2 Wks Postpartum Bleed in ERRegister Today!
- by flyingchange Jul 5, '11Hi everyone,
Just hoping I can pick your knowledgeable brains because we had a situation last night that I hadn't seen before, but we learned about it in L&D clinical, and all of the things I'd learned about were not done. So I am looking to understand the "real world" a little bit better
We had a G1P1, 2-weeks-postpartum, breastfeeding mom present to triage passing fist-sized clots. Soaked 4 pads within the hour. HR ~170, BP 130/90. Got her back to a trauma room and in bed between all the clots. She denied any pain or cramping. Fundus was midline, 1" below umbilicus and boggy. Pt states she wasn't doing anything unusual when the bleeding started.
So what I'd *expected* to see in her management was something to promote uterine contractions (oxytocin or massages or something), but really what it looked like to my inexperienced eyes was symptom management until we could get her transferred out to the ob/gyn unit at another hospital.
We had some new residents in last night so I wondered if that was the reason, but they relied very heavily on RN advice (wrt stuff like inserting 18ga AC IVs, running NS at a bolus instead of at the ordered 100cc, and at one point she crashed to 70/50 and the RN went to put her on an NRB and the resident asked her why because she was satting 100%). Anyway the orders were very symptom focused (8 mg Zofran was the only drug we gave), blood type and screen, NS "at 100cc" which turned into 2L bolus. Then she was transferred.
So that's what happened last night in our small ER and I was wondering what this situation would have looked like if it was managed by L&D nurses and OB/gyn docs?
- Jul 5, '11 by ElvishIt sounds like she may have had some retained placenta or membrane fragments keeping her uterus from contracting all the way. It's unusual for it to manifest that far out, but not unheard of. At that point, what she needs is either a manual extraction or a D&C. Even when we have a hemorrhage from retained frags in the hospital immediately postpartum, we don't like to do pit until all the offending clots/frags are removed. Otherwise you're just spitting into the wind - a uterus contracting but it can't contract all the way because the clots etc. are impeding it. For two weeks postpartum, a uterus should be way lower than u - 1.
I'm surprised she wasn't febrile at that point as well, but I guess it's not a given. Does this help any?
- Jul 5, '11 by JenTheRNThe important thing is to get her bleeding under control. 1st thing to do is massage the heck out of her uterus. By two weeks pp the uterus should be quite far under the umbilicus. Yes, she will need some pitocin, methergine, or another drug to make her uterus contract, but if she has bleeding that far after delivery I would think she would need a D&C as the most likely culprit would be retained placenta.
I don't see that many cases of this, so maybe someone else could share some thoughts, but I think they were trying to stablize her so that she could go into surgery.
- Jul 5, '11 by JeneraterRNI agree with the first two respondents, though I am surprised by the length out from delivery, as well. It would be useful to know her WC, med and surgical history, and medications in case there is something in there to potentiate or worsen bleeding. I had a retained placenta myself, but bleeding was not the problem so much as infection. Was she septic from retained placenta? DIC comes to mind. I hope those thoughts help!
- Jul 5, '11 by Esme12About one percent of postpartum women have what's called a late postpartum hemorrhage (also known as a delayed or secondary postpartum hemorrhage). This term is used to describe severe bleeding that occurs between 24 hours and 12 weeks after childbirth, though late postpartum hemorrhages typically occur one to two weeks postpartum.
Late postpartum hemorrhage may be caused by a uterus that doesn't contract normally, possibly as a result of fragments of the placenta or the amniotic sac that remain in the uterus after birth, an infection, or both. A late postpartum hemorrhage may also be caused by an inherited disorder that alters your blood's ability to clot, such as von Willebrand's disease. Sometimes, though, the cause is unknown.
The Emergency care of the patient is suppportive, IV, O2, labs, until a D/C is peformed as retained products are the usual cause of late PPH. It is optimal to have the patient transfered to a facility that has OB/GYN services as this is optimal care ans well within EMTALA to a higher level of care.
I hope this helps....
- Jul 5, '11 by LilyRoseCNMI'm also wondering like the PP if it was a rare clotting disorder, because if she's able to breastfeed, it's probably not retained placenta. The removal of the placenta is what signals the brain's hormones to tell the breasts to make milk, right?
- Jul 5, '11 by ElvishQuote from LilyRoseRNYou're right but if it's a smallish piece, or if it's not attached to the uterine wall anymore, it might not impede BFing. Also, the body starts making colostrum as early as the second trimester, so it's not necessarily an all-or-nothing proposition.I'm also wondering like the PP if it was a rare clotting disorder, because if she's able to breastfeed, it's probably not retained placenta. The removal of the placenta is what signals the brain's hormones to tell the breasts to make milk, right?Last edit by Elvish on Jul 5, '11
- Jul 5, '11 by AltraI've seen Methergine given in the ER in a similar situation, but that was with OB present. I can totally picture your ER MDs consulting with OB at the other hospital, and being given instructions to just get the patient to them as quickly as possible. You might also have considered starting 1-2 units of uncrossmatched blood prior to the transfer, if there was time.
- Jul 5, '11 by LilyRoseCNMQuote from ElvishGotcha, thanks for the info!You're right but if it's a smallish piece, or if it's not attached to the uterine wall anymore, it might not impede BFing. Also, the body starts making colostrum as early as the second trimester, so it's not necessarily an all-or-nothing proposition.
- Jul 5, '11 by kloneQuote from LilyRoseRNYes, but it's not uncommon for women with retained placenta to still undergo lactogenesis II. Supply is usually not where it should be, though.I'm also wondering like the PP if it was a rare clotting disorder, because if she's able to breastfeed, it's probably not retained placenta. The removal of the placenta is what signals the brain's hormones to tell the breasts to make milk, right?