CCD discontinues ADN nursing program.

[B_OTT]

I applied for CCD ADN program and yesterday received this as part of the letter

The Community College of Denver has examined how it can best address the nursing workforce needs in the greater Denver area. We have learned that the hiring of Associate Degree Registered Nurses in many of the area acute care hospitals has significantly reduced in favor of nurses with a Baccalaureate Degree in Nursing. This change has also resulted in a drastic reduction in clinical sites for our nursing students. These changes have impacted CCD's ability to provide the level of student learning experiences required for a quality graduate.

In an effort to support the current workforce nursing needs in the greater Denver area, the Community College of Denver is pleased to announce its plans for supporting these needs. Starting in the fall 2011-2012 academic year, CCD will offer three educational options supporting community workforce nursing needs:

*The Nurse Aide Certificate

*The Practical Nurse Certificate

*The Pathway to a Baccalaureate Degree in Nursing

The Nurse Aid Certificate and the Practical Nurse Certificate have been an educational option for many years and both programs maintain excellent reputations in the community. The Pathway to a Baccalaureate Degree in Nursing is a new offering about which we are excited. This pathway is in partnership with a local university and will allow CCD students to complete the first two years of the BSN degree at CCD and will ensure them admittance into a Baccalaureate Degree Nursing Program. The BSN better addresses the hiring practices of acute care hospitals in the Greater Denver area and will better position our students in the profession of nursing. If you are interested in learning more about this option please let us know.

This change means the Community College of Denver will no longer offer the Associate Degree in Nursing as a degree option. No students will be admitted to the Associate Degree Nursing Program for the fall of 2011. The decision not to continue the Associate Degree in Nursing program was a difficult decision and involved input from Nursing Faculty & Staff and CCD Administration, as well as CCCS Administration & Board.

I called them to ask about the pathway to BSN program but they said they do not currently have a 4 year college working with them.

[Izzy11, NP]

Interesting that they are keeping the LPN and CNA programs - the grads from these programs must still be somewhat 'in demand.'

They are for different jobs than RNs.

[dddduncan]

Wow- I wonder if the "Pathway to BSN" program that CCD is building, has something to do with the traditional BSN program that Metro is rumored to be creating. This scenario would be the answer to my prayers. I'm now looking into BSN programs (not ADN programs). Regis is so hard to get into, and I'd need to take 6 more pre-requisite classes (2 religion/2 upper division electives/ethics & chemistry). CU Denver, I saw just became a little more lenient with their expiration date of pre-requisites. Electives do NOT expire, but the 16 required pre-requisites do. So... I'd have to take 9 more classes (four of them being "retakes" of mine that expired). Looking at UNC- it seems doable. But I'd still need 5 more pre-reqs (2 chemistry/1 foreign language/redo my Nutrition class because the one I took previously doesn't qualify and Pharmacology).

It's discouraging that all three schools want different pre-requisites and so it's like you have to pick one school and go for it. If you don't get in, those additional classes are almost a waste of time, because you have to go back and take different pre-reqs for the next school you want to apply to.

Is anyone else in this same boat with me?

I have NO medical experience. I've been in the corporate world for 15 years- and I have NO previous Bachelor's degree. (I have an associates degree from 2001)

What I DO have, is thousands of dollars in student loans already and so I need to finish this--- backing out is not an option.

Ideas/thoughts/stories to share?

[hope3456, ASN, RN]

They are for different jobs than RNs.

:idea:really?!? Albeit less desirable pathways for students - just wondering how easy it is to get into a LPN or CNA position in the Denver area?

[SummitRN, BSN, RN]

Regis is so hard to get into, and I'd need to take 6 more pre-requisite classes (2 religion/2 upper division electives/ethics & chemistry).

Look closely at Regis. You can take Chem, Comparative Religion, and Philosophy of religion at community colleges. Take your ethics at Regis AFTER you get admitted and your two other upper divisions can be through Regis after admission (they offer externships, ER nursing, and critical care nursing electives that fulfill these requirements as part of the traditional nursing program. You need Chem anyway for virtually any respectable BSN program (eg CU now requires it).

Is anyone else in this same boat with me?

I took all the prereqs needed to get into CU, Regis, CUCS, DSN, Platte, and all the CCs. But I decided it not to even bother with the CCs or any for-profit school and I only applied to Regis and CU.

What I DO have, is thousands of dollars in student loans already and so I need to finish this--- backing out is not an option.

Ideas/thoughts/stories to share?

Make sure you are going into the field for the right reasons and not because you feel sunk by loans. It'd be better to finish out a BA or BS in whatever interests you than to go into nursing if you aren't in it because you love some aspects of it.

[dddduncan]

Summit--- Thank you! This is very helpful information. I didn't realize that I could take some of those classes after being admitted into the program. That's good to hear! Just to clarify, does that mean that I can get accepted into the Nursing program and then finish my upper division electives? My life DREAM is to be an ER nurse--- so being able to ANYTHING related to ER... makes me overwhelmed with joy just thinking about it. I have no doubt that being a nurse is what I was born to do. It's just been a really long road and I'm bummed that my original plan didn't work. I thought my days of working full time and going to school at night were over--- and, it looks like I've got a couple more semesters of that to undergo.

By the way, what is the admissions process like at Regis? I thought I heard that the seamless transfer students get all the slots, then people from "off the streets" get to apply for whatever is left over. So, you'll have like 150 people applying for like 30 seats. Is that correct? I have a 4.0 GPA, but no medical background- and I'm assuming that someone with medical experience would get accepted over someone who doesn't.

[Sand_Dollar, BSN]

dddduncan,

Don't forget to consider UNC. Although they are in Greeley, they have an excellent program and are WAY cheaper than Regis. With a 4.0 you could walk into the program, like I did because it is strictly GPA based entry. You need some extra pre-reqs, but it's not that bad. There is also a woman who I am carpooling with who is from Denver, so it can been done.

~SD

[dddduncan]

Thank you, Sand Dollar. Let me clarify about my GPA.

I have a 4.0 for my science pre-requisite GPA. In the last 3 years, I only got one B, which was in Algebra (which Regis doesn't need me to have). However, if you look at my GPA from back in 2001, when I received my Associates degree, and combine it with what I currently have--- I'm at about a 3.6 or 3.7. So I kind of feel like that's low, considering that UNC will look at the last 45 credits, PLUS, the "C" I got in Statistics in 1996 and the "B" I got in ENG 122 in 1997. Thoughts? (I'm not concerned about my ability to pull A's going forward. It's just low grades in my past that I'm concerned about.)

[SummitRN, BSN, RN]

Yes, you can finish those 9 credits of upper division (which includes ethics) AFTER being accepted to Regis's nursing program. Also, Regis is expensive, but they are known to be generous with scholarships (private non-profits can do this).

With your grades, you are still competitive for these schools, even without the medical background. There are no guarantees, but I'd apply to both CU and Regis! It sounds like UNC and CUCS are worth applying to as well if the drive is OK.

[dddduncan]

Wow-- you guys are amazing. You're so helpful and knowledgable. THANK YOU! The ability to do the upper division & Ethics class(es) after being accepted to the program makes a big difference. I don't feel like I've hit three completely dead ends at this point. I actually have plans to attend info seminars at both Regis and CU within the next month. UNC is indeed an option as well. I live Downtown, but thankfully have parents up north that I could stay with, should UNC become a feasible path.

I'm so grateful for this forum and for all of the feedback I've recieved from you guys.

Honestly, the ADN program wasn't my favorite choice, but it's what I thought would get me from point A to B as quickly (and cheaply) as possible. Now that it doesn't seem like the best option, the idea of going straight into a BSN is a little more exciting.

Getting a BSN would be my greatest achievement.

[Snarf]

I understand your frustration and I feel your pain. As a CCD nursing faculty member for the past 5 years, I am heart-broken over the loss of CCD's ADN program. A large part of the problem that led to the closure comes from the Colorado Board of Nursing's recent requirement that all Colorado nursing schools must be NLNAC or CCNE accredited to stay open. A lack of clinical sites, compounded by a shortage of qualified faculty who will work for such incredibly low salaries (a new grad LPN floor nurse can make more than a nursing instructor with an MSN) doomed the program. While it may sound like a good idea to have all nursing schools attain accreditation, it is not a realistic goal. Accreditation requires, among other things, better than average NCLEX pass rates. Every school cannot be better than average. I urge people to contact the their state representatives and the board of nursing to tell them this mandatory accreditation requirement must be removed. Until the accreditation entities change their accreditation requirements or the board drops this ridiculous requirement, you will likely see more nursing programs close in Colorado.

[dddduncan]

Oh Snarf, I am so sorry!!

So, what is causing all of this? Years ago, when I embarked on this journey, all I heard about was the "nursing shortage". I thought for sure that there would be many options for schools & programs, and job options upon graduation (or NCLEX completion). Is this due to a surge in new nurses hitting the scene, and now hospitals can pick from the litter, what kind/level of nurse they want to hire? Or does this have to do with, say, the "quality" of nurses entering the field. Lord knows, I have encountered some sub-par classmates who've made me wonder, "How did you even make it this far in school?"

I would love to know more about why this is happening. And yes, I will write my state rep.

Hugs to you.

[SummitRN, BSN, RN]

Before everyone goes writing their representatives...

1. I cannot find ANYTHING on the COBON's website to cooberate the claim that all nursing schools must be NLN or CCNE.

2. Consider this:

I disagree that requiring accreditation is a bad idea for CO. If ALL the states did it, it would be a bad idea, but the situation in CO is so bad that only CA is worse. I think the number one purpose of that BON req was to cut down on NG overproduciton, particularly by subpar (for-profit) programs. If there is SO much demand in CO to become nursing students, then CO can say that every nursing school in CO should be better than the national average. Obviously, I agree that if every state did this, it would not work.

But how is CO to control overenrolment of nursing students and a lack of clinical sites? Raising standards might seem unfair, but it is less unfair than students being forced into low quality clinical experiences and being unhirable. If demanding all programs in CO be above average, numbers are controlled though keeping only the higher quality options.

The NCLEX national average is about 87%. On review, CCD has been FAR FAR below that for years. The only other programs in the state that have pass rates as low as CCD (and consistently below the national average) are University of Phoenix, Colorado Technical, and Concorde Career College, all for-profits all with similar problems finding clinical placements, all which might likely close with few tears shed by the state.

My opinion might be unpopular, but there are no solutions that will make everyone happy.