Importing Foreign-trained nurses - page 4

Importing Foreign-trained Nurses Comparison of Pending Legislation on Nursing Immigration Issues 11/05/01 "The American Nurses Association (ANA) has posted a chart which compares two bills... Read More

  1. by   Larry
    I find nurses from the Philippines to be hardworking. I agree that they are not assertive enough - indeed their culture is different. Certainly I heard that some theatre nurses (OR) were not keen on hiring them because they were encouraging the doctors to lord themselves.

    I used to run nursing homes and I would certainly have preferred to hire filipinas because of their work.

    The US is big country and should absorb more immigrants. Many Americans that I've met are cosmopolitan and are not as reserved as some British are.
    You shouldn't just talk about wages but be open to encouraging as we do internationalism. Foreigners can be integrated and I believe nursing is a good medium for education and goodwill.

    However if you feel that you cannot breathe in US - then come to Britain (51st State) with General Blair and Barbara Malone !



    Nurses coming to the UK generally have to start at the bottom of the ladder and have to pass an adaptation training course regulated by the UKCC http://www.ukcc.org.uk/index.html Generally after the adaptation training of three to six months nurses are paid the same as UK nurse starters.

    I really think that the UK should be more attractive to foreign nurses because we are a multi-ethnic society and there is not such a difference between rich and poor as in US.

    To read about nursing opportunities in UK visit
    http://www.doh.gov.uk/international-nurse/
    http://www.nursingtimes.net/
  2. by   Peeps Mcarthur
    Larry,
    I didn't see the information I need. Maybe you can give me a bit of information about scholarships, grants, and other financial considerations for international students.
    Regards,
    Brad
    Columbia, MD
  3. by   Larry
    There is a website detailing more advice and how to apply direct to hospitals - but for anyone contemplating coming to UK they must first register their qualifications with UKCC.

    I am not in recruitment and I don't have time to deal further with this.

    I suggest that iinterested parties can also look in http://www.rcn.org.uk/home/home.html and
    http://www.healthprofessionals.com/



    http://www.philemb.demon.co.uk/July2001/BAHAYKUBO.htm
  4. by   Peeps Mcarthur
    Larry,
    Thank you. I appreciate your post.
  5. by   reggiedoc
    Hello everyone,

    My name is Reggie. I find the topics here very interesting and informative as well. I appreciate each and everyone's input regarding the importation of foreign nurses. Being a nurse from the Philippines, this topic is of great interest to me. Before I delve into that complex phenomenon, I would like to share with you a historical perspective regarding America's role in the perpetuation of Americanized nursing in the Philippines and how these dynamics continue to affect the cyclical nursing shortages the U.S. has seen since the post-World War 2 era. Please click on this link below to find out more:

    Hitting Critical Mass

    Very sincerely,
    Reggie
  6. by   reggiedoc
    As a Filipino nurse recruited at the tailend of the last US nursing shortage of the 20th century, I believe foreign nursing recruitment is an alternative but should not be relied upon as the ultimate fix. US nursing has always been driven by multifarious forces and therefore no single solution appears to suffice. I agree with the posts here about looking at the root causes of these shortages and making concerted efforts as nurse professionals regardless of race or background. I echo the convictions of the leadership of PNA-America (Philippine Nurses Association of America) through its Executive Director, Ampy de la Paz as it appeared in the Nursing Spectrum, May 4, 2001 edition. Excerpt as follows:

    "While foreign nurse recruitment is an immediate fix," de la Paz says, "we need to focus on long-term solutions to the nursing shortage: appropriating funds for nursing education, offering competitive compensation for nursing faculty members, eliminating salary compression of nurses so that their earning capacity is competitive with the salaries that other professions offer, and enhancing the image of the nursing profession in order to attract the younger generation to pursue nursing as a career."

    Very sincerely,
    Reggie
  7. by   NRSKarenRN
    Reggie:
    Welcome aboard. Your link most informative. Hope to hear from you again....it can be addictive here. Debate is always good especially when first hand info shared.
  8. by   -jt
    Thanks Reggie. PNA echos the message being sent by ANA and others.

    Btw, did you know that Lolitas Compas, past president of the PNA, has just been elected president of the NY State Nurses Assoc?
  9. by   Larry
    A very long document Reggie that I skimmed. An interested history of the rise of nursing in the Philippines and its exportation to USA. Not so much though on 1965-present, but probably more of same. What was this thesis part of a post-doctoral submission ?

    From a purely recruitment paradigm I found filipino/as more hardworking than other foreigners and thus a wished for agenda when dealing with nurse shortages.

    In the UK we have a recurring 20-30% shortage of nurses. Through recent drives in recruiting foreign nurses from Spain, South Africa and other countries the NHS National Health Service is claiming a 17.5% shortage but that is debatable.

    Certainly the recruitment of foreign nurses is an ethical issue and is now considered unethical in recruiting nurses from countries in Africa, where their own nursing workforce is depleted.

    In the short-term the recruitment of foreign-trained nurses fills the gap, but in the long-term higher pay and better working conditions can improve the workforce by liking it to a worthwhile job that would encourage home-born graduates to seek as a career.

    The importation of foreigners to the UK - whilst increasing the retention of nurses, can work counter-productive by increasing social spending on the burden to the state of their spouses and dependants.

    The UK is becoming a multi-ethnic society, which is in part good sharing our cultural heritage and in part bad. Certain immigrants/asylum seekers are not integrating within the society and preferring to stay in their paradigm. As such we have some people preferring their own language than the English language, and not learning English. We have some groups of people wishing to turn our country into their own paradigm.

    However this has very little to do with the rise of filipina nurses into the UK.
  10. by   Peeps Mcarthur
    "However, while this minority of Filipinos studied at prestigious universities and colleges across the United States in preparation for assuming positions in the Philippines once held by Americans, the overwhelming majority of Filipinos in the United States in the 1920s and 1930s were male migrant workers who labored in the sugar plantations of Hawaii, the agricultural fields of California, and the canneries of Washington and Alaska.23 These Filipino men supplied an integral source of labor to American industries, yet faced considerable racism and prejudice in the form of segregation, poor working and living conditions, anti-miscegenation laws, and racial violence"



    ." In the end, these "opportunities" abroad ultimately served the interests of the expanding U.S. hospital system, which benefited from a less costly, skilled new immigrant workforce. "


    The author speaks of "racism" and "prejudice"as being the reason for poor working and living conditions of migrant farm workers in sec 22-23, at the same time filipinos were training to fill positions once held by americans. They were supposed to be training them to support the philipine health system in the wake of decolonization.
    Filipinos were being trained and funded by federal and private money, while taking jobs away from U.S. citizens on both continents. The Great Deppression was starting and former stock brokers were fighting for scraps of bread with thier bare hands.

    The author choses to call Americans being pissed off about it "racism and predjudice"


    Some things never change
    Are we going to let this happen again.

    Brad
    Columbia, MD
  11. by   NurseTami
    Just a humble opinion......
    I have worked with two different groups of immigrants- brought here soley for the purpose of relieving a currrent shortage. The older group is Indian, the younger Filipino.

    Now, the group I worked with in the Nursing Home setting were very unimpressive and lacked basic knowledge, but they were brought here to be put on a pedestal as a trophy sort of thing- you know," Our Nursing home has round the clock BSNs". They were not expected to work the same as everyone else, and lived up to the expectations set before them.

    The two above named groups in the hospital setting are impressive, I have learned a lot from them and they do not talk only to each other, or just in their own language. They are always willing to help, AND, they expect the same conditions as the rest of us American nurses. They have assimilated well.
  12. by   Mijourney
    Hi. Debate and discussion is what makes this bb go around. As far as discrimination and reversing it goes, I do know that a growing number of us that are white get scholarships to the so-called minority colleges.

    Back to the topic. NurseTami, I like your scenarios about two different type of nurses recruited from other countries. It's the quality of their practice and not necessarily where they're from. I don't have a problem with any nurse that respects his/her profession and is good at working in it. I think the problem is that the employers are just focusing on mere numbers and not thinking about the long term consequences of their actions. It's true that a respectable, caring, foreign-born nurse is a plus particularly when there are diverse populations to be cared for. I'm not overly paranoid about working with these individuals. I do have a problem with bringing in large numbers of nurses at one time when there are large numbers of nurses already in the states that could be lured back into practice.
  13. by   Peeps Mcarthur
    Assumption of lack of skills of forieng trained nurses IS NOT THE ISSUE.
    Assumption of thier willingness to accept current conditions as being the motivation for health organizations recruitment of them IS!
    It's not a "stopgap measure" or a "bandaid".............IT IS AN END-GAME STRATEGY.
    As we all know there is no true "shortage". There are, in fact, more nurses than anyone outside of this story will ever know about.
    What other motivation could administrators, politicians, corporations, possibly have?



    Quoted from above post of Mjourney.
    "Hi. Debate and discussion is what makes this bb go around. As far as discrimination and reversing it goes, I do know that a growing number of us that are white get scholarships to the so-called minority colleges. "

    White and middle class?
    Discrimination is an inequality, not a skin color. If you get into the "minority" college or any other one on a scholarship, it has to do with your income first, then your choices are further limited by your skin color.
    That being true, that is the focus and extent of your interest in developement funds. If you only fund the poor, then the ethnicities in order with disregard to GPA, then that is what you'll get.
    ATTENTION: To Racecard players and the substantialy ignorant........I am not inferring(sorry) trying to make the generalization that poor people and/or ethnicities have low GPA's.


    Do you suppose that is a strategy that could be compared to that above?
    I think so.

    It's good to see you around Mjourney. What do you think?

    Brad
    Columbia, MD
    Last edit by Peeps Mcarthur on Nov 18, '01

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