huge scale, and its not just in medicaid. insurance fraud is such a massive massive money maker. the fraud is happening to you and to me and to all of us, whether we go to the doctor's via medicaid or blue cross blue shield or whatever other flavor we call 'insurance' any idea how much of the money we pay for insurance goes towards non-legit expenses? or how many bills are sent out of docs offices that are way way far off? my gp quite often tries to bill my insurance for things that are not quite legit and covers it up as a "coding error" when i throw a fit about it or they refuse to pay for it. fraud and misuse of funds is happening, but its happening a lot more in private sector than maybe you realize?

3. it is a social welfare entitlement program.

if everyone is entitled to healthcare, there is no shame in "entitlement" :)

4. constitutes 20 to 30% of a states budget (more than education).

think of the offset if we took the money we dump into insurance companies and spent it on medicaid...and the resources we could consolidate instead of using to provide staffing for hundreds of said insurance companies and adjustors etc

national avg. 16.8%, 3.94% for al and 40.18% for oh per kaiser

http://www.statehealthfacts.org/comparetable.jsp?ind=33&cat=1&sort=1212

5. did i mention it is a social welfare entitlement program?if everyone is entitled to healthcare, there is no shame in "entitlement" :)

6. it is ever expanding, 'cause if he can have it so can i! if he can have 911 service (or insert other public "entitlement" here) then so can i! with a side of french fries please! it should be ever expanding as long as our population is expanding. if it means someone who needs help gets it, i will happily see my taxes go there. i can think of a lot worse things our taxes are going towards than the healthcare of our citizens...but thats a whole 'nother thread! :D

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Specializes in Emergency/ Critical Care.
I don't really see anyone up here as "abusing" the system. It is meant for everyone so everyone can get care.There aren't any citizens that aren't allowed to get health care, it is intended to be for everyone.

Well although I LOVE our healthcare system, I have to disagree on this one. There are people who abuse the system (2am ambulance ride for a earrache x 3 weeks for example). I would just rather deal with the small percentage who abuse the system so that it can still be available to all. I think its a small price to pay.

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Specializes in Mursing.
I don't really see anyone up here as "abusing" the system. It is meant for everyone so everyone can get care.There aren't any citizens that aren't allowed to get health care, it is intended to be for everyone.

I apologize - perhaps abuse isn't the proper term. I should've used 'mis-use." NursStudent1980 has a perfect example.

Our health care system is far from perfect. We have long waiting times, unbelievable staffing shortages, and an overtaxed system. Would I still use it? Hell yes I would. I can't imagine having to go into a hospital, getting traeted, and then have to pay for it. Maybe it's just because I was brought up here, and the concept of paying for my health isn't registering, but for me (ethically) I don't believe we can put a price tag on our health.

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http://www.independent.co.uk/news/wo...cy-869736.html

http://www.measureofamerica.org/2008...port/factoids/

food for thought you spend more and achieve less, may be if it was intergrated...

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i guess this is where we agree to disagree because i feel that everyone should be entitled to medicaid ...fraud and misuse of funds is happening, but its happening a lot more in private sector than maybe you realize?...if everyone is entitled to healthcare, there is no shame in "entitlement" :)...if we took the money we dump into insurance companies and spent it on medicaid...if everyone is entitled to healthcare, there is no shame in "entitlement" :)...if it means someone who needs help gets it, i will happily see my taxes go there.

who does not get help under the current system? emtala takes care of those who can't. isn't that what you asked for?

what this country does need is wellness education and healthy life style changes.

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A simple observation, no criticism meant, but I wonder why so many Canada citizens are so adamant in their support for Universal Health Care in the US? Just trying to spread the joy?

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Specializes in Mursing.
A simple observation, no criticism meant, but I wonder why so many Canada citizens are so adamant in their support for Universal Health Care in the US? Just trying to spread the joy?

That's a good point. Canadians and Americans have so many similarities on a vast number of traits; however, Canadians value their healthcare like no other. Perhaps American and Canadian difference in this aspect leads to our support for universal health care in the US.

Or we could be trying to spread the joy.

Or perhaps we are sad to see our neighbours treat their own citizens in such a cutthroat manner.

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Specializes in icu, er, transplant, case management, ps.
1. it is a social welfare entitlement program.

i guess this is where we agree to disagree because i feel that everyone should be entitled to medicaid or something similar. rich, poor, black, white, christian, satanist, gay, straight... whatever. it is only a social entitlement program when the tax payers pay for it. otherwise it is an employee benefit.

2. fraud consumes more than 10% of monies.

fraud on who's part? the patient's? or the hospitals/doctors? because i gotta tell ya...fraud is happening on a huge scale, and its not just in medicaid. insurance fraud is such a massive massive money maker. the fraud is happening to you and to me and to all of us, whether we go to the doctor's via medicaid or blue cross blue shield or whatever other flavor we call 'insurance' any idea how much of the money we pay for insurance goes towards non-legit expenses? or how many bills are sent out of docs offices that are way way far off? my gp quite often tries to bill my insurance for things that are not quite legit and covers it up as a "coding error" when i throw a fit about it or they refuse to pay for it. fraud and misuse of funds is happening, but its happening a lot more in private sector than maybe you realize? want to know howmuch an hca hospitaql billed medicare after my $50,000 car medical coverage was all used up following a thirty-five hour stay? want to know how many errors i found in their bill after i audited it?

3. it is a social welfare entitlement program.

if everyone is entitled to healthcare, there is no shame in "entitlement" :)

4. constitutes 20 to 30% of a states budget (more than education).

think of the offset if we took the money we dump into insurance companies and spent it on medicaid...and the resources we could consolidate instead of using to provide staffing for hundreds of said insurance companies and adjustors etc i know how much money would be saved:yeah:

national avg. 16.8%, 3.94% for al and 40.18% for oh per kaiser

http://www.statehealthfacts.org/comparetable.jsp?ind=33&cat=1&sort=1212

5. did i mention it is a social welfare entitlement program?if everyone is entitled to healthcare, there is no shame in "entitlement" :)

6. it is ever expanding, 'cause if he can have it so can i! if he can have 911 service (or insert other public "entitlement" here) then so can i! with a side of french fries please! it should be ever expanding as long as our population is expanding. if it means someone who needs help gets it, i will happily see my taxes go there. i can think of a lot worse things our taxes are going towards than the healthcare of our citizens...but thats a whole 'nother thread! :D

couldn't agree with you more:bowingpur:yeah::D

woody:twocents:

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A simple observation, no criticism meant, but I wonder why so many Canada citizens are so adamant in their support for Universal Health Care in the US? Just trying to spread the joy?

Its not that people cannot technically get some sort of care if they are in critical need. Its the idea of going permanently into debt because of a tragedy along with the way that our current system discourages people from getting preventative/early intervention treatment, unless they have medicaid. Those with private insurance can rack up a $1000 a year debt for an average sized family easily WITH the average deductible/copay arrangement.

If I have a life threatening illness at some point in my life, I have to pray that its a gunshot wound or a car accident induced broken body or something else that is "emergent" so that I don't have to worry about scrounging up the money to be seen by someone outside of the emergency room. I guess I could go to the ER for an ear ache, but those bills haunt me forever and to be quite honest, I wouldn't feel right going there for something that was not an emergency because there are just too many people who need to be in those seats more than I.

MAYBE we could revamp the current system so that it worked better. I would be all for it, if it was done right. My reasons for wanting universal healthcare are thus:

  1. Copays and deductibles should be illegal, period - people should not have to worry about finances when they are sick and debate gas money vs doctor visits - I'm all for paying premiums, as long as they don't get so high that it takes away our quality of life and as long as preventative / early intervention care is encouraged by our healthplans
  2. There should also be a middle ground for people who are able to work, but cannot afford to live on minimum wage MINUS the cost of healthcare... maybe some sort of sliding scale goverment subsidized insurance or something... maybe with incentives to get a better job or some other way of helping people get a step up. I don't condone paying welfare so some momma w/ a half dozen 'baby daddies' (and no real fathers) can go have a dozen kids and sit on her oversized butt all day long, but I do think that we should be able to help struggling citizens who, for one reason or another, are not able to make enough to sustain their family... IMO our welfare system is all sorts of screwed up and it would do us a world of good to revamp it so that it favors those who WANT to do better, instead of those who refuse to do anything from themselves (but thats another thread :) )
  3. Claim denials should have some sort of independent oversight committee or something to make sure that people are not getting screwed by their insurance companies (i.e. someone has healthcare insurance fine for 10 years then suddenly gets ill and they drop her due to some loop hole... or an ambulance visit is not covered even though obviously there was medical personnel and medical assistance provided...or a procedure is not covered because the 'insurance' deems its not necessary more than x amt of times even though the doctor/dentist/whatever feels its of critical importance) Who should be making our healthcare decisions after all? number crunchers or physicians who went to school for 8+ years to know whats "needed" and what is not??
  4. Benefit limitations need to be addressed - maybe there is a government program to help people who hit the limit of their insurance coverage, or some sort of hospital grant or something to reward hospitals for writing off amts above insurance caps or something... hospitals get so much free money and are so accreditation happy that something for them might work out pretty well
  5. Someone (who is qualified to do so...not number crunchers or those directly benefiting by their actions) should be watching over the medical system in place to make SURE that they are using best practices and practicing evidence based medicine instead of profit based/lawsuit fearing medicine... which they clearly are not, if you look at our current labor and delivery standard care model (the only part of healthcare that I have researched extensively although I'm sure there is evidence of this elsewhere)

I guess then I'm not so much saying that I feel we NEED to have universal healthcare, but that we have a very screwed up private healthcare system right now and something BIG needs to happen to make this system work better.

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i support single payer, universal health care for the following reasons.

1. i do believe that as a so called christian nation we have a responsibility to care for the sick and the poor. hum who said that?

2. a single payer sysytem woud be less expensive than the current system. i pay nearly 3,000 a year for my families premium and then there is a 500 per person and 2,00 family deductible and a 20 co pay for every visit and this is the best plan offered. my employeer is paying another 7-10 thousand a year. that makes the total to 15 to 17 thousand depending on the use of the insurance. what a bargain.

if the burdon were lifted from the employeer they would have no excuse to keep refusing to increase wages.

3. in general medicare and medicaid patients get better care than most private insured. most peoples insurance is inadequate when it comes to after and long term care and most people loose their insurance soon after a debilitating injury or illness due to inability to pay for the cobra cost of 8-15k a year.

4. there are at least 10 typesof universal health care operating in 1 st world countries. canada and the uk are only two examples.

this link will take you to a video presntation on pbs that compares the us system to that of universal health care systems around the world.

[color=#445566]http://www.pbs.org/wgbh/pages/frontline/sickaroundtheworld/

5. its just the right thing to do. the reason we pay so much more for health care in the us is not because as we like to believe that we are the greatest but that it is a for profit system with the insurance companies, hospitals and suppliers all trying to get their piece of the pie. we pay more and get less. we are dying faster, have higher infant mortality rates and fall short in all other matters of health when compared to other large nations of the world. we need a change and we need it now.

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1. I do believe that as a so called Christian nation we have a responsibility to care for the sick and the poor. Hum who said that?

I know this is off topic and I know I shouldn't go down this road but....

Who said we were a "christian nation"?

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Specializes in behavioral health.

Universal Healthcare - Absolutely not!!! I did a speech on this topic back in the early 90s. People would have to wait forever to have surgery, or whatever. I have a friend that lives in Canada, and she likes it. However, she explained all of the cons, and I would not like it want it.

However, ability for Americans to afford Healthcare coverage - YES! Everyone should have the ability to afford healthcare!

There are people that can afford healthcare, but it is not a priority with them. They simply don't wish to part with their money to pay the premiums. They would rather spend this money on alcohol and/or drugs. And, there will come a time in their life they will not be able to afford all of the tests, or cost of transpant, and die! This happened to my brother who died at age of 51 of advanced liver disease. He was a brilliant man and an attorney. He was extremely booksmart. He scored the highest on the bar exam in state of CA.out of all those who took the bar at same time. However, health insurance was never a priority to him. He was strictly a "cash" man. But, all of those years of drinking and drug abuse caught up with him. He did not have enough cash for all of the care that would possibly save him. So, death was his choice. We all miss him terribly! He was functional alcoholic with a very big heart!

Now, let me discuss my ex - He had been trying to get disability for yrs. Initially, I believe that he was just lazy. He had a shoulder injury(which happend when he fell off balcony while drunk). However, this past year he becam a "real" candidate for disability. Hep. C, advanced cirrhosis, and liver cancer. He got his disability ater his cancer diagnosis. His only hope is a transplant. Not, the best prognosis, but he has one hell of a chance, if he finds compatable liver. Medicaid, helped him get the necessary care.

Am I bitter, that my brother was not helped more because he did not hve insurance. NO!! As much as I loved him and miss him, I feel that it was his choice not to purchase health insurance. And, he was able to afford it when he was relatively healthy.

There should be affordable healthcare to all, though! And, people who do not purchase it will suffer their own consequences. However, it should be a law to provide medical coverage for children. Just like immunizations, parents hould be forced to provide health insurance for their children. I purchased CHIP for my children when they were younger, when I could not afford the COBRA dependent premiums. So, there should be affordable alternatives to all.

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