Deciding whether to drop out CRNA school?

burn out · Mar 19, 2007

Thank you for your honest posting. I was wondering if there were any other factors that fed into your quitting. How were they making it harder on you? Verbal harrassment?, etc. I have started antidepressants, which I have never had to take in my life, and I am going to see what my assignments are for this weekend. Can anyone give me insights on Pediatric and OB set-ups--what you'd definitely expect to see in your student's rooom, regardless if they've had these pts before or not? I love everyone's helpful honesty and ability to be so candid. I cannot see the light at the end of the tunnel right now,and I'm trying really hard--I'm hoping these drugs will help. My head's in the clouds all the time now, and the indecision is killing me, and my family (they have been so supportive). Does anyone know if you can claim bankruptcy on private loans for school, like the Sallie Mae?

No you can not claim bankruptcy on government programs, that's the guaranty on the loan.

Yes it was verbal harassment but went beyond that. One day we were transferring a pt. from the OR table back to bed and the central line pulled taunt, the anesthesiologist blamed me for "pulling it out", it was still stitched in place, and was yelling at me. Later I went back knowing there was nothing wrong with the cline and apoligized for something I didn't think I had done wrong. When we were in the locker room at the end of the day I was talking to another student and said I had to grovel at Erics feet over the incident and a female anestheologist was in the room and overheard me. She went to my instructor told them not to let me back there. Instead of the school checking into it and backing me up in any way they took her word and was going to send me to another facility. If I would have gone, the other facility would think I had done something major wrong and have given me an even tougher time. I really didn't think I had done anything wrong, there was another student that was breaking peoples teeth during intubation and they did nothing to him. Maybe I have too much pride but I felt like I would be selling my soul and could notgo on in that situation.

Your situation is different , you do what is best for you. If it is quitting then quit, if it going on then give it your best shot you know what you are in for.

heartICU · Mar 19, 2007

No you can not claim bankruptcy on government programs, that's the guaranty on the loan.
Yes it was verbal harassment but went beyond that. One day we were transferring a pt. from the OR table back to bed and the central line pulled taunt, the anesthesiologist blamed me for "pulling it out", it was still stitched in place, and was yelling at me. Later I went back knowing there was nothing wrong with the cline and apoligized for something I didn't think I had done wrong. When we were in the locker room at the end of the day I was talking to another student and said I had to grovel at Erics feet over the incident and a female anestheologist was in the room and overheard me. She went to my instructor told them not to let me back there. Instead of the school checking into it and backing me up in any way they took her word and was going to send me to another facility. If I would have gone, the other facility would think I had done something major wrong and have given me an even tougher time. I really didn't think I had done anything wrong, there was another student that was breaking peoples teeth during intubation and they did nothing to him. Maybe I have too much pride but I felt like I would be selling my soul and could notgo on in that situation.
Your situation is different , you do what is best for you. If it is quitting then quit, if it going on then give it your best shot you know what you are in for.

Accidentally dislodging a central line during transfer is something that unfortunately can happen if you are not careful. While I understand that when someone is reprimanding you, it may seem that they are yelling, I don't think this falls under the category of verbal harassment. As for the locker room talk, well, perhaps they dismissed you from the clinical site for professionalism issues. I would imagine discussing your supervisor in the locker room where others can hear would get you in trouble regardless of where you worked.

As far as breaking teeth...unfortunately that happens occasionally too. Whether it's due to learning, or difficult airway, or poor dentition, it happens. One of the hazards of anesthesia.

I don't mean any disrespect, but if that's all it took for you to quit, then I think you would have had a hard time in anesthesia as a career. It's a stressful environment, and stressful things happen. You can't be so defensive.

Sorry to be so blunt about your situation, but that my opinion.

Kimmercris · Mar 20, 2007

Hello-

You never have to put up with inappropriate unprofessional behavior. Ever! School alone is mentally and physically exhausting. Who is doing the yelling and the grabbing? Who is your mentor or instructor? If it is your preceptor, discuss this with your school. No one who works with patients in the medical profession should put up with being yelled at, scolded, grabbed, etc... Yes, you need to tough out grueling hours, really "bone" up on your stuff, and present yourself as a professional. You do need to find out who your advocates are, use them, and find out what the institutions policy on harrassing behavior is to handle in calmly, discreetly, and professionally. Do not let people with bad behavior make you drop out. Carry yourself well and demand calmly the respect you deserve as you are learning all of this. Be sure to seek out a mentor who can help you navigate the waters. Also be sure to speak about 20% of the time and listen 80%. Surviving my masters and ARNP school was hard and awful but not that hard and awful. Be encouraged and good luck! kimmercris, arnp, edmonds WA

Joannie · Mar 21, 2007

I don't work in the USA but I have been a nurse for 35 years and there are a couple of points I would like to make. First of all, the experiences related by micugirl may not be like yours, but they are valid nonetheless. None of us have the right to belittle someone else's experience, or their emotional response to that experience.

My second point is that grabbing, yelling and insults are unprofessional, abusive and unacceptable behaviour. Surely your training institution has some kind of personal grievance process ? Or your union? Or maybe you have a good friend who has witnessed this inappropriate behaviour and is willing to go with you to your supervisor?

(Incidentally, in New Zealand and Australia, a nurse can be suspended for this kind of behaviour). In Saudi Arabia, where I currently work, a report of this kind of behaviour results in a visit to the DCNs office for a disciplinary meeting.

Call it what you will, it is horizontal violence, and completely unacceptable.

micugirl · Mar 25, 2007

I am still in my program, and although I have the occasional run-into with the person that was abusive, I have tried to utilize everyone in the forum's advice here, and stick with it. I did try antidepressants, which did not help in that they gave me some bad side effects, so I had a few days off to contemplate more about what I should do. I realize that SSRI's are not the best thing to do if you are contemplating something, because they give you the weight on the decision factor to go ahead and do it...drop out. I stopped taking them, and tried to get to the root of my problem. Like Pete had said, I had a hard time swallowing my pride in many situations, but the truth of the matter is, they know most everything, and I know very little in this field that I did research and shadow for over 60 hours before applying to it.

There is a lot of unspoken verbal and mental abuse that occurs, and yes, while it may make us not make that mistake, it is also breeding those of us who are not able to learn as much because it steals our focus to the way it is taught, rather than what we can learn, or try differently in our clincal site to experience more before graduating. I have both of the sources that were identified, and have had some Peds cases since, that I was told I was way over-prepared for, but I would rather be that , so that I can concentrate on those little precious creatures who are so much more important to us in their well-being. After about 30 more times, maybe I can do it with less sweating, but I will still continue to over-prepare.

I am taking the other person's advice that was saying to go over the steps again and again in my head the night before, and that seems to be helping as well. Thank you very much for that as well.

I know I will be great at this, and to me money is good, yes, but that is not why I chose to do this field, ...it is mainly because in my 4 years of critical care, I only had one person to pass, because I was so anal about preventing problems from happening, and he was a DNR. Thus, I thought this would be great as a career advancement, because you have to stay on top of the ball, but I guess I thought it would not be this hard to comglomerate with a group of people in the OR, and have to still do your job above all the bickering & cackling--just another day to them, except that they get to point out all of your mishaps in between their casual conversations of the day. This is probably how all rookies are treated, but I really thought I would handle it better. I am trying to get used to that , as well as, all the changes that come with this career as well...it is forever evolving...from cases to drugs that will be used, to policies, to add-on responsibilites, etc.

I am still open for more tips, and I am trying to stay in the light!...and keep SWIMMING.

shang36 · Mar 26, 2007

I am still in my program, and although I have the occasional run-into with the person that was abusive, I have tried to utilize everyone in the forum's advice here, and stick with it. I did try antidepressants, which did not help in that they gave me some bad side effects, so I had a few days off to contemplate more about what I should do. I realize that SSRI's are not the best thing to do if you are contemplating something, because they give you the weight on the decision factor to go ahead and do it...drop out. I stopped taking them, and tried to get to the root of my problem. Like Pete had said, I had a hard time swallowing my pride in many situations, but the truth of the matter is, they know most everything, and I know very little in this field that I did research and shadow for over 60 hours before applying to it.
There is a lot of unspoken verbal and mental abuse that occurs, and yes, while it may make us not make that mistake, it is also breeding those of us who are not able to learn as much because it steals our focus to the way it is taught, rather than what we can learn, or try differently in our clincal site to experience more before graduating. I have both of the sources that were identified, and have had some Peds cases since, that I was told I was way over-prepared for, but I would rather be that , so that I can concentrate on those little precious creatures who are so much more important to us in their well-being. After about 30 more times, maybe I can do it with less sweating, but I will still continue to over-prepare.
I am taking the other person's advice that was saying to go over the steps again and again in my head the night before, and that seems to be helping as well. Thank you very much for that as well.
I know I will be great at this, and to me money is good, yes, but that is not why I chose to do this field, ...it is mainly because in my 4 years of critical care, I only had one person to pass, because I was so anal about preventing problems from happening, and he was a DNR. Thus, I thought this would be great as a career advancement, because you have to stay on top of the ball, but I guess I thought it would not be this hard to comglomerate with a group of people in the OR, and have to still do your job above all the bickering & cackling--just another day to them, except that they get to point out all of your mishaps in between their casual conversations of the day. This is probably how all rookies are treated, but I really thought I would handle it better. I am trying to get used to that , as well as, all the changes that come with this career as well...it is forever evolving...from cases to drugs that will be used, to policies, to add-on responsibilites, etc.
I am still open for more tips, and I am trying to stay in the light!...and keep SWIMMING.

hi micu girl! i am proud of you& had a faith that you won't quit. keep it up ! you can do it.

London88 · Mar 26, 2007

Micugirl;

keep up the good work. You might have been over prepared for your case but I am sure you scored extra points. I much rather a student who is over prepared than one who is under prepared! Keep reviewing your cases the night before and make notes on a piece of paper for your set up and the battle will be half won.

ixnay · Jul 20, 2011

Sorry to dredge up a years-old thread, but boy does it ring true. I'm in my third semester and am really about ready to pull the plug. I've been "counseled" for doing things that, to my mind, are what students do and how we learn. I've been chastised for doing things a certain way, when I've been told by others that that's the way to do them.

I'm *amazed* at the number of really bitter, hateful, downright mean (and obviously miserable) people in this career field. The level of "professionalism" in many of them is laughable. Clearly they've never read the definition of the word, and I'm really not that sure I want to be associated with them for the rest of my career. I have aspired to be a CRNA for many years, and have worked my tail off to get where I am now, but as they say in the business, I'm not sure the juice is worth the squeeze. I'm on Nexium, clonazepam, and mirtazepine, and I'm still a wreck. I just don't know that my mental and physical health are worth it in the end. With 18 months to go, I see a lot more crap coming my way...

allnurses Guide · Jul 20, 2011

Sorry to dredge up a years-old thread, but boy does it ring true. I'm in my third semester and am really about ready to pull the plug. I've been "counseled" for doing things that, to my mind, are what students do and how we learn. I've been chastised for doing things a certain way, when I've been told by others that that's the way to do them.
I'm *amazed* at the number of really bitter, hateful, downright mean (and obviously miserable) people in this career field. The level of "professionalism" in many of them is laughable. Clearly they've never read the definition of the word, and I'm really not that sure I want to be associated with them for the rest of my career. I have aspired to be a CRNA for many years, and have worked my tail off to get where I am now, but as they say in the business, I'm not sure the juice is worth the squeeze. I'm on Nexium, clonazepam, and mirtazepine, and I'm still a wreck. I just don't know that my mental and physical health are worth it in the end. With 18 months to go, I see a lot more crap coming my way...

School is stressful for all of us!!! We all went through getting yelled at by one anesthesia provider for doing something one way that another provider told us to always do it that way...

The only advice I can really give is try not to let it bother you. It gets better the further along you get in school, but that initial stress won't go away fully until you graduate. Then if you decide to work in a ACT practice there will be anesthesiologists that will aggravate/stress you out to no end if you let them.

ssrhythm · Jul 21, 2011

I do not believe that the best thing I can do for Micugirl is to smother her with endless empathy, she has a work to do ahead of her! Describing her situation in a broader perspective and expecting her to face it directly, without antidepressants, etc. is the best form of support I can provide...
On the other hand, your last two sentences contain some good insight and advice, stick with that!

First of all, the depression that the OP has expressed IS REAL SUFFERING! You are a nurse, right? No one is asking you to blanket with empathy, but I AM asking you to abide by the rules on this forum and NOT give medical advice. If the OP is crying every day and feels that it is in her best interest to go to her doctor and discuss the antidepressants, telling her to downplay her current suffering because people in Japan are really suffering is downright wrong and offensive. If this is the best support you can provide, quit trying; you are giving medical advice in the form of your opinion.

OP. Have you talked to your clinical coordinator about your experiences thus far? If your CC is approachable, and he should be, go to him, discuss your experiences, and seek his advice on what YOU can do to improve your OR experiences. There will be rough times from now till you graduate, but there will be successes too. I know it is difficult, but try to figure out a way to not take the criticism personally. Ask for feedback. Ask what you can do differently tomorrow to make you a better SRNA than you were today. Listen to the feedback, and try to do what they say, how they say to do it, and when they say to do it. Then realize that there are just some CRNAs who exist to make SRNAs lives hell. You can not change that. Figure out what you have control over and control it. Accept what you do not have control over and try not to let it get you down; that is very hard to do, but it gets easier. Hang in there.

ssrhythm · Jul 21, 2011

AND SECOND OF ALL.....WHO DUG THIS THREAD UP! Well, I'll stick by the advice that I gave...even though I'm three years late.

micugirl · Jul 21, 2011

Okay - well keep your head up & play the game! I have been practicing for 3.5 years now and love my job!! The one who said keep it in perspective-- you are not fighting on the front lines in war gave me incentive to jeep going. Trust me, my best friend dropped out, and still regrets it. Maybe you need to get a virus for a 4 day weekend pass to sit and think before you drop out. I had been on antidepressants that slowed me down too much & really didn't help, as well as antiacids and antianxiolytics -- it just came down to me vs failure . Do not leave unless they make you leave- like boot camp : YOU ARE PUN OF EVERY JOKE AND IF SOMETHING WRONG- STUDENT DID IT! Accept this as your short-term destiny until the longterm one kicks in after graduation -- I AM SUPER NICE TO MY SRNA's and decided I will NOT. Be abusive like people were to me. You do the same--contribute to betterment of mentors - not be part of your own demise. Hang in there- it's not war! Plus , I did so as a single parent!! Good luck! Focus on each new day as monotonous as it may become will suck a little less each day closer to graduation.