Statistics Curriculum Concern

  1. My potential BSN program requires "nursing statistics" or students can take a statistics course offered by the sociology department.

    Is/was statistics a part of your curriculum? If so, is/was the statistics instructor from a department other than mathematics?

    Any opinions/observations about statistics in general?
    Last edit by abooker on Nov 26, '07
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  2. 16 Comments

  3. by   Spidey's mom
    Yes, statistics is a pre-req for the RN-BSN program I will be starting in January.

    I am in stats now. My instructor's background is in psychology. He is great - available on his cell phone from 8 a.m. to 10 p.m. Gives us all the help we could possibly need and is a funny and very good teacher.

    Stats is hard for me - even so. It seems like "math" would be black and white but this is not.

    I will NEVER look at a statistic in the newspaper again the same. Stats can be skewed in so many different directions - the direction the researcher wants.

    steph
  4. by   luvschoolnursing
    I had to take statistics for my BSN. Took it from a math instructor at the local community college. (my BSN program was great about accepting as many credits as it was able from the CC) Nearly killed me. Only class that brought me to tears. Come to think of it nearly killed my family, too. Never use it. Not sure why it was required.
  5. by   llg
    Statistics is required in almost all BSN programs. Understanding basic stats allows the professional nurse to understand the nursing literature -- particularly the research reports. Without an understanding of statistics and the priniciples of research, nurses are not able to correctly interpret and evaluate the quality what they read or hear.
  6. by   Spidey's mom
    Quote from llg
    Statistics is required in almost all BSN programs. Understanding basic stats allows the professional nurse to understand the nursing literature -- particularly the research reports. Without an understanding of statistics and the priniciples of research, nurses are not able to correctly interpret and evaluate the quality what they read or hear.
    I agree with that.

    I just wouldn't want to be a researcher and use statistics.

    steph
  7. by   abooker
    I'm an "independent scholar" according to the NAS. Researchers are supposed to get in touch with their ontological and epistemological realities. Blargh. I hope stats hasn't turned into one of those touchy-feely classes. Math. Give me math.

    The things I studied back in the 1980's, scientific method, analysis, applications - I'm not observing much of that in the literature now that we're approaching 2008. I'm seeing this: "Data do not provide a window on reality. Rather the 'discovered' reality arises from the interactive process and its temporal, cultural, and structural contexts"

    Quote from stevielynn
    I will NEVER look at a statistic in the newspaper again the same. Stats can be skewed in so many different directions - the direction the researcher wants. steph
    :yeahthat:

    I'm just a little concerned about what I'll be encountering if I persue the BSN, and take "nursing statistics". I can't yell "skewed data" if data is merely someone's opinion. I think constructed reality = opinion?

    Reference: Mills, J., Bonner, A., & Francis, K. (2006). The development of constructivist grounded theory. International Journal of Qualitative Methods, 5(1), Article 3. Retrieved 11/27/07 from http://www.ualberta.ca/~iiqm/backiss.../pdf/mills.pdf
    Last edit by abooker on Nov 26, '07 : Reason: tone
  8. by   llg
    Quote from abooker
    :yeahthat:

    I'm just a little concerned about what I'll be encountering if I persue the BSN, and take "nursing statistics". I can't yell "skewed data" if data is merely someone's opinion. I think constructed reality = opinion?
    [/url]
    Most stats classes focus on the stats themselves ... what they mean ... how they are used in research ... etc. The people who teach stats are rarely, if ever, the philosophical or "touch-feely" types.
  9. by   Spidey's mom
    Quote from llg
    Most stats classes focus on the stats themselves ... what they mean ... how they are used in research ... etc. The people who teach stats are rarely, if ever, the philosophical or "touch-feely" types.
    My teacher is very warm and compassionate . . however, "touchy-feely" in the way you mean it . . no.

    And this is just a generic statistics class . . not specifically for nurses.

    There are 5 of us in this class, all nurses. His other class, that just finished had 28 (I think), not all nurses.

    It isn't concrete however . . . sometimes I'll read a paragraph that sounds a lot like your quote (a booker): "Data do not provide a window on reality. Rather the 'discovered' reality arises from the interactive process and its temporal, cultural, and structural contexts"

    I'm left shaking my head . . . . Where's the math?

    steph
    Last edit by Spidey's mom on Nov 28, '07
  10. by   vickynurse
    Mark Twain said "There are lies, there are d**n lies, and there are statistics." It is important for nurses to know how stats can be massaged. It is also important to be able to evaluate the statistical methods when reading the professional literature.
  11. by   HeartsOpenWide
    Quote from abooker
    My potential BSN program requires "nursing statistics" or students can take a statistics course offered by the sociology department.

    Is/was statistics a part of your curriculum? If so, is/was the statistics instructor from a department other than mathematics?

    Any opinions/observations about statistics in general?
    Stats was required for my BSN program too. I took it with anatomy and an GE art class. I SUCK at math but found it to be interesting. I worked my tail off for the B I got in the class. Most practical math you will ever use in my opinion (others on here seem to disagree). I took a basic Stats class so my teacher was a math teacher and really smart too. I would go to class early so I could as questions to understand stuff better. I hear that people that are good at math hate stats and people that are good at English (me) enjoy it compared to algebra and other math. It was the first math class that I did not need a tutor.
    Last edit by HeartsOpenWide on Nov 26, '07
  12. by   abooker
    Quote from llg
    Most stats classes focus on the stats themselves ... what they mean ... how they are used in research ... etc. The people who teach stats are rarely, if ever, the philosophical or "touch-feely" types.
    I’m confused.

    If there is a significant difference between how stats is taught to nursing students and how stats is used by nursing researchers, then … isn’t that a problem?

    Maybe I’m reading the wrong publications (I’m finding stuff on the Web – maybe worth what I’m paying for it)

    My opinion is that philosophical types write the most useful qualitative research, and “touchy-feely” types write the least useful. I’m biased, because I know which majors score highest on the GRE. I regret using “touchy-feely” to mean education, sociology, psych types. Like HeartsOpenWide I’m good at English, and I turned out good at statistics, but that was 20 years ago. Thank you all for your reassurance.

    Is there a “Nursing as a second language” course out there somewhere?

    Reference: http://ace.acadiau.ca/arts/phil/why_phil/scores.htm
    Last edit by abooker on Nov 27, '07
  13. by   vashtee
    My ADN program did not require statistics, but it is required if you want to transfer to a BSN program.

    Honestly, I thought it was a relatively easy math class... much easier than college algebra.
  14. by   Spidey's mom
    Quote from HeartsOpenWide
    Stats was required for my BSN program too. I took it with anatomy and an GE art class. I SUCK at math but found it to be interesting. I worked my tail off for the B I got in the class. Most practical math you will ever use in my opinion (others on here seem to disagree). I took a basic Stats class so my teacher was a math teacher and really smart too. I would go to class early so I could as questions to understand stuff better. I hear that people that are good at math hate stats and people that are good at English (me) enjoy it compared to algebra and other math. It was the first math class that I did not need a tutor.
    I am good at English . . . hated math. Not crazy about stats either.

    The thing I don't like about stats is that it isn't black and white, concrete. You CAN massage it . . .make it turn out how you want. And the latitude of percentage for error . . .

    My stats teacher says stats is used mostly by the "touchy-feely" types . .although he didn't use that phrase.

    It isn't science so much as psychology . . .

    steph

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