I need some honest opinions from people outside my circle, as all of my fellow students share my same opinion and all the faculty blow sunshine up my you know what, when I even hint that the situation isn't right. So here is the deal...
Me: Adult senior student in BSN program at local university
Preceived problem/issue: Clinical assignments
History:
Fall semester junior year - 10 wks clinical mostly focused on CNA duties w/some assessment
Spring semester junior year- 7 wks med/surg where I passed meds 3 times, then 7 wks mental health where I observed patients (not shadowing nurses) in different settings (eating disorders, adolescence, geriatrics, etc)
Fall semester 2011 -
14 wks med/surg at a nursing home, where I (a BSN student) shadow an LPN whose primary duties is to administer medications to 30-45 patients in their 8 hours shift.
*LPN's, please don't be offended or turn this thread into an arguement of LPN's vs BSN"s. I fully appreciate that I can learn a lot from an LPN and these people bust their A** all day, every day. My issue is that my university placed me in a clinical situation where I am shadowing a nurse who 98 % of the time is handing out PO meds to long term residents, who are primarily stable (because they take 17 meds 3 times a day...OMG).
Community clinical-public health nursing- 7 wks at a local health dept whose budget has been desimated, so we spend our time watching CD's, observing employees in the Lead Poisoning program, or shadowing health inspectors. One was lucky enough to do an at home visit w/an actual nurse meeting w/an at risk mother.
My feelings- I am ANGRY. My primary complaint is that I feel like I am paying a ton of money to learn how to do everyone elses job. My mental health clinical taught me the job of behavioral health specialist (the counselors), my current med/surg clinical is teaching me what it is like to be a full-time CNA (as when I am done assessing and medicating my patient I answer call lights all day, as there are never enough CNA's to help the residents and my community clinical, where I am learning the jobs of health inspector and other misc health dept personnel.
The final thing I will say is I appreciate that all of these people are part of the health care team and I need to have an understanding of what they do, but I have a finite amount of time to learn NURSING, and it feels like I am learning anything but. While I think every student nurse would do well to be exposed to a nursing home setting, I am spending the greatest chunk of my clinical experience there, while my classmates in other clinical groups are one on one w/ICU nurses, in IV clinics, and in hospitals with acute patients, experiencing hospital nursing.
Am I wrong? Should I believe my instructors who give me the party line of "it's a good opportunity to learn____" fill in the blank. I feel like the clinical portion of this nursing program is substandard and I keep getting sunshine in an attempt to deflect the fact that I am in fact right. Please tell me what you think, as I am about to lose it!
10 weeks (2, 5 week rotations at different hospital placements)- med surg, pt care, assessments, charting, delegating, all meds
Semester 4:
7 weeks pediatric
7 weeks woman and baby
I would be SOOO upset with you clinical rotations. I feel like that wouldnt prepare me at all. Sorry youre experiencing that. I guess looking on the bright side is youll have your BSN, where as I'll still need to do my RN to BSN. So youll at least have a leg up there. Good luck! Seems kinda crumby!
I'm in semester two of my ADN program and my schedule is exactly the same as yours except peds/baby stuff is semester three and psych is semester four. We've had plenty of opportunity so far to work in acute care in hospitals in clinicals - in fact the LTC stuff was limited in my program to a few weeks in the first semester where you worked mostly with LPNs wiping butts and passing meds. In second semester I actually got to spend a day with a wound care nurse on one of my clinical days and he let me actually debride and clean a wound and change dressings. Spent another day in the OR during second semester watching surgery close up. The more I hear about BSN programs the gladder I become about taking the route I'm taking in school - ADN at a community college to be an RN, then maybe later as an RN take online courses while I am working to get my BSN. I've always been more of a "hands on" person anyway as far as learning goes.
To the original poster: I hope things change for the better for you - it looks like you might have to be somewhat more aggressive when it comes to learning opportunities where you are at now.
YES DEFENSIVE of cna's & nurses LPN's in particular why? because of the work they do. Everyone called nurse went to pass the board exam. Got it on the first attempt ( speaking for myself here) . Therefore even on a public forum it will be appreciated that expressing opinions be done mindfully minimizing any words statement that could be perceived to be condescending . [b']i.e " I BSN student shadowing LPN " " OMG all they "lpn " do is pass meds to the resident 98% of time " meaning what ? they could be doing some other better things or important than helping residents take their 17 meds a day ?????[/b] anyway i noticed this was corrected with the new update giving more respect and realizing the hard work LPN do . There is no point going back and forth on this subject , at this point everyone spoke their mind .
By the way ! EVERYONE is here EXPRESSING their OPINIONS on a PUBLIC forum.
You've brought that up a number of times. IMO, you have misinterpreted so much. Here's how I see it.
The "OMG" was because the resident was taking 17 meds. That's a hell of a lot of meds for a single person at one time. Yes, OMG! I repeat: The OMG was due to the number of meds the patient was taking!
The OP is a student who is shadowing another nurse who only passes meds because that is the nurse's primary function at this facility 98% of the time.
What the OP is upset about is this: How long does it take someone to watch another person pass meds before she has a pretty good idea how do it? Thirty-five times in a single day is quite enough, I think. She is upset about her clinical experience limited to watching someone pass meds!
It's called "reading for comprehension". IOW, being able to not only read the words but to understand the author's intent behind those words. It's sort of scary to think that nurse's could miscomprehend so badly something that is written. What if they did the same thing with doctor's written orders?????
Sometimes I wonder if some posters on here are just trolls who are not really associated with healthcare in any meaningful way. I mean some of the things they test you on in the nursing school entrance exams are things like reading comprehension.
it's called "reading for comprehension". iow, being able to not only read the words but to understand the author's intent behind those words. it's sort of scary to think that nurse's could miscomprehend so badly something that is written. what if they did the same thing with doctor's written orders?????
sometimes i wonder if some posters on here are just trolls who are not really associated with healthcare in any meaningful way. i mean some of the things they test you on in the nursing school entrance exams are things like reading comprehension.
maybe that's what it is. clearly, no comprehension is going on here and i just don't see how anyone could get through nursing school without reading for comprehension...
You've brought that up a number of times. IMO, you have misinterpreted so much. Here's how I see it.
The "OMG" was because the resident was taking 17 meds. That's a hell of a lot of meds for a single person at one time. Yes, OMG! I repeat: The OMG was due to the number of meds the patient was taking!
The OP is a student who is shadowing another nurse who only passes meds because that is the nurse's primary function at this facility 98% of the time.
What the OP is upset about is this: How long does it take someone to watch another person pass meds before she has a pretty good idea how do it? Thirty-five times in a single day is quite enough, I think. She is upset about her clinical experience limited to watching someone pass meds!
Do you understand it now?
I appreciate your summary of her thread . it make sense & yes it did occur to me that she could have been saying the same you have just explained above . I too have done some clinicals and orientation which didn't advance my knowledge ,it only profited me to put in my clinicals hours. So i get her point . BUT I choose to reply in the manner i did on purpose because i have been exposed in my working experience to some people( nurses) who come in this field with a different agenda other than the love and compassion to care for the sick .Therefore thinking of themselves too good to perform various task they consider > . So i wanted to share my thought on that in case she was of of them ! I still don't see why she would "OMG " b/c a pt is taking 17 meds. By this time working toward her BSN that shouldn't have been surprising for her . I am aware of the factor reading /comprehension/misinterpretation of messages and i would like to say I respect that she expressed her frustration in the way that was fit for her . I also replied in my understanding of her words. Hope she was not being condescending .....you know we can't always tell by reading someone's notes .Few others replies here were also leaning in my view but let me say in the light of your explanation i wish her success and empathize she felt that way.
You are not crazy. But I am afraid this is not unusual to BSN programs. I graduated over 7 years ago, and it wasn't until my very last clinical day as a senior BSN student that I had 2 patients, and one was a walkie-talkie ready to be discharged. I, too, was stupified by the lack of real nursing experience we were getting. When I mentioned this to the head of the program, I was told that though they knew we were getting less in the way of hands-on experience, we had more in the way of "critical thinking" (don't even get me started on that buzz phrase) skills than the ADN students (please don't shoot the messenger). This meant that though we would start out lower on the curve, we would quickly surpass our ADN peers due to our superior "well-rounded" education. I was so offended by these comments ... and knew that, really, it was a lot of bunk.
Nursing is ... well, nursing - i.e. it's one of the most hands-on professions that I can think of. Without adequate training of the hands-on, we are left quite unprepared for the real world of nursing that awaits us. To add salt to the wound, hospitals, though purporting to have great graduate nurse orientation, can't come close to making up for the nursing education we didn't get while in school. It's not fair for them to have to ... so, what you often have are super green nurses being pushed off orientation because of the reality of hospital finances.
I likened my first 8 or so months of nursing to going to war without the benefit of bootcamp. It was just awful ... and the level of stress that I felt at that time has been unrivaled even to this day.
The truth of it is, there is a shortage of nursing instructors out there to help teach and guide nursing students on how "to do" nursing. Nursing academia is so full of itself that it limits the numbers even more by requiring clinical instructors to have master level degrees. Somehow suggesting that the ADNs or the BSNs have little worth in providing experienced nursing education. Honestly, it's just a shame and an embarrassment. Just look at the push to have APRNs educated on the doctorate level. Again, intimating that all those master prepared APRNs are somehow less than adequate. In my humble opinion, if nurses want to be called doctors, they really should go to medical school.
Clearly, this has touched a nerve in me. Just remember, that when you get out there, you will be a good nurse ... in time, because you are smart and capable and because you are one of the very few who question the inanity of thinking that books and shadowing will make you a good nurse versus actual having a chance to practice being one.
Why on her side ? because some nurses those who tend to look down on cna's ( Yes we know they exist) so these nurses who like to rub their title in ppl faces and carry themselves with their nose high above their ears ... yet when faced with an opportunity to do a task usually performed by cna the nurse goes .
I'm not sure that being a CNA would fundamentally change someone's personality. For those who do walk around with their noses in the air I'm not sure you can humble them through experiences.
Sometimes I wonder if some posters on here are just trolls who are not really associated with healthcare in any meaningful way. I mean some of the things they test you on in the nursing school entrance exams are things like reading comprehension.
No there's plenty of trolls in nursing. We attract them I guess. I think the fundamental problem is we all like to be right. Now with a million nurses all thinking we are right on this board.........Well you get the idea
First, thank you for your reply and second, nothing has changed in 7 years.
They are still using that same buzz phrase (and had to laugh hard because I feel the same way) and they are still promoting the idea of the BSN nurse starting out at a deficit, but then surpassing the ADN prepared nurse, which IMO is the biggest bunch of BS I ever heard.
Last spring while at my mental health clinical, I met an ADN student from a local Community College who was about to graduate; she outlined her program for me and I was crazy jealous. She was getting more than twice the clinical exposure I was and paying a fraction of the cost! I went back to my school and verbalized this feeling and heard the same old line in response. Only one of my instructors (who was an ADN grad) would even suggest my feelings were legitimate.
I am trying not to freak out about the fact that I feel so ill prepared and I keep telling myself that most graduate nurses feel the same way, but it is aggravating none the less. I pray I get into a good hospital w/a great preceptor program! Thanks so much for your words of encouragement.
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Nurse&
31 Posts
did complaining changed the situation ?
good luck in your nursing career.