Do you think this law is fair in regards to healthcare workers in Illinois?

**NickiLaughs, ADN, BSN, RN** · Aug 23, 2011

I could see this crossing the line on occasion for that rare case involving a misunderstanding. But I think that it's a great protection for patients. What concern me is that you said many nurses and physicians are losing their license.

kalevra, BSN, RN · Aug 23, 2011

here in illinois today, a law just went into effect, revoking any health care professional who practice under a license or certificate from working in the health care field who were convicted of sexual assault, misdemanor battery against a patient, or any forcible felony against a patient. many practicing doctors and nurses alike lost their illinois license...do you feel that this law is justifiable, or do you think that those who were convicted should be given a second chance especially if they were not a multiple offender. would like to hear other people views on this issue.

i find it strange that they are still practicing after being convicted of such serious crimes. the other part that worries me is how many practicing doctors and nurses have been convicted of sexual assault and still treating patients? are we talking children?

dudette10, MSN, RN · Aug 23, 2011

I'm going through them one by one. I think it's important to look at the definitions of such crimes in the state, consider whether the conviction is a misdemeanor or a felony, and think about the circumstances that could fit the definition and lead to a conviction.

For example, a bar brawl could lead to a conviction of misdemeanor assault and battery, and we all know that bar brawls are just real clusterfugs in which many people are involved in instigating it, but one person (the convicted) may have just not backed down when he/she should have and got at least one really good punch in. A felony conviction of assault and battery has different criteria and is often more serious (either because of the extent of the injury or because of the relative innocence of the victim, as in the elderly or children).

In other words, you can't just look at the title of the conviction with a layperson's sensibilities and make a judgement.

In Illinois, sexual assault is defined this way:

Criminal Sexual Assault-Criminal Sexual Assault occurs when the accused commits sexual penetration and any of the following conditions exist:
Force or threat of force, or
Defendant knows the victim does not understand the nature of the act, or victim is incapable of consenting, or
Victim is under 18 and the accused is a family member, or
The victim is at least 13 years old but under 18 years old and the accused is 17 years of age or older; and held a position of trust, authority or supervision in relation to the victim.
720 ILCS 5/12-13

It's very difficult to think of any circumstances in which a conviction of sexual assault in Illinois (it was defined this way in 1984) was a "misunderstanding." In addition, a conviction means that some judicial authority also agreed that the circumstances fit the definition of sexual assault. So, for this one, I agree that the license should be revoked.

dudette10, MSN, RN · Aug 23, 2011

misdemeanor battery against a patient is especially prone to quick judgements because of the word "battery." (that layman's sensibility reaction again....) a doctor performing a medical procedure without an informed consent can be considered battery against a patient.

ever been in a code situation where the code of the patient is in flux, due to the family not making a clear decision or miscommunication between the family and other hcws? that could lead to a battery charge if you get a family who is ticked off enough.

i think the misdemeanor battery charge should be looked at on a case-by-case basis.

battery is found in the criminal code at [color=#2361a1]720 ilcs 5/12-3, which provides the following:
a person commits battery if he (or she) intentionally or knowingly without legal justification and by any means causes bodily harm to an individual or makes physical contact of an insulting or provoking nature with an individual.

bagladyrn, RN · Aug 23, 2011

I think this is completely justified. A person convicted of any of these offenses has no business around a vulnerable population such as patients. Note that the only misdemeanor was "battery against a patient", not the kind of assault charge resulting from a bar brawl.

To say "they only did it once" would be like saying "Well he was only convicted of pedophilia once, lets let him coach Little League anyway."

dudette10, MSN, RN · Aug 23, 2011

I think this is completely justified. A person convicted of any of these offenses has no business around a vulnerable population such as patients. Note that the only misdemeanor was "battery against a patient", not the kind of assault charge resulting from a bar brawl.
To say "they only did it once" would be like saying "Well he was only convicted of pedophilia once, lets let him coach Little League anyway."

My example of the bar brawl was to show that circumstances need to be taken into consideration, rather than just reacting to the word "battery" in order to draw a conclusion.

Performing resuscitation on a DNR can be considered battery. However, I don't know if the law makes a distinction between "medical" battery and other types of battery. I can't seem to find any information about that.

dudette10, MSN, RN · Aug 23, 2011

In Illinois, a forcible felony is defined as “treason, first degree murder, second degree murder, aggravated criminal sexual assault, criminal sexual assault, robbery, burglary, arson, aggravated kidnaping, kidnaping, aggravated battery resulting in great bodily harm or permanent disability or disfigurement and any other felony which involves the use or threat of physical force or violence against any individual.” 720 ILCS 5/2-8

Like sexual assault, I can't think of any circumstance in which a forcible felony against a patient would be a misunderstanding.

The only one out of the three mentioned by the OP that may be questionable is the misdemeanor battery against a patient, given my reasons in a previous post.

ETA: Isn't the use of restraints a legal quagmire that can lead to a battery charge if not done by the book?

xtxrn, ASN, RN · Aug 23, 2011

Here in Illinois today, a law just went into effect, revoking any health care professional who practice under a license or certificate from working in the health care field who were convicted of sexual assault, misdemanor battery against a patient, or any forcible felony against a patient. Many practicing doctors and nurses alike lost their Illinois license...Do you feel that this law is justifiable, or do you think that those who were convicted should be given a second chance especially if they were not a multiple offender. Would like to hear other people views on this issue.

Not even a five minute second chance. Sex offenders are perpetrators for life. They are the people who we think about as the creepy slug in the alley waiting to jump someone and rape them- though most look like the guy next door- because they ARE !! :eek: .

I'm in IL, and this is one of the few things they've gotten right recently. IMHO. There are no second chances for violent offenders in my book.... you wanna let them play with your kids or family?- have a ball....but don't sue the state when he ruins their life and leaves nothing but pain in his wake. Multiple offenders became that way because of second chances- how many people need to be ripped to shreds before it's enough to make the OFFENDER pay???

Check the sex offender registry, and see what those guys (and some women) have been CONVICTED of.... wanna see if they'll play nice this time? Not me :)

xtxrn, ASN, RN · Aug 23, 2011

i find it strange that they are still practicing after being convicted of such serious crimes. the other part that worries me is how many practicing doctors and nurses have been convicted of sexual assault and still treating patients? are we talking children?

one was an ed doc- so saw anybody and everybody who came through the door.....

xtxrn, ASN, RN · Aug 23, 2011

Why do we go through criminal background checks??? To see if we palmed a Twinkie from Seven-Eleven??? :uhoh3:

ChinupBSNRN · Aug 23, 2011

Here in Illinois today, a law just went into effect, revoking any health care professional who practice under a license or certificate from working in the health care field who were convicted of sexual assault, misdemanor battery against a patient, or any forcible felony against a patient. Many practicing doctors and nurses alike lost their Illinois license...Do you feel that this law is justifiable, or do you think that those who were convicted should be given a second chance especially if they were not a multiple offender. Would like to hear other people views on this issue.

I absolutely think this law is fair. Laws such as these are put into place to protect the patient. These laws are why as an incoming nursing student I had to pass a federal background check to matriculate into the nursing program. My university knew there was no reason to admit a student that could not be boards eligible or hireable due to a flag on a background check. We had 1 person not pass the background check and an alternate was given his or her spot. Patients in any medical setting are in a vulnerable position. If a healthcare professional has sexually assaulted or committed battery or other felonious acts towards a patient, why would a hospital want to take the risk of them harming another person? I do realize that some people have been through therapy and strive to maintain recovery, but there are times when a second chance could be deadly. I always tell people that not everyone can be a doctor, lawyer, nurse, fireman, hairstylist, daycare provider, or bus driver. Laws place limitations on people who can be a danger based on previous behavior. If we wouldn't want a sex offender teaching elementary school or someone with a DUI driving our kids school bus then why would we want someone who has a history of sexual assault and patient harm taking care of patients? Being a healthcare professional is a privilege, and if one wants the privilege of professional licensure than they should maintain integrity, morals, ethics, and law abiding behavior both on and off the clock.

Just my 2 cents. :twocents: :nurse: