New drug cocktails for executions....opinions?

allnurses Guide · Oct 15, 2013

This is not a thread about the death penalty. My interest lies in your thoughts about this particular drug combo...
Florida to execute man using untried lethal injection drug - NBC News.com

Versed can be used for induction of general anesthesia. We typically do not use Versed that way anymore, but Versed is an acceptable and well documented way to induce general anesthesia.

The prison system would probably use 2.5-10x the normal induction dose, similar to other drug dosages used in executions, to ensure adequate anesthesia.

Da_Milk_of_Amnesia, MSN · Oct 15, 2013

We just got on email from our faculty about this. If they do decided to go ahead with this, and the Europeans decided to stop selling us the good stuff...We are going to have to change how we give anesthesia (to some degree). I guess the other side of the coin is will the EU really stop selling us Prop? My guess is probably not, but I don't think it's a theory we should be willing to test out.

Trauma Columnist · Oct 15, 2013

I am an APN but not CRNA and was wondering if the prison system starts using propofol, would the supply start to dwindle and if it did would this lead to more research and development of newer agents? Thanks for the insight.

manusko · Oct 15, 2013

Then again we could start producing our own. Jobs for people for something I use everyday in my practice.

Lets slap a BIS monitor on them (not always effective) and see what their anesthesia level is before the lethal injection.

allnurses Guide · Oct 15, 2013

Propofol Lethal Injections Blocked as Teva and Hospira Re-Enter Market

BIS does not work. BIS has been proven not to show any difference in anesthetic awareness, and it doesn't even measure the correct part of the brain for awareness under anesthesia....I'm not a fan of the BIS in case I didn't make that clear....lol.

My understanding from the article was that the Florida prison system was going Versed as the induction agent before the paralytic and potassium.

It takes around 20+ years to develop and get a new drug to market, and IMHO there isn't enough interest/capital from executions to develop a new drug just for that purpose.

MeTheRN, BSN, MSN, RN · Oct 16, 2013

Wasn't this a similar contributing factor for STP no longer being produced?

allnurses Guide · Oct 16, 2013

Wasn't this a similar contributing factor for STP no longer being produced?

It is almost exactly why STP stopped being produced. STP production was moved to a foreign country that did not allow capital punishment, and that country stated it would sue the manufacture of STP if it could not guarantee that STP was not going to be used for executions. The manufacture made the decision to stop making STP, since it was a low profit drug.

allnurses Guide · Oct 16, 2013

Then again we could start producing our own. Jobs for people for something I use everyday in my practice.
Lets slap a BIS monitor on them (not always effective) and see what their anesthesia level is before the lethal injection.

Morificeko,

I was just joking with you about the BIS. I still don't like it though...lol

In all seriousness though we cannot use the BIS monitor on capital punishment prisoners for a couple of reasons: 1. Prisoners are considered a vulnerable/protected subjects for research and it would be next to impossible to get an IRB to let this happen. 2. It would certainly increase the risk of lawsuits based on BIS readings.

manusko · Oct 16, 2013

It is almost exactly why STP stopped being produced. STP production was moved to a foreign country that did not allow capital punishment, and that country stated it would sue the manufacture of STP if it could not guarantee that STP was not going to be used for executions. The manufacture made the decision to stop making STP, since it was a low profit drug.

So I don't understand that versed is cruel and unusual punishment but the electric chair is fine.

MeTheRN, BSN, MSN, RN · Oct 16, 2013

It is almost exactly why STP stopped being produced. STP production was moved to a foreign country that did not allow capital punishment, and that country stated it would sue the manufacture of STP if it could not guarantee that STP was not going to be used for executions. The manufacture made the decision to stop making STP, since it was a low profit drug.

I thought so!! Thanks for the confirmation

allnurses Guide · Oct 16, 2013

So I don't understand that versed is cruel and unusual punishment but the electric chair is fine.

It is not that Versed is cruel and unusual punishment, but that is the defense that lawyers will use to delay capital punishment. It is just legal nonsense that causes taxpayers untold amounts money to prove what the medical community already knows.