help! Are surgical techs and RNs the same??

Specialties Operating Room

Published

I am an operating room nurse at a rather large hospital. This facility has made it so that the Surgical techs and the RNs are pretty much equal. Therefore i am often talked to with disrespect and sarcasm, as well as constant undermining. I am feeling like i wasted my time going thru four years of college to have my RN be disregarded. I was a surgical tech for 15years and i never behaved that way. My alligence was always to my nurse. And when things went wrong i knew we had each others back.

I don't want to boss people around but i do think that a lot of the decisions in my room should be left up to me since i have a license on the line. however i am very open to ideas from my scrub person. I just don't like being told what "I need to do!" I feel i have earned the right to make decisions, but if i am seen as equal to my surgical tech then why did i bother being a nurse............. I am trying to be a team player but it just seems kind of weird to me that the roles have been sort of reversed. :crying2:

Most problems can be handled with a few words from the circulator. Calm professional assertive voice should be used. When staff over step their bounds ask them to stop. Quiet one-on-one warnings usually work best. If a facility through action or inaction allows non-licensed staff to perform licensed duties it is time to move on.

I agree with Corvette guy. I mean, I went to my supervisor and nothing has been done. It may not be my job to point out what his job description is, but I rather have him feel a little bent out of shape at me rather than compromise the safety of my patient. I have a feeling that many on these posts are getting the wrong impression. It's not RN vs. tech or LPN. Its right vs. wrong. From what I read, no one on this thread is contesting that a vital role as a circulator in the OR is to supervises the room. Am I doing my job if I dont address the problem myself in fear of insulting him by pointing out what his scope of practice is when he is obviously practicing outside of it? I dont think so. :rolleyes:

Specializes in 5 yrs OR, ASU Pre-Op 2 yr. ER.
So, if the Circulator is the room supervisor, then is it not appropriate for the Circulator to make sure that each OR team member in such room abide by there job description?

Where did i say it's not appropriate for a circulator to see that everyone is abiding by their job description?

I didn't.

What i have said is if someone were to hand me a copy of my job description if i were outside of my scope, it would be the dept. supervisor. If i were to the point of being outside of my scope (which will never happen), management would/should be involved.

I am new and this is my first post. I have been a surgical tech for 4yrs now, and work 3-11p at a Level One Trauma Center. Taking the evening shift, I became the sole staff employee on this shift, for 3yrs. (only traveling RN's were with me) Suffice to say, I was thrown in daily to some of the most difficult cases surgeons face. And I learned ALOT, about ALOT, and learned QUICK. I had no choice. If I didnt know exactly what each surgeon (albeit ortho, vascular, transplant, neuro, thoracic, plastics, general, etc.) wanted and needed....my experience with the surgeon (my ability to keep up, anticipate, and 'feel in sync' with him/her) wasnt going to be there, leading to frustration on their part and feeling inadequate on my part. So I took notes, read online about surgeries, studied procedure guides, asked alot of questions, and after 4yrs, I have developed a repoire of respect, unprecedented, with ALL of our surgeons (we have 25 OR suites). I am somewhat of an anamoly, as 99% of our techs work the day shift (or are forced to take off-shifts as part of their requirements) and most are uncomfortable outside of their speciality. Our hospital has lost 30 OR techs/nurses over the last 2yrs, to other hospitals, creating such a crisis that management called a meeting last year and urged ANYONE who got another offer, to come to them so they could counteroffer.

So now you have a background.

I have been reviewed yearly and have gotten small raises (.25 here, .40 there) I am at a point, where I feel I am WORTH MORE because of my versatility, my excellent repoire, and the fact that my managers have witnessed even the most demanding surgeons request me in their room.

I recently was 'approached' by another area hospital (whose employees work with us hourly and passed my name along), and was offered $2 more an hour. Now, I am COMFORTABLE working where I am and I dont WANT to leave. So I did what I remember management saying. I went to them.

I spoke with our HR nurse recruiter....who, told me that she was THE PERSON who made salary decisions, and was SO GLAD that I was coming to her before taking another offer and leaving.

By the end of the conversation, she told me that she had to get 'approval' from her supervisor (a mysterious person whos name HAS NEVER BEEN MENTIONED TO ANYONE, EVER)

BUT, she assured, she forsaw no problem (as the mystery person is quick to respond to these situations)

The next day, her story changed again.

Now, she was telling me that the 'mystery person' had a biased opinion of my position, "SURGICAL TECH" That is I was an RN....it would be a different story. IF AN RN GETS A BETTER OFFER SOMEWHERE ELSE, THEY REACT IMMEDIATELY WITH A BETTER OFFER.

That no 'TECH' has come to management with another offer. So, she compared my situation to a situation involving a Nurse Managers secretary, who asked for more money, and 'the mystery person' dragged it out for weeks, but eventually the secretary got her raise. Two days later, my OR director mentioned to me that he was getting alot of talk from 'suits and ties' about my plight, and that although what I was doing might help techs in the future, it probably wasnt going to help me. very strange.

A week later, not hearing anything (but assured I would), I called the HR recruiter, who told me my answer was no. But that they were 'looking into an across the board' change. I was now told that giving me a raise would throw the 'internal whatever' off. Something they couldnt do. (Did she forget she told me they DO THIS EVERYDAY for RN's?)

My plight here, is I was basically told flat out that because my position is not considered VALUABLE to administration, I can walk out the door.

"But we hope you will stay" was my goodbye.

Yes, I CAN walk and take another job, and might, but that isnt my POINT

IS THIS A TRUE CASE OF DISCRIMINATION? It certainly FEELS like it?

I know that to take it farther, will be my demise within the company.

I know how politics work. They'd crush me, deny they ever said anything discriminatory, and Id end up blacklisted from the community.

If anyone has experienced anything like this, or has any input, Id greatly appreciate it :)

I am new and this is my first post. I have been a surgical tech for 4yrs now, and work 3-11p at a Level One Trauma Center. Taking the evening shift, I became the sole staff employee on this shift, for 3yrs. (only traveling RN's were with me) Suffice to say, I was thrown in daily to some of the most difficult cases surgeons face. And I learned ALOT, about ALOT, and learned QUICK. I had no choice. If I didnt know exactly what each surgeon (albeit ortho, vascular, transplant, neuro, thoracic, plastics, general, etc.) wanted and needed....my experience with the surgeon (my ability to keep up, anticipate, and 'feel in sync' with him/her) wasnt going to be there, leading to frustration on their part and feeling inadequate on my part. So I took notes, read online about surgeries, studied procedure guides, asked alot of questions, and after 4yrs, I have developed a repoire of respect, unprecedented, with ALL of our surgeons (we have 25 OR suites). I am somewhat of an anamoly, as 99% of our techs work the day shift (or are forced to take off-shifts as part of their requirements) and most are uncomfortable outside of their speciality. Our hospital has lost 30 OR techs/nurses over the last 2yrs, to other hospitals, creating such a crisis that management called a meeting last year and urged ANYONE who got another offer, to come to them so they could counteroffer.

So now you have a background.

I have been reviewed yearly and have gotten small raises (.25 here, .40 there) I am at a point, where I feel I am WORTH MORE because of my versatility, my excellent repoire, and the fact that my managers have witnessed even the most demanding surgeons request me in their room.

I recently was 'approached' by another area hospital (whose employees work with us hourly and passed my name along), and was offered $2 more an hour. Now, I am COMFORTABLE working where I am and I dont WANT to leave. So I did what I remember management saying. I went to them.

I spoke with our HR nurse recruiter....who, told me that she was THE PERSON who made salary decisions, and was SO GLAD that I was coming to her before taking another offer and leaving.

By the end of the conversation, she told me that she had to get 'approval' from her supervisor (a mysterious person whos name HAS NEVER BEEN MENTIONED TO ANYONE, EVER)

BUT, she assured, she forsaw no problem (as the mystery person is quick to respond to these situations)

The next day, her story changed again.

Now, she was telling me that the 'mystery person' had a biased opinion of my position, "SURGICAL TECH" That is I was an RN....it would be a different story. IF AN RN GETS A BETTER OFFER SOMEWHERE ELSE, THEY REACT IMMEDIATELY WITH A BETTER OFFER.

That no 'TECH' has come to management with another offer. So, she compared my situation to a situation involving a Nurse Managers secretary, who asked for more money, and 'the mystery person' dragged it out for weeks, but eventually the secretary got her raise. Two days later, my OR director mentioned to me that he was getting alot of talk from 'suits and ties' about my plight, and that although what I was doing might help techs in the future, it probably wasnt going to help me. very strange.

A week later, not hearing anything (but assured I would), I called the HR recruiter, who told me my answer was no. But that they were 'looking into an across the board' change. I was now told that giving me a raise would throw the 'internal whatever' off. Something they couldnt do. (Did she forget she told me they DO THIS EVERYDAY for RN's?)

My plight here, is I was basically told flat out that because my position is not considered VALUABLE to administration, I can walk out the door.

"But we hope you will stay" was my goodbye.

Yes, I CAN walk and take another job, and might, but that isnt my POINT

IS THIS A TRUE CASE OF DISCRIMINATION? It certainly FEELS like it?

I know that to take it farther, will be my demise within the company.

I know how politics work. They'd crush me, deny they ever said anything discriminatory, and Id end up blacklisted from the community.

If anyone has experienced anything like this, or has any input, Id greatly appreciate it :)

I'd probably leave just to spite them.

Take the better job offer &/or pursue RN. I did.

Specializes in Telemetry, OR, ICU.
Take the better job offer &/or pursue RN. I did.

:yeahthat:

What are tech's? What is their training? I have never heard of them before.

We don't have them where I work. We used to have RPN's (formerly RNA's) work in this role as a scrub nurse but did away with them.

Sarah

Okay, this may be a stupid question, but I have to ask. Does a RNFA act in the same role as the scrub or circulating nurse? What is the difference with a RNFA? I thought, I could be way off base, that you had to go for more schooling to be a RNFA. Is that not true?

Specializes in 5 yrs OR, ASU Pre-Op 2 yr. ER.

An RNFA can do the same things as a scrub or circulator, but they can also suture, handling tissue, providing exposure, using instruments, and providing hemostasis. An RNFA has taken a course (yes you do go for more schooling, it's not very long though) for this and has a certification to do these things. It also varies state to state what can and cannot be done.

issues like this get where they are (in an or suite) for one reason. leaders have lost the ability to lead. twenty years ago, many leaders rose to their positions because their peers, surgeons and hospital leaders recognized that person’s ability to get people to work together. those who have been around for a while know i mean. a little gray in the temples or a little swagger in the step, but with one glance you knew that you were out of line and you respected that person so much, you stopped acting out and got your rear-end back in line.

it seems now that leaders aren’t cultivated, they are appointed. i have managed operating rooms for over twenty-five years now. i am an associates degree nurse. what i learned about getting people to work together, i learned by doing the work, and from being mentored by some very generous managers- not by sitting in a classroom. and, the one thing that every one of these leaders taught me was that you can’t manage an operating room suite from your office. if you are on the halls, in the rooms and other areas (pacu, spd, etc) talking to your team, issues get resolved. it is my responsibility to fix systems issues so people can get their work done. it is my responsibility to confront surgeons who misbehave and it is easier to do this at the scrub sink. it’s simple but not necessarily easy. if mangers do their part and systems work, people generally don’t act out. if they do then you deal with them one on one and expect them to fix their individual, personal issues. if they can’t do that then you manage them out of their position. you can’t allow toxic people to create a toxic work environment. this can be done whether your staff is union or non-union.

i hear a lot about generation x,y,z or whatever and their respective idyo’s but one thing never changes -good leaders make people feel valued and people who feel valued know that whatever their role, tech, nurse, surgeon, housekeeper and yes even anesthesiologist, their function is in the end- to heal. when leaders allow people to lose sight of that, they lose their department. hold your leader accountable and when they fix stuff, show them some love.

Specializes in Telemetry, OR, ICU.
okay, this may be a stupid question, but i have to ask. does a rnfa act in the same role as the scrub or circulating nurse? what is the difference with a rnfa? i thought, i could be way off base, that you had to go for more schooling to be a rnfa. is that not true?

role of the rnfa

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working interdependently with the operating room surgeon the registered nurse first assistant (rnfa) is a technically skilled nursing professional with advanced education that renders direct patient care as part of the perioperative nursing process. collaborating with the surgeon for an optimal surgical outcome, the rnfa assists in positioning, draping, providing exposure, handling tissue, suture and maintaining hemostatis. the scope of practice for rnfas is regulated by the individual state's nurse practice act, and rnfa's must practice within these guidelines.

reference

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