California Nurses Association and SEIU Neutrality Agreement ruled Illegal by the NLRB

Trublunurse · May 24, 2005

Sounds like you are antiunion? The NLRB does not favor employees, especially not now. For me, being pronurse means being prounion. I really see this as an attack on our ability to be proactive collectively. The CNA and the SEIU are both fine organizations, I hope someday to belong to one of them. There is power in numbers, that is why all the hospitals belong to AHA. A CNA/SEIU link would be awesome! I think it is time to question the labor laws in this land. Quick, before our whole economy and health care system collapses! I'd encourage nurses to fight for better laws and representation rather than fight the people trying to help us.

Sherwood · May 24, 2005

Sounds like you are antiunion? The NLRB does not favor employees, especially not now. For me, being pronurse means being prounion. I really see this as an attack on our ability to be proactive collectively. The CNA and the SEIU are both fine organizations, I hope someday to belong to one of them. There is power in numbers, that is why all the hospitals belong to AHA. A CNA/SEIU link would be awesome! I think it is time to question the labor laws in this land. Quick, before our whole economy and health care system collapses! I'd encourage nurses to fight for better laws and representation rather than fight the people trying to help us.

I am very pro nurse.I am very pro patient. To be honest, I do not always disagree with what the CNA has to say. I believe that nurse to patient ratios are needed to ensure quality, safe patient care. Safe for the patient and safe for the nurse. I am in complete disagreement in the methods and tactics the CNA and SEIU and for that matter other unions use to make their point. I do not agree with the strict "at all times" rule the CNA demands for the California nurse staffing ratio's. The nursing shortage is another issue.

I very much oppose the union security clause demanded by the unions that demand that once the union is voted in ALL members of the bargaining unit must pay dues to the union or risk termination.You do not have to be a member, you still have to pay. Don't say that I could just pack up and find another job. That is an option the pro and and anti union people say. I don't, I understand that finding another job is not always an option. California is not a right to work state. I strongly disagree with the politics of the CNA and the SEIU.

The often unreasonable wage and benefit packages the unions have demanded are one of the reasons our economy is having problems. Pension plans going bankrupt, companies unable to compete in the U.S. because of high wage and benefit packages negotiated years earlier.

As I stated before. When the SEIU negotiated a neutrality agreement with Tenet healthcare before the CNA did, the CNA went to the web and to the press crying foul! The CNA said neutrality agreements are illegal and will be struck down in the courts. Then they negotiated a deal with the SEIU and Tenet, cutting their own illegal neutrality agreement. Hypocracy?

allnurses Guide · May 24, 2005

I am very pro nurse.I am very pro patient. To be honest, I do not always disagree with what the CNA has to say. I believe that nurse to patient ratios are needed to ensure quality, safe patient care. Safe for the patient and safe for the nurse. I am in complete disagreement in the methods and tactics the CNA and SEIU and for that matter other unions use to make their point. I do not agree with the strict "at all times" rule the CNA demands for the California nurse staffing ratio's. The nursing shortage is another issue.
I very much oppose the union security clause demanded by the unions that demand that once the union is voted in ALL members of the bargaining unit must pay dues to the union or risk termination.You do not have to be a member, you still have to pay. Don't say that I could just pack up and find another job. That is an option the pro and and anti union people say. I don't, I understand that finding another job is not always an option. California is not a right to work state. I strongly disagree with the politics of the CNA and the SEIU.
The often unreasonable wage and benefit packages the unions have demanded are one of the reasons our economy is having problems. Pension plans going bankrupt, companies unable to compete in the U.S. because of high wage and benefit packages negotiated years earlier.
As I stated before. When the SEIU negotiated a neutrality agreement with Tenet healthcare before the CNA did, the CNA went to the web and to the press crying foul! The CNA said neutrality agreements are illegal and will be struck down in the courts. Then they negotiated a deal with the SEIU and Tenet, cutting their own illegal neutrality agreement. Hypocracy?

I'm in complete agreement with you. Thanks for stating it so well.

steph

Sheri257 · May 24, 2005

The often unreasonable wage and benefit packages the unions have demanded are one of the reasons our economy is having problems. Pension plans going bankrupt, companies unable to compete in the U.S. because of high wage and benefit packages negotiated years earlier.

These kind of statements always shock me. I can't believe people buy into this ... :rolleyes:

Unions are not the cause of problems with the economy. Union membership has been declining for decades, and salaries, pension and health benefits have been declining along with it. This is well documented. American workers are making less money and paying more for benefits than they ever have in recent history.

Meanwhile, CEO salaries and corporate profits skyrocket at the expense of workers.

It's always laughable when people try to blame corporate woes on unions. GM is trying to do the same thing. They lose a billion dollars and it's supposed to be the union's fault when, the fact is, they build lousy cars and refused to invest in hybrid vehicles (like Toyota did) which are now selling like hotcakes because of higher gas prices.

No .... you cannot place the blame on unions. These are management problems.

:rolleyes:

Sherwood · May 24, 2005

These kind of statements always shock me. I can't believe people buy into this ...
Unions are not the cause of problems with the economy. Union membership has been declining for decades, and salaries, pension and health benefits have been declining along with it. This is well documented. American workers are making less money and paying more for benefits than they ever have in recent history.
Meanwhile, CEO salaries and corporate profits skyrocket at the expense of workers.
It's always laughable when people try to blame corporate woes on unions. GM is trying to do the same thing. They lose a billion dollars and it's supposed to be the union's fault when, the fact is, they build lousy cars and refused to invest in hybrid vehicles (like Toyota did) which are now selling like hotcakes because of higher gas prices.
No .... you cannot place the blame on unions. These are management problems.

I never said unions were entirely to blame for our economic woes. I clearly stated that they were "one of the reasons". Greed is an issue. Poor decision making is another. The unions are by no means fully to blame. Nor is management. We all must take a little bit of the blame. Why must the pro union side twist words or take statements out of context.

CNA/SEIU Neutrality Agreement with Tenet Healthcare ruled Illegal by the NLRB

Sheri257 · May 24, 2005

I never said unions were entirely to blame for our economic woes. I clearly stated that they were "one of the reasons". Greed is an issue. Poor decision making is another. The unions are by no means fully to blame. Nor is management. We all must take a little bit of the blame. Why must the pro union side twist words or take statements out of context.

Well, with declining union membership that's been going on for decades, I still don't see how you can say unions are even "one of the reasons" for problems with the economy when, in fact, there aren't many union members to cause those problems in the first place.

That was my point.

:coollook:

Sherwood · May 24, 2005

Well, with declining union membership that's been going on for decades, I still don't see how you can say unions are even "one of the reasons" for problems with the economy when, in fact, there aren't many union members to cause those problems in the first place.
That was my point.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Sherwood

The often unreasonable wage and benefit packages the unions have demanded are one of the reasons our economy is having problems. Pension plans going bankrupt, companies unable to compete in the U.S. because of high wage and benefit packages negotiated years earlier.

Read my whole statement above. High wage and benefit packages negotiatioted years earlier Negotiated when unions were in their prime.

It is a fact that union membership is declining. I believe this is one of the reasons that the unions are attempting to use such illegal tactics as "Neutrality Agreements" and " Card Check Elections" to obtain new members.

CNA/SEIU Tenet Neutrality Agreement ruled Illegal by the National Labor Relations Board

Sheri257 · May 24, 2005

CNA/SEIU Tenet Neutrality Agreement ruled Illegal by the National Labor Relations Board

As far as the Bush administration ruling that a cooperative agreement between unions is illegal ... what else is new? There were a lot of CNA actions that the Clinton administration said were legal that the Bush people have now said are illegal. So what? That's politics and to be expected with a Republican versus Democractic administration.

If you want to talk about illegal actions ... let's talk about Tenet. That's an organization that's truly illegal. Unnecessary operations performed on patients, massive malpractice, massive Medicaid and Medicare fraud. The list goes on and on and has been well publicized in the news for years now.

When you compare the two organizations .... Tenet makes CNA look like a saint. A cooperative agreement between unions is nothing in comparision to the fraudulent practices Tenet has imposed on their patients and the taxpayers.

And you say you're a patient advocate? At least CNA has done something for patient care with ratios. Tenet's record on patient care is absolutely horrible.

:rolleyes:

Nancy2 · May 24, 2005

,
I hope someday to belong to one of them.

Well, what's stopping you? You can join the union, become a member and pay dues. They don't have to be elected into your hospital for you to pay dues to support all their causes like the LABOR party and organizing more hopitals, you can do it voluntarily....or maybe their not THAT good.
CNA gave $10,000 to the LABOR Party last year, and RoseAnne Demoro chaired their national conference in 2000. http://www.thelaborparty.org (scary)

Sherwood · May 24, 2005

As far as the Bush administration ruling that a cooperative agreement between unions is illegal ... what else is new? When you compare the two organizations .... Tenet makes CNA look like a saint. A cooperative agreement between unions is nothing in comparision to the fraudulent practices Tenet has imposed on their patients and the taxpayers.
And you say you're a patient advocate? At least CNA has done something for patient care with ratios. Tenet's record on patient care is absolutely horrible.

The cooperative agreement you say left out something.The employees that the union wanted to represent were left out of the decsion making process. We were not asked what we wanted or how we wanted it. Were were left out of the loop entirely until after the neutrality agreement was announced, the "i's" dotted and the "t's" crossed. I agree that Tenet screwed up big time. I am glad I no longer work for a Tenet hospital,we were sold. The CNA and SEIU demanded by contract that the illegal neutrality agreement carry over to the new owners though. Thank goodness it was declared illegal.

What are you doing to promote nursing? I attend national conventions, I teach, I speak at high schools to promote the profession of nursing. I write politicians when I agree or disagree with them on issues. I do not roll my eyes when I disagree with someone. I read or listen to every word and consider it's value. If I agree, I say it as I have done here. If I disagree, I state my case.

What about that Labor Party the CNA and Demoro supports? Do you support universal government paid healthcare for all as the CNA does? Do YOU want higher taxes to pay for this welfare?

The Neutrality agreement between the CNA/SEIU and Tenet Healthcare is illegal.

Sheri257 · May 24, 2005

The cooperative agreement you say left out something.The employees that the union wanted to represent were left out of the decsion making process. We were not asked what we wanted or how we wanted it. Were were left out of the loop entirely until after the neutrality agreement was announced, the "i's" dotted and the "t's" crossed. I agree that Tenet screwed up big time. I am glad I no longer work for a Tenet hospital,we were sold. The CNA and SEIU demanded by contract that the illegal neutrality agreement carry over to the new owners though. Thank goodness it was declared illegal.

If you were left out of the loop, what did they do or propose that was so bad?

:coollook: