hello everyone, i am writing this hoping that there are some ideas out there that can work for me. basically, i have been told that because of a patient's comment, it's grounds for dismissal. that is correct, based on the incredibly vague wording in our student handbook. i'll bullet the pieces of information, and hope that someone can help me out with this. i am appealing this, but am not hopeful for an outcome in my favor because of the wording of the handbook.
clinical day 11-27-07, everything this day was off, our instructor was hard on everyone. i've typically had a great clinical experience.
my patient this day was day 2 post-op; and had several outside factors that played into her stress; she was experiencing a new pain during my time.
she had at least 4 sets of visitors before lunch; making time with her close to nearly impossible.
the following day, my instructor was back on this floor **i must add that this is a floor that she works supplemental, so she knows several of the floor nurses there** and was told by a floor nurse that the patient said that i seemed nervous caring for her.
6 days later, i get a call to meet with my instructor; final clinical day was to be the next day
she told me of this, and that it qualifies for a roub and because it's reported by a patient / nurse it's grounds for dismissal. dismissal would include a failure in the course. my grades are not suffering, at this point in the clinical portion, i needed approx 10 points out of a possible 50 to pass even with the bare minimum points.
after this meeting, i made an appointment with the director of the program. i stood my ground and requested more information...subjective data needs to be backed by objective data.
this past tuesday i met with both the instructor and the director.
the director talked with the floor nurse and was given this the patient said that she seemed nervous and was scattered, a bath is steps 1-5, she was all over the place.
i about threw up, i did not give this patient a bath. i had prepped her shower because she chose to take a shower that day. however with her pain and visitors, she did not shower before i was through for the day.
i told this to the instructor and director and basically was told "too bad"
other information
i worked with 2 other nurses that day, why haven't they been asked?
one nurse i worked with directly with the patient that made the alleged complaint. one solely with another patient.
this patient had 3 students in three days
the floor aide looks like me
why wasn't the chart checked?
why is this all so vague?
so, since i am a student, i'm not able to even get the basic information regarding who, what, and when the bath was given.
it is me against the patient, nurse, instructor, director, dean, vice president, and president.
who is my advocate?
this is what our handbook says about roub's and discipline (record of unsatisfactory behavior)
4. protocol for implementation of record of unsatisfactory behavior a. the instructor notifies the student of unsatisfactory behavior and its implications when the instructor becomes aware of the behavior. (handbook, 2007-2008) i was notified 6 days later
i am being given this under basis of #3 below...i have not had less than a satisfactory rating, have been written incredible comments about my practice, had letters sent to my instructor from units that were beyond supportive. my points and tests are great. this was all the second to last clinical day; because this wasn't rectified (i didn't sign the record) i was unable to attend the last clinical day.
situations which require review and/or a record of unsatisfactory behavior and which may cause the student to fail the course or be dismissed from the program are: (see e on pg. 13, "termination from the program".)
1) when two unsatisfactory incidents occur in the same academic semester
2) when the same type of unsatisfactory behavior is documented more than once in the same or in a previous semester
3) when hospital staff has expressed grave concern to the instructor regarding a student's clinical performance
4) when the affiliating agency refuses to allow a student to perform in the clinical area
5) when an unusual incident occurs or when a single unsatisfactory behavior is of such magnitude that dismissal from the program is considered
so, was giving a bath nervously a grave concern? was the comment shared in light conversation due to the possible working relationship on the floor of my instructor?
so, an f will go on my gpa, will set me one full year behind, i'm set to graduate in may.
ok, this probably all doesn't flow right, but i would love some input on what options, i have outside of the typical process, dean, vp, pres. one note, is this needs to be rectified by friday of this week (december 21)
thanks for anything in advance, feel free to contact me privately or here if there is more information...
What knd of a nursing program are you going to. I hope for your sake it all turns out OK. Advise-don't be defensive but don't admit fault. "I'm sorry the patient had that complaint but I'm unsure about what specifically I did that prompted that complaint or how to correct it but I am open to any input from my instructors as to how to improve my care." is the best attitude. If this goes beyond a note in your file I would ask if there have been other issues with your care and why the instructor did not help you with this issue before the end of term-isn't that thier job! It sounds to me like they are nit picking, but I don't know your care and there may have been other problems they aren't telling you about. Maybe they are using this as an excuse to discipline you. Posts like yours make me happy to be long out of school. Sounds like "nurses eating thier young" is the philosophy of your program-you may be better off without them. Is there any other program in your area that you could transfer into and keep the credit for your education so far?
If you do get through this with your skin intact it is a good learning experience for what you may encounter in nursing on the whole. Always at fault unless proven otherwise seem to be a common attitude toward nurses. That is why I would never work at a hospital that dosen't have a organised bargining unit (union) to represent the nurses interests- but that is neither here nor there for your situation- hope it works for the best.
Hi. I am sorry that you have been put in that situation.
What kind of mood was the patient in? If she was having additional or new pain how bad was it? What type of medications was the pt on?
All of these factors should be reviewed for your case. How does the nurse that the patient reported you to feel about student nurses?
How are they going to dismiss you on your behavior during a bed bath?
What was your instructors attitude towards you before the incident?
Was he/she just waiting to kick you out, or did the instructor act like they didn't like you?
If your grades and the supporting documentation that was sent in for you are as you say then there shouldn't be any problem.
Did the patient say that you were rude or give anyother information?
I agree in Jedi of Zen---you can't show any kind of attitude. If the instructor persists in this action you need to get a lawyer. You have worked too hard for some idiot to come by and knock your feet out from under you for something as asinine as a bed bath. Good luck to you.
Whoa Amy....I find this incredibly sad. They are taking the word of a patient over yours? What's so bad about seeming to be nervous as a student? I'm sorry I don't have any advice for you except continue to tell the truth and pray that it prevails. I would not give up. Go to whoever you have to get this straightened out. God Bless you hon, Best of luck, let us know.
I was distressed to read about your "situation" this last semester. Sadly, I began nursing school expecting an environment of support and learning - which I have found among my fellow students. I have always felt that if you studied, worked hard, and had a great track record then all would go well. I am a second year student and until my last rotation I have done well and had no problems. Unfortunately, I almost did not pass this last rotation because of circumstances of which I felt I did not have any control over, nor deserved. I did pass but it left me questioning the issue (that continually seems to be a problem in my school) of one professor deciding your fate. I believe that safety is critical and people who aren't safe should not be there. So I don't have a problem with students not passing due to documented and proven issues in this area. I think that there should be an established pattern of concerns and that a committee should decide the fate of that student. Yet, there seems to be personality issues which are not documented patterns of concern that decide some student's fate. This isn't right, though it happens a lot.
So, although I passed, I have learned some valuable lessons about human nature and my own "Polly Anna" ways of looking at things. I can tell you that I will be more cautious in my next and last semester.
I am thinking about you and hoping that everything goes well with your appeal! Keep up updated. Kathy
I would go back to the unit and arrange to see the floor nurse(s) involved and attempt to get their support. They are your best hope in clearing up this matter that never should have happened to begin with. If every student who "appeared nervous" were booted over the one comment, the nursing schools would be producing graduates in the 1-5% rate. It makes no sense. Try to get your floor nurse to address the problem in writing. Good luck with the grievance procedure. I tried it at my school and got nowhere. That does not mean that you won't be successful. Sometimes, people can be found who have some sense in their braincase.
Sorry for your situation, I hope it all works out for you. Was the bath documented? who documented the bath? maybe the patient got you mixed up with another another staff member. Hope everything works out.
When will you find out the results of the Grievance? If you do not yet know the results, I wish you the best. Your whole situation just seems so crazy. It seems like your track record would be looked at and the pt's chart would be reviewed before such severe circumstances.
I am so sorry you are going through this. Let me tell you a story.
A few years ago, my sister and her classmates went through some horrible events with one of their instructors. They (32) filed a grievance. The Dean, Chancellor, Vice Chancellor all got involved.
What happened?
Most students dropped out and/or the instructor failed them for filing the grievance in the first place. Only 20% of those students passed, ironically the 20% were the ones that erased their names from the grievance list. The faculties have the power and they know it.
The same instructor is still terrorizing her current students. Except now, students will not file a grievance. Policy and Procedure does not matter with administration. They can change their policies whenever they want to, with or without your knowledge. Right?
That is why I refused to attend their program.
Getting attorney sounds good but where do you get the money for that? Is there a nursing student done wrong fund? Does anyone know how she can get financial assistance with an attorney? That would be great.
My hopes and prayers are with you. I hope you have support with your classmates.
I agree with what Suanna stated above. Don't be defensive but don't admit fault. Someone else also stated don't put it all on the instructors or something similar to this. I agree with that as well because being put all on the instructors may cause them to be on the defensive. I feel it is human nature to want to displace blame. I'm not saying it is the right thing to do but just that I see it happen so much that it seems to be human nature. If the instructors are put on the defensive they may only want to displace blame.
I hope everyone that replied to my first post sees this, I want to thank you all for being so sweet and supportive. This entire break has been miserable and I've been physically ill because of this situation. well, the secretary of the Vice President called me today and left a voicemail. She said that I would also be getting a letter...but it boils down to the he won't be able to investigate this until the "week after next" --- OK the problem is that school starts on Monday --- so then it will be too late --
well, the secretary of the Vice President called me today and left a voicemail. She said that I would also be getting a letter...but it boils down to the he won't be able to investigate this until the "week after next" --- OK the problem is that school starts on Monday --- so then it will be too late --
what I want to know is, who can look at the damn record and state yes / no my name is there on the documentation of the bath --- I don't want copies but there HAS to be someone that I can contact before Friday so that I can get face to face with them and say "see it for you're own" it's false, I'm not to blame, and let me move on... who, who can legally look at that....
Please keep praying, begging, pleading...jump up and down maybe the VP will fall and hit his head back into common sense thinking and rectify this...I'm sick of feeling sick about this.
)
suanna
1,549 Posts
AAAGGHHHHH!
What knd of a nursing program are you going to. I hope for your sake it all turns out OK. Advise-don't be defensive but don't admit fault. "I'm sorry the patient had that complaint but I'm unsure about what specifically I did that prompted that complaint or how to correct it but I am open to any input from my instructors as to how to improve my care." is the best attitude. If this goes beyond a note in your file I would ask if there have been other issues with your care and why the instructor did not help you with this issue before the end of term-isn't that thier job! It sounds to me like they are nit picking, but I don't know your care and there may have been other problems they aren't telling you about. Maybe they are using this as an excuse to discipline you. Posts like yours make me happy to be long out of school. Sounds like "nurses eating thier young" is the philosophy of your program-you may be better off without them. Is there any other program in your area that you could transfer into and keep the credit for your education so far?
If you do get through this with your skin intact it is a good learning experience for what you may encounter in nursing on the whole. Always at fault unless proven otherwise seem to be a common attitude toward nurses. That is why I would never work at a hospital that dosen't have a organised bargining unit (union) to represent the nurses interests- but that is neither here nor there for your situation- hope it works for the best.