Contracts--please read before signing one

[suzanne4]

Contracts that are signed are legally binding in most cases. They should not be signed until you are very sure of what you are signing and what is included and what it not. Also you should know about where you sre going to be working, what the facility is like, what the area is like, etc. before you sign on the dotted line. Questions should be asked and answered before you sign, not after you have signed.

And many of these contracts now have cancellation clauses that go into effect as soon as you sign. Even before they start any paperwork for you, or you even take an exam if they are paying for it. And many that I have seen are for $8,000 US minimum once you have signed. And if you cancel, you are legally bound to pay that fee to them.

So please, take the time to do your homework, same as you would if you were purchasing a car or even a home. Get everything answered before you sign the purchase agreement. This is not any different.

And if it sounds too good to be true, it probably is. Remember that many of the recruiters/agencies that are overseas have never even been to the US and know nothing about how we do things in the US. Take the time to do some searches on your own before doing anything else.

[lawrence01]

I got a job offer through an agency in NYC area that's reputable according to some of the moderator's postings here on allnurses.com, and I am sure you know the agency since it deals mostly with the nurses from the Philipines, but they told me that I cannot take the contract home to review it because it's a confidential document. They said I can only read it at their office and take as much time as I need. This makes me feel suspicious.

I've spoken to someone that worked for them and left after 1.8 years, and she was happy there, although she paid her way out of the contract. I was also told by someone that recently signed a contract that the first year fine for leaving the contract is $50,000, then the second year is $20,000, and third year is $8000. Maybe they changed the fine because when I spoke to the person that left them, she said she paid only $8000 after 1.8 years of service. 10 days paid vacation, and 3 sick days... I think is what she told me....

What do you think?? Is this a crazy thing to get into?? I am sure it is, but if I don't have an option, I may have to.

If working there is so fine and dandy then why they have to pay their way out of the contract? Not that one has no right to change their mind or go to another agency or facility if there is a better opportunity but if things are dandy or at the very least so-so then they can just wait until their contract expires.

I could never figure out why some agencies don't allow the contract to be taken home for review. I had a few job offers and/or contracts e-mailed or snail-mailed to me before and is common practice for some to do that. There's nothing to hide, anyway.

Also, unless you are already a US green card holder (legal permanent resident) or a US Citizen, there is currently no venue to file Adjustment of Status (I-485). Only the I-140 (petition) can be filed currently and that alone will not allow you to legally work. If you are currently on another visa such as the H1B, w/c you mentioned before then you can just continue being under that to be able to work. But that being said... why rush things? You still do have your H1B working visa don't you? Plus add in the fact that you cannot adjust status now from H1B, F1 or tourist visa to that of being a green card as well since everything is in retrogression. No need to rush things to get a contract now, esp. if you are having doubts about it. Being able to file for the I-140 (petition for Alien worker) alone will have minimal benefits for you. You won't be able to work w/ the employer that petitioned you if w/o the EAD and since there is no pending AOS then there is also no EAD. You will still have to use your H1B to be able to work. You will still be in status quo.

However, everything really depends on you on what to do.

[pampangakid]

I got a job offer through an agency in NYC area that's reputable according to some of the moderator's postings here on allnurses.com, and I am sure you know the agency since it deals mostly with the nurses from the Philipines, but they told me that I cannot take the contract home to review it because it's a confidential document. They said I can only read it at their office and take as much time as I need. This makes me feel suspicious.

I've spoken to someone that worked for them and left after 1.8 years, and she was happy there, although she paid her way out of the contract. I was also told by someone that recently signed a contract that the first year fine for leaving the contract is $50,000, then the second year is $20,000, and third year is $8000. Maybe they changed the fine because when I spoke to the person that left them, she said she paid only $8000 after 1.8 years of service. 10 days paid vacation, and 3 sick days... I think is what she told me....

What do you think?? Is this a crazy thing to get into?? I am sure it is, but if I don't have an option, I may have to.

Are you referring to JUNO Healthcare? My friend signed with them in the Philippines and she was also told the same thing, she was not allowed to review the contract at home, and I tried it also, I went there but when they told me the same thing, I didn't bother to join the company, they are well known in NYC and the owner is a Filipino who is now an American Citizen. I am not sure if this is the agency you are referring.

[lawrence01]

And on a personal note, you will never read any posts here where a moderator is publicly endorsing a specific agency and/or facility.

[suzanne4, RN]

And I will add into what Lawrence has posted here, you will never see us approving these agencies here, most are not acceptable by my standards.

If a red flag goes uo for any thing, such as not being able to take the contract home, then walk from there and do not even consider them. There are threads here in what to look for in a contract, and what not to see being done.

The other issue again is that with the retrogression, most are unable to do anything other than make promises at this time. Nothing more, and you cannot work with that.

[lenjoy03, RN]

Suzanne, I've been reading other threads regarding agency/nurse recruiter.You see, my aunt owns a nurse recruiter agency which is based in NJ. She's a nurse by the way. She's willing to sponsor me and my cousin, but I haven't talked to her about these things yet. They just had verbal agreement with my aunt. My grandfather also works in an agency in L.A., but I dont know if his the owner. What's the difference between nurse recruiter agency and just agency? And what's the difference between the deduction thing? If the agency deducts $5/hr, how much does the nurse recruiter deducts?

[suzanne4, RN]

A nurse recruiter agency and an agency are essentially the same thing, they have to get paid for their services one way or another. Yes, there are some that get their fee from the facility and that alone, and others get it from the nurse's pay, as well as some from the facility; and then there are some that get it 100% from the nurse's pay.

Average going rate is $10,000 per year of your salary to them if they are not paid 100% by the facility.

And right now, even if you get an employer, your chance of getting a visa is not that high; and getting smaller each day. There are many more graduates from nursing programs in your country and they wish to work in the US but less than 10,000 visas available per year for those under the EB-3 category. And that includes the dependents as well under that number.

You are looking at more than probably three years at the moment at the earliest to even have a chance of getting to the US if you do not already have a petition that has been submitted for you. We do not expect things to open up for sometime and with the increase in people wanting a green card, it is going to make chances much smaller for all to get that green card.

I would never recommend any type of contract verbally only to protect you. Or there is no guarantee to anything, even if it is family. Unfortunately have seen many sold by their aunties to the highest bidder, just for them to get more money for themselves, even when they were not recruiters but trying to be helpful. You need to have everything spelled out in writing to protect you.

And with things the way that they are, I would recommend staying away from family members as this can only cause friction among you in the long run now. Does not matter if they are your relative, they cannot get you a visa any faster than anyone else.

[lenjoy03, RN]

I would recommend staying away from family members as this can only cause friction among you in the long run now.

Really?

Thanks for the reply suzanne. It was really helpful and now I'm confused! hehehe.... But its ok. It made me think what to do and what to expect.

And I really dont mind waiting. "There's a time for everything..."

[suzanne4, RN]

And there is another type of agency, one that many Americans use to work per diem shift. This type is never recommended for any foreign nurse as you are expected to already have experience in the US before being able to just jump in and fill and empty shift without any orientation, so to speak.

There are some that will sign with this type of agency but they usually do not last as they have difficulties with the work assignments and also the easiest way to lose a license.

Please be very careful with what ever you decide to do, but would always recommend staying away from family members in this.

[pinoy_guy]

you see, my aunt owns a nurse recruiter agency which is based in nj. she's a nurse by the way. she's willing to sponsor me and my cousin, but i haven't talked to her about these things yet. they just had verbal agreement with my aunt. my grandfather also works in an agency in l.a., but i dont know if his the owner . . . and what's the difference between the deduction thing? if the agency deducts $5/hr, how much does the nurse recruiter deducts?

and with things the way that they are, i would recommend staying away from family members as this can only cause friction among you in the long run now.

a friend was petitioned by an agency owned by his close family friend (also filipino). he heard the refrain that he'll have to work a lot of overtime at this agency so the uscis will not deny his i-140. (he's on adjustment of status [aos].)

problem was, the agency was paying him $24/hour.

after doing hundreds of overtime hours with this agency, he realized he was getting nowhere financially, as he had to support his family in the philippines.

so he stopped doing overtime at this agency and he got jobs in 2 other hospitals, each of which paid $35/hour.

(this was when he finally accepted the fact that his agency was getting $11/hour of his work. and my friend paid for all his lawyer's fees.)

all fine and dandy until he got the nod (that's notice of denial) from uscis. the reason given was that the agency's financial statement showed that the agency cannot afford to give jobs to nurses.

the "family friend" then blamed my friend for being denied, saying the reason was because my friend was "unfaithful to the sponsoring agency" because he got other jobs at other facilities. (let me point out that nowhere in the uscis nod was this mentioned as a reason for denial.)

in short, the agency blamed my friend.

this stirred up a hornet's nest, because it strained the "family friend" relationship.

anyway, since this agency had other petitionees in the pipeline, and if these petitionees learn about the nod the dirt will hit the fan, this agency finally relented and filed an appeal. (essentially the agency wrote the uscis; my friend had to pay for all the fees.)

there is one problem: how can you appeal a financial statement?

can an agency suddenly claim that its financial status changed overnight?

(or did this filipino agency practice filipino-style financial reporting?)

anyway, my friend's fate hangs in the balance as uscis considers the appeal.

my other friends think this friend will get the notice to pack up and go soon.

i am not saying that other agencies do the same thing.

i am just sharing what my friend is going through.

good luck.

[suzanne4, RN]

Definitely listen to what the above poster has said.

The US government is now going over financial records of the petitioning companies with a fine tooth comb and denying petitions based on incorrect information included in it by the company or agency, etc.

There have been recent newspaper articles about companies with employers in other professions that did not pay their staff what was stated in their petition that was filed when the person was working under the H1-B cateogry and then when they filed for the green card, they got denied. This is a reason that they are asking for paycheck stubs, etc. to make sure that the employer was doing as they signed under oath that they were doing. And those people that do not get approved, must leave the US. Even if they are here and then it is found out that something was filed inappropriately, they have to leave the US, and cannot remain.

Reasons to stay away from family members that have agencies or "supposed" agencies. Bad blood develops more times than not.

[lenjoy03, RN]

And there is another type of agency, one that many Americans use to work per diem shift. This type is never recommended for any foreign nurse as you are expected to already have experience in the US before being able to just jump in and fill and empty shift without any orientation, so to speak.

That is just the kind of agency where my grandfather works. Oh my God! Thank you for the enlightenment suzanne!

[lenjoy03, RN]

Wah! 2 days ago, I tried to apply on my aunt agency via internet. Just for fun, I guess.... They called this evening and asked about stuff... I dont know the content of their conversation because he was talking to my father.

I was shocked when my father said, if ever my sister who is an onco nurse passed the NCLEX, she'll be able to go in US in just one year! BAM! That just shocked me! With the retrogression on going, I doubt it! Even if my aunt's husband is a lawyer in US, I still have doubts. Now I'm kinda scared on what's happening.... What if those stories from pinoy_guy and suzanne's stories will happen to me and my sister?! Please pray for our enlightenment and guidance regarding this issue...

To suzanne and pinoy_guy, thank you....