How far to push a high profile reference.

elkpark · Dec 28, 2017

Yikes. You already pulled strings to get the interview, which, IMO, was bad enough. The CNO did what she was basically obligated to do by the board member requesting special consideration for you. You didn't get the job. Don't make the situation worse by attempting to pull strings further. I would hope that an ethical board member would politely decline to push any further on your behalf if you asked for further assistance. At best, if your board member is willing to lean on people to make them give you a job, you'll start that job with a resentful boss and a target on your back. I've worked in situations where employees had special connections and "protection" from a relationship with someone high up in the organization, being someone's "pet" (which is the language that gets used), and I'm here to tell you that everyone resented the heck out of those people, all day, every day, because of the special favors and treatment they got. That kind of situation is not pretty. Is that what you want? Don't you want to get a job on your own merits?

**NICU Guy, BSN, RN** · Dec 28, 2017

I think you need to focus on why a nurse with 10 yrs experience can't get past HR stage. There has to be a reason why HR doesn't automatically put you in the interview pile.

guest940422 · Dec 28, 2017

That never occured to me, I've seen a lot of good qualified nurses never get their apps seen by managers because of HR. I also figured there was some algorithm in play since I got the "no thank you" email hours after I applied. That was why I asked for help getting the interview.

I've had managers at other hospitals tell me the best thing to do is to email the manager directly because they don't get to see everyone who applies and often who HR pushes through looks better on paper rather than meets what the manager is looking for.

I don't want special treatment and I sure as hell don't want the staff to know I know any executives, I just want an opportunity to find another place in the hospital I might fit in. I'm just scared to start applying to other units on my own if that would be considered rude to those who put their name out for me.

guest940422 · Dec 28, 2017

At best, if your board member is willing to lean on people to make them give you a job, you'll start that job with a resentful boss and a target on your back.

I don't want to work on a unit for a manager who doesn't want me... that would be hell. I just want the opportunity to meet with other managers who are hiring. It is entirely possible I didn't get the job because the manager resented being told to interview me, or had already chosen her hires.

llg, PhD, RN · Dec 28, 2017

I think it would be fine to apply for other positions in that hospital -- but don't ask for special favors. You've already played that card -- and it didn't work. Perhaps you tried for the wrong unit. You said you "never imagined that you would get it." Why not? If it was a bad fit for your experience, then it was probably a bad move to choose that position to interview for. Apply for positions that are a good fit for you and that relate to your experience and you might get better results.

guest940422 · Dec 28, 2017

No I meant I never imagined I would not get the job. It was a PICU job. Nearly all my experience is in PICU, I was trying really hard not to act entitled or too confident. I came to the interview with examples of projects I had done on committees at previous hospitals and wanted to be humble and show I was qualified, not just connected. I think I may have just interviewed bad and overcompensated coming off scared and unsure of myself. IDK. I think I'll just keep applying and see how I do on my own.

What is your thought on contacting unit managers directly? I've always done it and always been told it's what got me noticed. But now I'm second guessing everything. Is it being assertive and taking the initiative, or pushy and annoying?

jodispamodi · Dec 29, 2017

just a suggestion but I wouldn't go to an interview with "examples of projects" that just says to the interviewer that you don't want to be a staff nurse but a manager or administrator, the cno dropping by probably emphasized that point. Good luck in your Job Search.

elkpark · Dec 29, 2017

That never occured to me, I've seen a lot of good qualified nurses never get their apps seen by managers because of HR. I also figured there was some algorithm in play since I got the "no thank you" email hours after I applied. That was why I asked for help getting the interview.
I've had managers at other hospitals tell me the best thing to do is to email the manager directly because they don't get to see everyone who applies and often who HR pushes through looks better on paper rather than meets what the manager is looking for.
I don't want special treatment and I sure as hell don't want the staff to know I know any executives, I just want an opportunity to find another place in the hospital I might fit in. I'm just scared to start applying to other units on my own if that would be considered rude to those who put their name out for me.

In my experience in a few different organizations, HR doesn't "push through" anyone in particular. The unit manager, service director, whomever, communicates to HR what s/he is generally looking for, and the organization has a job description that identifies key qualifications, and HR passes on everyone who meets the basic identified qualifications to the clinical person. HR's role is primarily to screen out people who obviously don't meet the established qualifications, not to make any nuanced decisions about who might or might not be good for a particular position. Most organizations nowadays also have a computer algorithm built into their online application system that screens applications for specific key words (qualifications) for specific positions.

I agree with Guy -- if you have great qualifications and experience, and you're not getting interviews for open positions for which you appear qualified, maybe you need to look at what might be getting in your way. Is there any chance some previous employer is giving you a bad reference? Anything in your past that is problematic?

Best wishes --

FullGlass, BSN, MSN, NP · Dec 29, 2017

Can you work locum tenens for awhile? That might be a way to get your foot in the door.

guest940422 · Dec 30, 2017

just a suggestion but I wouldn't go to an interview with "examples of projects" that just says to the interviewer that you don't want to be a staff nurse but a manager

You're right, I was trying to show how involved in committee work I like to be and how I don't turn down opportunities to be a super user or help with education fairs. But I do that stuff because I enjoy it and it makes me feel more like i'm a member of the unit community. I'm not ambitious at all. I was thinking it would show them I'm more than just a warm body, but I probably just came off as a know it all.

Anyone interested in doing a mock interview with me? Clearly I need to work on my strategy.

jodispamodi · Dec 30, 2017

You're right, I was trying to show how involved in committee work I like to be and how I don't turn down opportunities to be a super user or help with education fairs. But I do that stuff because I enjoy it and it makes me feel more like i'm a member of the unit community. I'm not ambitious at all. I was thinking it would show them I'm more than just a warm body, but I probably just came off as a know it all.
Anyone interested in doing a mock interview with me? Clearly I need to work on my strategy.

Here are some suggestions for the next interview:

Be genuine, be sincere, be humble, and be yourself

If you are asked about accomplishments, in one sentence say I was on x committee and through our work a decrease in y resulted. Leave it at that! Leave the examples at home, they are not interested and frankly its overkill to the nth degree. Or better answer, I always wanted to be ACLS certified and I got certified or something r/t patient care. If they want you on committees they will ask after the interview.

If they ask you a question about what makes you happy as a nurse, mention something about taking care of patients.

If they ask you about something that makes you unhappy about healthcare mention something that negatively impacts patient care (I always respond to this question on the national level)

If they ask you about where you see yourself in 5 years then you can say something along the lines of I'd like to be on a committee, and I'd like xyz...

Don't give long over elaborate answers to questions.

If you're applying to patient care positions keep your answers patient centered.