Wishes Regarding Students in Birth Plans - page 3

I've been reading a lot of birth plans on the web - the one I use with my clients has been currently hijacked by my computer. I know that I include this question on my birth plan about students... Read More

  1. by   palesarah
    Quote from BabyRN2Be
    Yes, I am in a position to say something, only IF I'm working on a private birth. Most of the time I come on, the mom has been in the hospital for a few hours already and they already have students assigned to them. I do trend a fine line in working as an advocate for the parents. We absolutely can not wear out our welcome as it affects the whole doula program. When I'm working at the hospital, I can't make waves. It's a different type of doula'ing. We are there to help pts who need extra help - those who might be taking too much of the nurse's time, etc. Since we haven't met these pts beforehand, I don't know what their wishes might be. If one has said that they don't like all the people who come into their rooms because of a history of rape or abuse, there's not much I can do about it other than tell the staff. After that, it's out of my hands.

    If it's a private doula patient, I can be more active as an advocate. When I'm working at for the hospital, I have less say.
    I hear ya... a very fine line. When I trained as a doula, that issue came up many times.

    You are doing such a wonderful thing for your patients!
  2. by   tuppence
    Quote from HazeK
    put in a foley catheter AFTER the epidural
    Gosh, when I had my son a couple of years ago, I let a student nurse insert my foley catheter BEFORE I got my spinal. It took her four tries -- ouch!

    Oh, well, I'm having another baby any day now (due today) and I'll still let students practice on me. I'll be starting my nursing classes in a year, and I'll be practicing on people too... turnabout is fair play.
  3. by   fergus51
    I would hope most nurses would allow well behaved students to participate in their care. None of us come out of the womb as RNs, so we all had to do it at some point!
  4. by   SmilingBluEyes
    Best wishes for a safe, happy delivery Tuppance. And VERY nice of you to let students learn in your case. I think that is most gracious of you. But yes, have them wait til AFTER your epidural/spinal. I would never think of placing a catheter PRIOR, unless in dire emergency. It can always wait til patient is anethesized, first, unless it's for an emergent case.
  5. by   tuppence
    Thank you.

    I had originally asked that the catheter be placed after I got the spinal, but the nurse came back later and said that the doctor wanted it done beforehand because he wanted things to go as quickly as possible once I was ready for the cesarean. I don't know how usual that is, but I agreed to it. I had severe pre-eclampsia at 32 weeks and once the perinatologist checked us out, he seemed to want to do the cesarean ASAP, though we waited a few hours because I had had some toast that morning at the hospital I was transferred from. I gather it was a fairly serious situation. I was a little confused from the mag and everything, but low fluid, the placenta not looking good, and the baby's heart rate not going up were mentioned. Anyway, the discomfort of having a student insert a foley was the least of my worries, really, though it makes for a good "war story."

    (The 32-weeker is 2 1/2 now and doing just fine.)
  6. by   mitchsmom
    I just feel that a teaching hospital is just that and the patient should recognize that it isn't fair to interfere with that process.
    I didn't want extra people interfering with my process.
    When I had my first at a very busy teaching hospital I requested no students. I had heard that lots of students came through and I was already very nervous about the birth and just the regular peolple being around seeing me in all my glory. Like someone else said, I wanted it as calm and quiet as possible, and honestly, knowing that I had experienced people working on me made me more at ease. In the end, I did end up letting a nursing student cath me after my epidural anyway. Overall I just wanted to be alone with my family as much as possible so I wouldn't be so nervous. I didn't even want to start breastfeeding in front of anyone but my husband! LOL I kept trying to wait until everyone left. (you don't even know how funny that is in retrospect)

    During births 2 and 3 I wouldn't have minded at all as long as it was one person at a time.

    I do understand that students need people to learn on, but I also think it is a person's right to refuse.
  7. by   camay1221_RN
    After reading through this thread again, I realized I didn't differentiate between Med Student and Nursing Student! I had absolutely no problem with having a nursing student in any part of my childbirth experiences. It was the medical students that were a real pain in the rump!
  8. by   BabyRN2Be
    I just wanted to emphasize that I realize that students need to learn SOMEWHERE. If I didn't have some sexual abuse issues, it wouldn't be a problem. Since I work with some clients who have these issues, I fight for them to not have their privacy disrupted at this vulnerable time. I work with them to take the fear out of childbirth, and I feel that this is a small request to make for a positive birth memory for one who has fears regarding strangers attending them when they are least ready for it.
  9. by   at your cervix
    I have been frustrated with the students that our hospital has had lately. I know that everyone needs to learn, but it seems that lately the students have no respect for the patients and only want to see a birth. I can't tell you how many times I have heard "I will be in the ER, call me when she is ready to deliver, I need to see a delivery." It is like they are bored with the labor process and only want to see the birth. I have become quite the witch about this lately because I refuse to let students come in to my patients delivery unless they hang out, meet the patient and the patient consents. I don't feel that it is right to let anyone that doesn't need to be in the room just waltz right in to stare at the patients naked crotch because they want to. OK, I'll stop now!!!!

    Oh, no I guess I won't. While we are on the subject of students, isn't it required that students have an instructor with them? We have one school that for the last several months has been sending us students and we have never seen and instructor and I don't feel that I am paid enough to be the RN and the nursing instructor, in addition, I work on a very busy unit and although I am more than willing to let students do procedures (with and instructor) quite honestly, I usually don't have time to teach the students how to do the procedures and supervise them!!!
    OK, now I will stop!!!!!!!!!
  10. by   DawnEyes
    After reading through this thread again, I realized I didn't differentiate between Med Student and Nursing Student! I had absolutely no problem with having a nursing student in any part of my childbirth experiences. It was the medical students that were a real pain in the rump!
    I didn't differentiate either. I certainly wouldn't mind having a student nurse or OB course RN in the room with my regular nurse. Me, my hubby, the cnm, and a nurse (and one student, if they are there) I could handle...I know everyone there is working in/for the best interest of me and my baby. But a lot of times where I work, the MED students come rushing in as delivery is imminent, without anyone having asked the mommy to be if it's okay. Talk about a circus!! I hate it when they do that. It's like the patient isn't even there, she's a "mechanical teaching tool" that spits a baby out for them. Like a birth/vaginal repair simulator they can work on hard, technical skills with or something.

    I would feel much better if they just took the time to ask the mom/dad ahead of time if it would be okay for a med student to observe the delivery, and I think it would leave a better impression of the place with the mom.

    I have become quite the witch about this lately because I refuse to let students come in to my patients delivery unless they hang out, meet the patient and the patient consents. I don't feel that it is right to let anyone that doesn't need to be in the room just waltz right in to stare at the patients naked crotch because they want to.
    Amen to that!
  11. by   ayndim
    Quote from DawnEyes
    I didn't differentiate either. I certainly wouldn't mind having a student nurse or OB course RN in the room with my regular nurse. Me, my hubby, the cnm, and a nurse (and one student, if they are there) I could handle...I know everyone there is working in/for the best interest of me and my baby. But a lot of times where I work, the MED students come rushing in as delivery is imminent, without anyone having asked the mommy to be if it's okay. Talk about a circus!! I hate it when they do that. It's like the patient isn't even there, she's a "mechanical teaching tool" that spits a baby out for them. Like a birth/vaginal repair simulator they can work on hard, technical skills with or something.

    I would feel much better if they just took the time to ask the mom/dad ahead of time if it would be okay for a med student to observe the delivery, and I think it would leave a better impression of the place with the mom.


    Amen to that!
    I would have hit the roof if anyone came rushing in at the last minute to see the birth. And I would have sent them packing. When I am a CNM I won't allow anyone to do that to a mom. That is completely unacceptable. I think when I am an RN I am going to tell them the mom said she doesn't want anyone at the birth other than necessary medical personnel, such as her dr/cnm, the nurse and peds, if necessary. GRRR!! :angryfire
  12. by   mother/babyRN
    In some teaching hospitals, when you sign the admission sheet, you are signing your consent to have students although we did attempt to honor wishes as much as possible since the med students would often be allowed but not the nursing students..Finally we convinced the people at the doc offices to let the patients know that at a teaching hospital, there may be cause for some students to be there..Mostly we worked it out well...As for not seeing anyone all night, I couldn't go along with that because they need to be seen at least once to determine that they are ok, even with vs on mom or baby, or weight of the baby. Just because a patient refuses that doesn't mean they shouldn't be peeked in on, or, if it is busy, they might not be able to be accomodated to that degree, although, as above, we do attempt to honor pt wishes to the best we can....
  13. by   SmilingBluEyes
    I guess that's why I like a community hospital versus a teaching one. No one need interfere w/the "process" of our patients and their birth experiences. They have the absolute right to control who is in the room at all times. This is how it should be. It is THEIR birth experience, not the resident's or the nursing students'. It should be reserved as a priveledge for them to be there, if the patient allows it.

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