Job market- ADN students being warned? - page 4

Ok so I oriented a 4th semester nursing student from the local community college last week and this was for her "trends" class. I work in a state facility for DD population. We got to talking and she of course wants to work in... Read More

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    [QUOTE=

    They must be an awful big local hospital system to be hiring 120 new grads a year every year. Or have real high turnover.[/QUOTE]

    They are huge and recently acquired yet another smaller hospital system in addition to building another new hospital and stand-alone ER. They have several hospitals including a children's hospital plus a massive amount of doctor's offices, urgent cares, satellite ERs, etc. There is a second hospital system in the area with several hospitals, their own children's hospital, doctor's offices, urgent cares, etc so there are plenty of opportunities to get hired.
    NeoNurse2Be likes this.

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    I live in New England... I graduated in May 2012 with a class of 36 from an ADN program. Every single one of my classmates is currently working as an RN. I myself was hired on a telemetry floor in a local hospital. First and only job I applied- and I have NO medical back ground. Getting a nursing job is like any other job- they want to see how you are as a person, how well did you do in school?, how are your references, etc, etc. Try not to stress about what every body else is debating around you... work hard in school, put your best foot forward when applying for jobs, and never give up!
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    Sad to say that the increase in recruiting for nursing schools will evolve into an abundance of tuition for colleges and a ton of unpayable student loan debt for new grad nurses.
    nursingmomma33 and HouTx like this.
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    Pre-recession, a BIG "nursing shortage" was indeed cast, and all the numbers pointed to baby boomers: BB nurses retiring, BBs getting old and sick in vast numbers. The statisticians had a field day with the doom and gloom, and were mostly correct in their projections. But still, no one can predict the future. The stats jocks who predicted a nursing shortage were just as sucker-punched by everyone else by the recession.

    Nursing schools responded at the time of this pre-recession projection, understandably, by expanding their programs, hiring more faculty, applying for more grants and accepting the scores of people running to nursing as a 2nd/3rd career/safety net.

    Then look what happened: the recession hit, and hit middle class people (like nurses) HARD. All those battle axes and crusty old bats DIDN'T retire. They hung on by their one good talon, continuing to work because they had no choice. Meanwhile, the hugely expanded nursing programs continued to crank out grads like factories. People lost jobs, lost health insurance, and went to the doctor less. Demand for nurses shrunk while the supply was huge.

    People are so keen to place blame on one thing. The truth is, the glut we're experiencing is to blame on MANY factors.

    Think if you were the administrator of a nursing program at a college, around 2004. You green-lighted millions to expand your programs, to stay current with the job market projections that made TOTAL sense at the time. You hired faculty on tenure tracks & contracts and spent TONS on new labs & classrooms. Then BOOM: the bottom drops out & no one needs the hundreds of new grads you just pinned. What would YOU do? You: under intense pressure from your Deans, the President, and Board of Regents, which includes community members......would you choose to tell the marketers (you also hired during the expansion) HEY TAKE A HIKE! We don't need more applicants! OR: would you continue to market your program to generate tuition revenue, and justify those millions you begged the Budget Committee for? Think about this. My mother is a retired college dean, and these are the politics no one really thinks about. It's bitter and nasty - and it's almost always about the bottom line *cough* President's salary *cough*

    I have ZERO sympathy for people who decide to spend thousands (even if it's their parent's money) or go into debt for years for a degree they DIDN'T RESEARCH. The nursing GLUT has existed now for 5+years. For any nursing student to NOT KNOW how crappy the market (still) is, is RIDICULOUS. Any 19 year old, heck, any 9 year old or 99 year old can go to the government labor websites, here, or talk to any recruiter and get the 411 about this. There is NO EXCUSE for not knowing the job market SUCKS for nurses (especially ADNs, LPNs and new grads) right now and might for a little while.

    The schools might be guilty of overselling their programs a bit, but I don't think it's as insidious as people want to believe. They spent tons and were given quotas to meet in return. People WAY HIGH UP in the ivory tower have no sense of reality - regents and deans and presidents just want good PR, a pretty campus and good numbers. As a result, many nursing schools are now caught between a rock and a hard place. But it's still not their responsibility to "warn" anyone about degree job markets, unless they have it in writing at admission that they will assist in job placement.

    Judging from the vast amount of posts I see here every day, and nurses I interview/hire/train, VERY few people take the responsibility to learn about the state of nursing today.
    Nurse_Diane, gummi bear, uRNmyway, and 2 others like this.
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    I think all new grad should know what is going on in the job market, for whatever career they are going into. I'm graduating from an ADN program in about 8 weeks and I already started looking for a job. It is a little disheartening to see posting for BSN only or so many years experience, but I'm still going to apply because you never know. Nursing is my second career, so I don't harbor any illusion about the current job market. I would love to work in a hospital, but I'm not above starting out in a community center or dialysis center.
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    Around here a lot of hospitals are specifying that they will not hire new grads for particular positions, including LTC. At the big Boston hospitals like MGH and Children's, ADNs are not getting hired at all; the BSN is pretty much the entry level. Hospitals going for Magnet status may hire ADNs, but I think having a BSN or higher is an advantage.

    I graduated from a direct-entry masters program, and only some of my classmates had jobs by graduation (I think we're all employed now, but it took a long time). A colleague of mine said that hospitals don't like hiring new grads because on average they only stay in their first job for a year, and then all the orientation money is wasted. I am lucky to have the job I wanted (took 9 months to get it), so I'm not going anywhere, but I know that med-surg units have a lot of turnover because of this.

    There may in fact be a nursing shortage; lots of units are actually understaffed. That does NOT mean they are hiring.
    HouTx likes this.
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    My local community college ADN program not only warns applicants at the "meet 'n greet" info sessions, but posts the advisory right on the website: "ADN graduates may find employment difficult in a competitive market due to the goal of 80% BSN nurses." The advisory is immediately followed by a list of RN-to-BSN programs in the area.

    I'm applying to this program because they seem to know what's going on and are not afraid to warn applicants. They are also actively recruiting contract arrangements with the local BSN programs to provide seamless transition from ADN to BSN. Talk about taking lemons and making lemonade!
    gummi bear likes this.
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    Quote from TakeTwoAspirin
    Call me crazy, but I honestly don't think it's the school's job to warn students about potential job markets years down the road. Nobody knows what the job market will be like 2 or 4 years from now. When selecting an academic pursuit it is up to the individual to do their own research and make a decision based on their own desires, academic goals, financial limits, and research about potential job markets once they graduate. The schools have no control over the job market, nor are they able to predict the future. The same principle applies to education as it does for any large purchase - buyer beware!
    *** I agree with you in principal. However the other side of the coin is that many nursing schools are pushing the false and self serving "nursing shortage" propaganda. I hear their ads on the radio and TV often. While it may not be their job to educate potential students as to the future job market, their misleading students is just evil.
    gummi bear, HouTx, and Esme12 like this.
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    Pre-recession, a BIG "nursing shortage" was indeed cast, and all the numbers pointed to baby boomers: BB nurses retiring, BBs getting old and sick in vast numbers. The statisticians had a field day with the doom and gloom, and were mostly correct in their projections. But still, no one can predict the future. The stats jocks who predicted a nursing shortage were just as sucker-punched by everyone else by the recession.
    *** Um, no. There never was a nursing shortage. The "nursing shortage" was deliberate, false, self serving propaganda put out by those who stand to benifit financialy from a glut of nurses. A large over supply of nurses was the goal from the start. All the recession did was move the over supply day ahead a few years.

    Nursing schools responded at the time of this pre-recession projection, understandably, by expanding their programs, hiring more faculty, applying for more grants and accepting the scores of people running to nursing as a 2nd/3rd career/safety net.
    *** No. Some nurisng schools were duped like most everybody else but many were not. Many were activly seeking to push the false "nursing shortage" propaganda to get more money and prestige for themsleves. Our tax dollars flowed into nursing school all over the country and the schools benifited from this.

    People are so keen to place blame on one thing. The truth is, the glut we're experiencing is to blame on MANY factors.
    *** There is only one factor to blame for the glut of nurses. The timing of the glut may have several factors to blame.
    There has never been a nursing shortage in the 18 years I have been in nursing. Certainly there were times when there were many more jobs available but that in no way indicates a shortage of nurses. There have alwasy been plenty of nurses. What there hasn't alwasy been is enough nurses willing to work for the pay and working conditions being offered at the time. Also with the better economy many nurses found employment in non nursing areas but alwasy plenty of RNs out there.

    Think if you were the administrator of a nursing program at a college, around 2004. You green-lighted millions to expand your programs, to stay current with the job market projections that made TOTAL sense at the time.
    *** If you did you were a dupe and a sucker for obviously false propaganda. I can only imagine how out of toutch one must be to have fallen for such obviously false propaganda.

    You hired faculty on tenure tracks & contracts and spent TONS on new labs & classrooms. Then BOOM: the bottom drops out & no one needs the hundreds of new grads you just pinned. What would YOU do? You: under intense pressure from your Deans, the President, and Board of Regents, which includes community members.
    *** Please. Those schools saw an oppertunity to vastly expand their empires and their presitige and took it.

    I have ZERO sympathy for people who decide to spend thousands (even if it's their parent's money) or go into debt for years for a degree they DIDN'T RESEARCH. The nursing GLUT has existed now for 5+years. For any nursing student to NOT KNOW how crappy the market (still) is, is RIDICULOUS. Any 19 year old, heck, any 9 year old or 99 year old can go to the government labor websites, here, or talk to any recruiter and get the 411 about this. There is NO EXCUSE for not knowing the job market SUCKS for nurses (especially ADNs, LPNs and new grads) right now and might for a little while.
    *** Yet daily one can see, hear and reads advertizements from nursing schools STILL pushing their old "nursing shortage" propaganda. It's false advertizing and evil.
    Nurse_Diane, Esme12, and nursel56 like this.
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    Which State?


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