birth as transformative experience for fathers

[Selke]

Hi,

Birth is transformative for new mothers, as we all know, but what about dads? This came up on another thread, in context of birth is the time when dads are most likely to accept responsibility for their children. We get so focussed on the woman having the baby that the FOB can be left out and feel not important in IP. (I'm purposely leaving out same sex couples -- if anyone wants to discuss this, maybe we should have another thread, as I think the relationship dynamics are somewhat different, and the legal issues are different.)

How do you all address this issue either in IP or PP? What do you all do or say to acknowledge this transition and responsibility for dad, to help him, to include him in the birth process? Does anyone know of research on this? What pearls of wisdom can you wise nurses share? A couple of comments as examples ...

I worked with a great nurse who would give a spiel to the couple before transferring them to PP, along the lines of "you have to remember that your relationship isn't all about the baby. Your relationship is primary, and you have to nurture that, make time for yourselves, regularly. Dad, in six weeks, make a date with your wife, get a baby sitter, and take her out. And keep doing this, regularly." &c.

It's easier with the involved, obviously responsible fathers, but how do you address this with the young men (boys, really)? They may not have a father in their lives and don't know how to be men. I think the young, tough guys who cop an attitude in L&D are scared, in a way, so they revert to their tough guy behavior. We can tend to dismiss them as jerks, or we may think things like, yeah, having sex with a girl doesn't make you a dad, but being there and loving that child and raising it is what makes you a father. How do you all handle these situations, convey respect to the young man, while speaking to his new role?

[Selke]

I just want to differentiate between 'expected' roles and 'transformative' roles. The birth of a child is indeed transformative for a woman. Not just in her new roles, but because women are designed to have that special 'ohhhhh, ahhhhhh' towards babies.

But just because a guy is now 'expected' to play a part doesn't mean that they also inherit the 'transformation' that may or may not be a part of their make-up.

But a change happens when a person becomes a parent -- or should happen. This change happens in different ways for different people. The young players with girlfriends and multiple children doesn't seem to be transformed. He's interested in showing off his virility. He's a kind of pimp for these women IMHO.

....

And it certainly doesn't speak to how well a dad they will be. That has to do with a moral/instinctive makeup that I just don't believe can be routinely so drastically changed by one event. And I have serious doubts that nurses can plan for or seriously implement/facilitate such a transformation, in any case.

~faith,

Timothy.

You are right that how a dad reacts to birth does not speak to how good a parent he will be. You are likely right that nurses can't faciliate a transformation in someone, but we do have influence over our patients at the life events that occur to them while in hospital -- birth, death, happiness, suffering, loss, grief, &c. I've had single events change me, and they all occurred in hospitals, BTW. There are too many stories out there by patients about their nurses who helped change their lives. Maybe there is nothing we can really do in L&D to help these young men become fathers, but I think there are things we can say, or not say, that will help some people, and that's part of being a great nurse.

[ZASHAGALKA, RN]

Part of the problem is that young men don't HAVE to be responsible, since every new mother has an 'uncle' that will take care of them: Uncle Sam.

Back in the day, you sire a child, and the NEED for support not supplied by tax dollars would instigate a shotgun understanding of what being a 'stand up' guy was all about: stand up or lay down forever - your choice.

I detest deadbeat dads; they are the bad apples that taint the whole barrel.

But, unfortunately, the system encourages such behavior. If Uncle Sam wasn't taking up the slack, Mr. 'prove my virility' would be dealt with by a very upset soon-to-be grandfather, and that would send a very powerful message to other would-be studs. But due in large part to the system, that soon-to-be grandfather wasn't a stand up guy either, and so, he's simply not there to protect his daughter - or teach his son any better.

Society polices itself if you don't fundamentally mess with the design. In my view, welfare is suicidal class warfare: "Here's your check, now stay out of our society." No wonder the result is the creation of a class of social outcasts procreating ever more outcasts. Once that chain reaction gets started, the lack of male role models to teach that being a man is more than notches in some bedpost or that being a lady deserves the respect and protection of a wary father simply serves to knock down the next domino, in the next generation. And as it spreads, it takes no heed to remain constrained within the context of the fringes of society: it redefines society in the main.

I'm all for aid: this country is too rich for anybody to go hungry, unsheltered, or unclothed. But the current scheme is simply immoral: just enough support to reach up for a gulp of air now and then, but not enough to tread, much less swim. And the price of that support: surrender your life vest. (And don't try to make it to the lifeboats; if you attempt to climb into the boat with the rest of us, why, we'll take away all your support and watch you drown.)

That, combined with the resultant complete abdication of the concept of responsibility is the recipe for disaster that you see in your L&Ds, every day. Why aren't these men being stand up dads? Simple, they don't have to be.

~faith,

Timothy.

[JaneyW]

Wow! Were you guys at work with me yesterday? We were having some heated discussions about the 'enabling' of birthing too many children that you can't afford. Some of our staff have family members with health issues right now and have been navigating the health care system where they see how they are denied care or face huge bills for necessary treatment even though they have worked hard and have money put away. Then we have patients who have never worked and are on their 4th baby with different fathers and expect all of their care to be free and can't believe that we won't send them home with a month's supply of formula and diapers and expect them to pay a $30 co-pay for the 5 prescriptions they need and a free car seat and a taxi ride home, etc. Don't get me up on my soapbox--my tax bill for last year is still fresh in my mind!

But, not to turn this into that debate (which could go round and round). I feel obligated to tell Timothy that I feel for him. I have three sons and am surrounded by males and male thought patterns and gender differences. They are real, and I do my best to remember that when parenting! Also, I don't really believe that women are 'programmed' to instantly adore a baby. I think it took me 6 weeks to really bond with my first son. I was exhausted and the 'transformation' into mother took me a while to ease into. Just because my role changed in a minute doesn't mean I was ready for it! I also have no real memory of most of my nurses during any of my three stays. Maybe this means they were bad--maybe I was just too overwhelmed and tired to take much in. I work both IP and PP and I do my best to be supportive and teach as much as I can remembering that my patients are stressed and tired and overwhelmed and maybe will only remember a third of what I tell them.

I ALWAYS try to include the FOB or BF in the care and the process to the extent to which they are comfortable. Every little bit helps. I just can't accept that I have as much power as it seems I am expected to. We can do our best, but can't expect to make miracles in the hours that we have these patients.