ADN right before entering nursing school?

[yourdailyesther]

(I'm new here, and I couldn't seem to find a section this would fit under. I really don't know... probably Education or Pre-Nursing? STAFF: Move to whichever one you feel is more appropriate!)

Long story short, I was accepted to Mount St Mary's ADN program, which I'm to start in fall 2011. I called in and tried to ask when the first day of school really was, but the receptionist cut me off, "Yeah, I'm sorry but I actually don't know anything about that besides what it says on the website. I'm assuming, like you said, it's in late August, yeah. I don't know, but probably. If you're really curious in the specifics, you'd have to speak to [and she provided the full name of my counselor, who had been writing and calling me a few times]."

So... I finished high school two years early and headed to two community colleges to hurry and complete my mission. I actually have taken all the classes needed so far. As in, everything on that page, except Chemistry and English 101, both of which I'm planning to tackle this Winter Intersession.

However, the problem is, I have been speaking to many people about my decision. The typical response? "Yeah, that's a good choice. Nursing is a good profession. It's always demanding." Not in Los Angeles, many thanks to overpopulation in both schools and the workplace, limited job opportunities, and some other urban/economical problems. I've heard there's similar dilemmas in both San Francisco and New York City (a quick search on this particular forum confirms it, especially in recent years). A couple have told me, "You know, it ~IS~ a great idea and an even better profession. Your parents must be proud of you. But the bad news is that being an ADN isn't good anymore. Even 10 or 20 years ago it was, but now most people are aiming for BSN or MSN. BSN and beyond gives you the opportunity to work with technology as a nurse, and you'll most likely have hiring advantage and higher income, if just slightly." And I heard the same from my parents. Unfortunately, MSM's program is $60k, and I don't think financial aid can cover much, but I feel the pressure to quickly earn a BSN. I'm not planning on having kids right now, and I have been celibate and single my whole life, so I believe I can continue this - a guy at my college told me the same thing, "I don't think it's ~THAT~ bad if you don't marry and have kids right after graduation if you get a BSN right now. Alternatively, you can just pay it off with the money you make from the RN degree and then go to an RN-BSN program."

So... yeah, I guess my question kind of is: is this a good idea? I do not know for sure, but I believe the RN-BSN way is actually faster, although you have to complete some other classes before diving into the latter. Does anybody have any other advice?

[ocean waves]

Hello. Congratulations for being "accepted to Mount St. Mary's Associate Degree Nursing" program! I agree with the other writers about these points: (1) expense--merits of lower tuition cost for two year ASN programs in contrast to a four year BSN program cost; (2)time---value of shorter time period to complete ASN; (3)career building--asset of working with your ASN when later returning to school;(4)job options--user friendly reality that many nursing job requirements include ASN education(some jobs do require BSN or MSN such as positions in management,public health,nursing education,research). Best wishes!

[PatMac10,RN, RN]

That's what I was thinking!

Yeah, I realize that less than 20% of American nurses hold a BS or higher, but that figure may change in the future.

Yeah, I think I'm just going to get my ADN first and then join an RN-BSN program, as has been mentioned here. It shouldn't be that bad, but I look at the descriptions of passing ~TWO~ exams and taking ~TWO~ sets of perquisites and I feel like I just got hit by a truck (not ~THAT~ bad, maybe, but...). Anyway, if I did it once before, I could probably do it again.

Thanks for all your help.

Good for you! Whatever you decide just do your best at it. As long as your happy with your decision. I agree that the percentage of nurses with a BSN will and is rising. I honestly believe that one day BSN may be the minimum standard to practice as a RN. SO after we get our ADNs we better not lag around with completing a RN-to-BSN programs! Lolz!

[yourdailyesther]

A bit late on this, 'cause I had to spend a few days off the computer doing other things.

Somehow missed this before:

There is no technology I'm aware of that a BSN can use that an ADN can not. It is tough for everyone to find a job right now, but they're predicting that when the economy rebounds more older nurses will retire therefore opening up a lot more jobs. Do what your heart tells you to, but just know that once you have your ADN, it's only 1 year more (and online) to get your BSN. You can do this while you work.

This is what I was thinking, because I recall being in a couple doctors' offices. The LPNs and RNs were still using the computers and everything. I was asking one of my medical doctors, "So what is the difference between an RN and a BSN?" (My dad opined, "Yeah, I would trust her the most since she actually works with them and she's probably heard some more information than any other people, except them actually.") She responded, "It's not ~SO~ obvious! You won't look at a nurse and say, 'Is this a 2 year or a 4 year nurse?' But actually, the latter can do a few more things the former cannot, including: reviewing research papers, advocate the patient, a couple management positions, and work alongside people in the medical industry of higher education. As for them making more money, it really depends on age and location."

Good for you! Whatever you decide just do your best at it. As long as your happy with your decision. I agree that the percentage of nurses with a BSN will and is rising. I honestly believe that one day BSN may be the minimum standard to practice as a RN. SO after we get our ADNs we better not lag around with completing a RN-to-BSN programs! Lolz!

Yeah... just wondering how I'll be able to pay off for the RN-BSN program now. I'll probably take the advice handed to me from the guy at my college and just work for a bit before jumping into another program. Oh, God. I can't wait to be finished with college!

[PatMac10,RN, RN]

a bit late on this, 'cause i had to spend a few days off the computer doing other things.

yeah... just wondering how i'll be able to pay off for the rn-bsn program now. i'll probably take the advice handed to me from the guy at my college and just work for a bit before jumping into another program. oh, god. i can't wait to be finished with college!

well a lot of hospitals and other facilities offer tuition reimbursement for their nurses that return to school to continue their education with a bsn or msn or ph.d/dnp. my hospital does. also some program suggest but don't require a at least a year of experience before applying. if you get a job within the first year after your licensure you should be able to fund your rn-to-bsn education just fine, especially if you get financial aid and scholarship, or employee assistance from your place of work. there are many ways to pay for it. there are more and more governmental grants and scholarships popping up for nurses to continue their education.

also on your comment to the other poster "but actually, the latter can do a few more things the former cannot, including: reviewing research papers, advocate the patient, a couple management positions, and work alongside people in the medical industry of higher education. as for them making more money, it really depends on age and location."

all rns (adn, bsn, msn, and dnp)

even lpns, patient reps (who are not even clinical personnel) and cnas and other uap to an extent practice patient advocacy. patient advocacy is one of the many the things that distinguishes nurses from other healthcare professions and adn programs have been around a little longer than most bsn programs and before adn programs diploma programs were around even longer, so nurses have been patient advocates long before bsn or adn programs were even thought of. anyone can review a research paper who has the adequate knowledge to do so. the management thing can be up to the facility, bsn nurses are simply thought to be better prepared from the get go to be in management. at my hospital and at many others i assume. many of the nursing supervisors (the rn who supervise all of the rns in the hospital for that shift, and pronounce patients dead, f necessary and other weighty duties) only have their rn. actually all of them do except for 3 who have bsns. now some of those with just their adn have many many years of experience and have various certifications. actually the director of clinical management and adon at our hospital started off as a adn nurse and just got her bsn a year or two ago and she's bee nan adon for 5 years. she's in school now to get her msn though.

at our hospital they look at education when it comes to positions of leadership, but they put experience before education when it comes to weighing out who will be charge nurse, unit nursing manager, supervisor etc, and we have many bsn nurses at our hospital..... some facilities don't do this however and that's fine. my mom for example has been a nurse since july of 2000 and she works at the same hospital and is an adn nurse, who is pursuing a msn in an adn to msn program now, and she is always made charge nurse on l&d/ob whenever she's on shift.

as for working with those with higher degrees in medical industry all nurses (rn and lpns) and even cnas and janitors work alongside such people. i set up suture sets for the mds in the er and uc center all the time. i report abnormal vital signs to the mds, at the nurses request of course, i also communicate with the pharmacist when the nurse can't in regards to dosages, wrong medicines being delivered, and stuff of that nature.

[yourdailyesther]

well a lot of hospitals and other facilities offer tuition reimbursement for their nurses that return to school to continue their education with a bsn or msn or ph.d/dnp. my hospital does. also some program suggest but don't require a at least a year of experience before applying. if you get a job within the first year after your licensure you should be able to fund your rn-to-bsn education just fine, especially if you get financial aid and scholarship, or employee assistance from your place of work. there are many ways to pay for it. there are more and more governmental grants and scholarships popping up for nurses to continue their education.

also on your comment to the other poster "but actually, the latter can do a few more things the former cannot, including: reviewing research papers, advocate the patient, a couple management positions, and work alongside people in the medical industry of higher education. as for them making more money, it really depends on age and location."

all rns (adn, bsn, msn, and dnp)

even lpns, patient reps (who are not even clinical personnel) and cnas and other uap to an extent practice patient advocacy. patient advocacy is one of the many the things that distinguishes nurses from other healthcare professions and adn programs have been around a little longer than most bsn programs and before adn programs diploma programs were around even longer, so nurses have been patient advocates long before bsn or adn programs were even thought of. anyone can review a research paper who has the adequate knowledge to do so. the management thing can be up to the facility, bsn nurses are simply thought to be better prepared from the get go to be in management. at my hospital and at many others i assume. many of the nursing supervisors (the rn who supervise all of the rns in the hospital for that shift, and pronounce patients dead, f necessary and other weighty duties) only have their rn. actually all of them do except for 3 who have bsns. now some of those with just their adn have many many years of experience and have various certifications. actually the director of clinical management and adon at our hospital started off as a adn nurse and just got her bsn a year or two ago and she's bee nan adon for 5 years. she's in school now to get her msn though.

at our hospital they look at education when it comes to positions of leadership, but they put experience before education when it comes to weighing out who will be charge nurse, unit nursing manager, supervisor etc, and we have many bsn nurses at our hospital..... some facilities don't do this however and that's fine. my mom for example has been a nurse since july of 2000 and she works at the same hospital and is an adn nurse, who is pursuing a msn in an adn to msn program now, and she is always made charge nurse on l&d/ob whenever she's on shift.

as for working with those with higher degrees in medical industry all nurses (rn and lpns) and even cnas and janitors work alongside such people. i set up suture sets for the mds in the er and uc center all the time. i report abnormal vital signs to the mds, at the nurses request of course, i also communicate with the pharmacist when the nurse can't in regards to dosages, wrong medicines being delivered, and stuff of that nature.

speaking to a relative, she said, "yeah, it's far too complicated for me. as for them raising it, it's definitely a fact that most nurses in this country still hold rn and not much more education than that. however, they might raise it, but i don't see it coming that soon. it'll probably be in 2020s or something."

i was actually speaking to one of the nurses at the doctor's office, and she said the same as you, "actually, it's not completely true. it really depends on the department to assign you. a lot of experienced rns are just as equally prepared, if not more, than those who hold bsns. and the adn degree actually came first. the bsn is a fairly recent thing, like, i don't know, even in the 1970s through 1990s most students walked out with an adn. the only difference is probably, like you said, bsns do have a certain advantage when it comes to hiring and working for management positions. but a lot of people today are getting bses than ever, so if you wanted to further your education, go for it."

do you know anything about the salary of rn vs. bsn? that's a topic i'm interested in exploring and haven't covered irl yet; google results are inconclusive.

[PatMac10,RN, RN]

There are a lot of posts on here that discuss pay issues and differences in BSN and ADN nurses. On a personal note, in my area BSN and ADN staff nurses who work the floor make the same thing regardless of degree, it's experience that gives you an increase in pay from there or getting a position in management or supervision etc.. Some places may sometimes pay nurses with BSNs 2% to 10% more, most around 5% though.

[PMFB-RN, RN]

Do you know anything about the salary of RN vs. BSN? That's a topic I'm interested in exploring and haven't covered IRL yet; Google results are inconclusive.

*** There is no such thing as RN vs BSN. BSNs are just RNs. I think you mean ADN prepared RNs vs BSN prepared RNs. In my state (Wisconsin) no hospital I am aware of in this state pays staff nurses more for their degrees. I work in a Magnet, tertiary care, trauma center hospital in the SICU. We have nurses with ADN, BSN and entry level masters and all make the same except for pay for experience. We hired a new ICU manager last year who is an ADN RN.

[Getting To Great]

well a lot of hospitals and other facilities offer tuition reimbursement for their nurses that return to school to continue their education with a bsn or msn or ph.d/dnp. my hospital does. also some program suggest but don't require a at least a year of experience before applying. if you get a job within the first year after your licensure you should be able to fund your rn-to-bsn education just fine, especially if you get financial aid and scholarship, or employee assistance from your place of work. there are many ways to pay for it. there are more and more governmental grants and scholarships popping up for nurses to continue their education.

also on your comment to the other poster "but actually, the latter can do a few more things the former cannot, including: reviewing research papers, advocate the patient, a couple management positions, and work alongside people in the medical industry of higher education. as for them making more money, it really depends on age and location."

all rns (adn, bsn, msn, and dnp)

even lpns, patient reps (who are not even clinical personnel) and cnas and other uap to an extent practice patient advocacy. patient advocacy is one of the many the things that distinguishes nurses from other healthcare professions and adn programs have been around a little longer than most bsn programs and before adn programs diploma programs were around even longer, so nurses have been patient advocates long before bsn or adn programs were even thought of. anyone can review a research paper who has the adequate knowledge to do so. the management thing can be up to the facility, bsn nurses are simply thought to be better prepared from the get go to be in management. at my hospital and at many others i assume. many of the nursing supervisors (the rn who supervise all of the rns in the hospital for that shift, and pronounce patients dead, f necessary and other weighty duties) only have their rn. actually all of them do except for 3 who have bsns. now some of those with just their adn have many many years of experience and have various certifications. actually the director of clinical management and adon at our hospital started off as a adn nurse and just got her bsn a year or two ago and she's bee nan adon for 5 years. she's in school now to get her msn though.

at our hospital they look at education when it comes to positions of leadership, but they put experience before education when it comes to weighing out who will be charge nurse, unit nursing manager, supervisor etc, and we have many bsn nurses at our hospital..... some facilities don't do this however and that's fine. my mom for example has been a nurse since july of 2000 and she works at the same hospital and is an adn nurse, who is pursuing a msn in an adn to msn program now, and she is always made charge nurse on l&d/ob whenever she's on shift.

as for working with those with higher degrees in medical industry all nurses (rn and lpns) and even cnas and janitors work alongside such people. i set up suture sets for the mds in the er and uc center all the time. i report abnormal vital signs to the mds, at the nurses request of course, i also communicate with the pharmacist when the nurse can't in regards to dosages, wrong medicines being delivered, and stuff of that nature.

@patmac10,cna,

i know this is off topic, but i just realized your age; and i just want to applaud you because i used to work for child welfare (as a social worker) and my clients were around your age group who needed guidance and attention, but took the wrong exit in life so young. i'm just touch by you right now.

best of luck.

[PatMac10,RN, RN]

@PatMac10,CNA,

I know this is off topic, but I just realized your age; and I just want to applaud you because I used to work for Child Welfare (as a Social Worker) and my clients were around your age group who needed guidance and attention, but took the wrong exit in life so young. I'm just touch by you right now.

Best of Luck.

Thanks JunieBug! I know what I want and was raised to shoot for it no matter what.

[Boog'sCRRN246, RN]

That's what I was thinking!

Yeah, I realize that less than 20% of American nurses hold a BS or higher, but that figure may change in the future.

Yeah, I think I'm just going to get my ADN first and then join an RN-BSN program, as has been mentioned here. It shouldn't be that bad, but I look at the descriptions of passing ~TWO~ exams and taking ~TWO~ sets of perquisites and I feel like I just got hit by a truck (not ~THAT~ bad, maybe, but...). Anyway, if I did it once before, I could probably do it again.

Thanks for all your help.

I'm curious what you mean when you refer to taking TWO exams. To be a RN, you only have to pass the NCLEX once, be it after graduating from an ADN or a BSN program. If you do a RN-BSN bridge, you've already passed the NCLEX.

[Guest717236]

Do you know anything about the salary of RN vs. BSN? That's a topic I'm interested in exploring and haven't covered IRL yet; Google results are inconclusive.

Well, I am old enough to remember when the BSN was a concept and just getting started.

My understanding was that many professions had BS degrees and nursing wanted to transition

to having a college degree as well. Back then I never saw a debate about one level of nursing

being better than another. My own view was that nursing would keep different levels for

2 reasons-

First, nursing has a wide array of talented individuals, with different backgrounds.

Students straight out of high school, mature students who have various experiences and

now want to return to school, and RNs who want to advance their learning by returning to

school for another degree.

Second, due to financial costs of education, the step process ADN etc, allows a student

to advance at their own pace according to finances and personal responsibilities.

In our area, many hospitals did not reward a BSN degree with a pay increase for nurses

who returned to school for that degree even before the economic down turn.

The final analysis to me is that many patients expect a competent, caring , nurse to

address their treatment needs and nurses of all educational levels can do so and

work together in harmony according to their scope of practice...