Healthcare is NOT a basic human right.

Nurses Activism

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If one were to read the Constitution one would realize that the Constitution does not grant anyone freedoms, liberties, or rights. The Constitution only protects freedoms, liberties, and rights from transgressions on part of the government. A right is something that is inherent to the individual, comes from that individual, and is maintained by the individual. You are born with such rights like the right to speak freely, the only thing that can be done to that right is to have it infringed. No one can grant a right to another, only limit or impede the exercise of that right.

Healthcare is a human invention that does not exist in the natural environment. Only through the work of others and through the taking of resources from one party and giving to another does healthcare exist. You cannot force someone to give effort and resources to another and call that a right. In the absence of human intervention the individual would live their lives and succumb to the natural forces which would act upon their bodies.

Do I think we should provide preventative care and basic primary care? Sure. Do I think that we can? Maybe. Do I think that healthcare is a basic human right? Absolutely not.

Specializes in Emergency.
Excellent point!

I believe that things that originate from the individual can be considered a basic human right but not when it takes the external intervention and allocation of resources.

You have the right to pursue health, you do not have the right to take it at the expense of others.

After reading these posts for the past couple of days, it seems "clear" (as it can be) that there is no one "correct" answer...were we "draw the line" as a society(of course for some to agree on a definitive explanation of society is still such a struggle) is yet to be determined...

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After reading these posts for the past couple of days, it seems "clear" (as it can be) that there is no one "correct" answer...were we "draw the line" as a society(of course for some to agree on a definitive explanation of society is still such a struggle) is yet to be determined...

Thats why it is so much fun to debate it here.

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If healthcare is NOT a basic human right, why is this country providing millions in free health care to illegal aliens?

Spare me the above rebuttal about how much illegal aliens pay in taxes, rent, that their landlord pays in taxes, blah blah blah. They steal far more in social benifits meant for native born citizens, than they contribute.

Illegal aliens are costing the State of California, something to the tune of 100 billion dollars: released by the Federation for American Immigration Reform (FAIR) estimates that illegal immigration now costs federal and local taxpayers $113 billion a year. The report, [COLOR=#0000ee]The Fiscal Burden of Illegal Immigration on U.S. Taxpayers, is the most comprehensive analysis of how much the estimated 13 million illegal aliens and their U.S.-born children cost the federal, state and local governments.

The cost estimates are based on an extensive analysis of federal, state and local spending data. The Fiscal Burden of Illegal Immigration on U.S. Taxpayers examines dozens of government programs that are available to illegal aliens and their U.S.-born children, both legally and fraudulently. The report provides detailed analysis of the impact of illegal immigration on education, health care, law enforcement and justice, public assistance, and other government programs.

The report also accounts for taxes paid by illegal aliens about $13 billion a year, resulting in a net cost to taxpayers of about $100 billion. However, the study notes that government at all levels would likely have realized significantly greater revenues if jobs held by illegal aliens had been filled by legal U.S. residents instead.Federal spending on illegal aliens amounts to $29 billion, finds Fiscal Burden of Illegal Immigration on U.S. Taxpayers. The lion’s share of the costs of illegal immigration is borne by state and local taxpayers an estimated $84.2 billion. In 18 states, expenditures on illegal aliens exceeded the size of those states’ budget deficits in FY 2009.

Among the key findings of The Fiscal Burden of Illegal Immigration on U.S. Taxpayers:

  • The $113 billion in outlays for services and benefits to illegal aliens and their families represents an average cost to native-headed households of $1,117 a year. Because the burdens of illegal immigration are not evenly distributed, the costs are much higher in states with large illegal alien populations.
  • Education for the children of illegal aliens represents the single largest public expenditure at an annual cost of $52 billion. Nearly all of that cost is absorbed by state and local governments.
  • The federal government recoups about one-third of its share of the costs of illegal immigration in the form of taxes collected. States, which bear a much greater share of the costs, recoup a mere 5 percent of their expenditures from taxes paid by illegal aliens.
  • Granting amnesty to illegal aliens, as President Obama and others propose, would not significantly increase tax revenues generated by current illegal aliens. However, over time, amnesty would dramatically increase public costs as newly-legalized aliens become eligible for all means-tested government programs.
  • Arizona’s annual cost of illegal immigration is $2.5 billion.

“The Fiscal Burden of Illegal Immigration on U.S. Taxpayers provides a definitive response to the question of whether illegal aliens are a net benefit or a net drain on government coffers,” stated Dan Stein president of FAIR. “The report examines virtually every federal, state and local government program to determine the impact of illegal immigration on the bottom line. That bottom line $113 billion a year, and growing makes our nation’s failure to control illegal immigration one of the largest preventable burdens borne by American taxpayers.”

“If political leaders in Washington and state capitals want to understand why the American public is demanding enforcement of our immigration laws, The Fiscal Burden of Illegal Immigration on U.S. Taxpayers, provides 113 billion good reasons,” Stein concluded

If Healthcare is not a basic human right, then why is it given, no questions asked, to illegal immigrants, who have never paid into the system.

The cost estimates are based on an extensive analysis of federal, state and local spending data. The Fiscal Burden of Illegal Immigration on U.S. Taxpayers examines dozens of government programs that are available to illegal aliens and their U.S.-born children, both legally and fraudulently. The report provides detailed analysis of the impact of illegal immigration on education, health care, law enforcement and justice, public assistance, and other government programs.

The report also accounts for taxes paid by illegal aliens about $13 billion a year, resulting in a net cost to taxpayers of about $100 billion. However, the study notes that government at all levels would likely have realized significantly greater revenues if jobs held by illegal aliens had been filled by legal U.S. residents instead.Federal spending on illegal aliens amounts to $29 billion, finds Fiscal Burden of Illegal Immigration on U.S. Taxpayers. The lion’s share of the costs of illegal immigration is borne by state and local taxpayers an estimated $84.2 billion. In 18 states, expenditures on illegal aliens exceeded the size of those states’ budget deficits in FY 2009.

Among the key findings of The Fiscal Burden of Illegal Immigration on U.S. Taxpayers:

  • The $113 billion in outlays for services and benefits to illegal aliens and their families represents an average cost to native-headed households of $1,117 a year. Because the burdens of illegal immigration are not evenly distributed, the costs are much higher in states with large illegal alien populations.
  • Education for the children of illegal aliens represents the single largest public expenditure at an annual cost of $52 billion. Nearly all of that cost is absorbed by state and local governments.
  • The federal government recoups about one-third of its share of the costs of illegal immigration in the form of taxes collected. States, which bear a much greater share of the costs, recoup a mere 5 percent of their expenditures from taxes paid by illegal aliens.
  • Granting amnesty to illegal aliens, as President Obama and others propose, would not significantly increase tax revenues generated by current illegal aliens. However, over time, amnesty would dramatically increase public costs as newly-legalized aliens become eligible for all means-tested government programs.
  • Arizona’s annual cost of illegal immigration is $2.5 billion.

“The Fiscal Burden of Illegal Immigration on U.S. Taxpayers provides a definitive response to the question of whether illegal aliens are a net benefit or a net drain on government coffers,” stated Dan Stein president of FAIR. “The report examines virtually every federal, state and local government program to determine the impact of illegal immigration on the bottom line. That bottom line $113 billion a year, and growing makes our nation’s failure to control illegal immigration one of the largest preventable burdens borne by American taxpayers.”

“If political leaders in Washington and state capitals want to understand why the American public is demanding enforcement of our immigration laws, The Fiscal Burden of Illegal Immigration on U.S. Taxpayers, provides 113 billion good reasons,” Stein concluded.

Now, someone explain to me, why this country is providing free health care to illegal immigrants, who take in BILLIONS more than they contribute, but this country cannot and willnot provide health care for its native born citizens and legal residents. I rest my case!

JMHO and my NY $0.02.

Lindarn, RN, BSN, CCRN

Somewhere in the PACNW

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Specializes in Emergency.
If healthcare is NOT a basic human right, why is this country providing millions in free health care to illegal aliens?

Spare me the above rebuttal about how much illegal aliens pay in taxes, rent, that their landlord pays in taxes, blah blah blah. They steal far more in social benifits meant for native born citizens, than they contribute.

Illegal aliens are costing the State of California, something to the tune of 100 billion dollars: released by the Federation for American Immigration Reform (FAIR) estimates that illegal immigration now costs federal and local taxpayers $113 billion a year. The report, [COLOR=#0000ee]The Fiscal Burden of Illegal Immigration on U.S. Taxpayers, is the most comprehensive analysis of how much the estimated 13 million illegal aliens and their U.S.-born children cost the federal, state and local governments.

The cost estimates are based on an extensive analysis of federal, state and local spending data. The Fiscal Burden of Illegal Immigration on U.S. Taxpayers examines dozens of government programs that are available to illegal aliens and their U.S.-born children, both legally and fraudulently. The report provides detailed analysis of the impact of illegal immigration on education, health care, law enforcement and justice, public assistance, and other government programs.

The report also accounts for taxes paid by illegal aliens about $13 billion a year, resulting in a net cost to taxpayers of about $100 billion. However, the study notes that government at all levels would likely have realized significantly greater revenues if jobs held by illegal aliens had been filled by legal U.S. residents instead.Federal spending on illegal aliens amounts to $29 billion, finds Fiscal Burden of Illegal Immigration on U.S. Taxpayers. The lion’s share of the costs of illegal immigration is borne by state and local taxpayers an estimated $84.2 billion. In 18 states, expenditures on illegal aliens exceeded the size of those states’ budget deficits in FY 2009.

Among the key findings of The Fiscal Burden of Illegal Immigration on U.S. Taxpayers:

  • The $113 billion in outlays for services and benefits to illegal aliens and their families represents an average cost to native-headed households of $1,117 a year. Because the burdens of illegal immigration are not evenly distributed, the costs are much higher in states with large illegal alien populations.
  • Education for the children of illegal aliens represents the single largest public expenditure at an annual cost of $52 billion. Nearly all of that cost is absorbed by state and local governments.
  • The federal government recoups about one-third of its share of the costs of illegal immigration in the form of taxes collected. States, which bear a much greater share of the costs, recoup a mere 5 percent of their expenditures from taxes paid by illegal aliens.
  • Granting amnesty to illegal aliens, as President Obama and others propose, would not significantly increase tax revenues generated by current illegal aliens. However, over time, amnesty would dramatically increase public costs as newly-legalized aliens become eligible for all means-tested government programs.
  • Arizona’s annual cost of illegal immigration is $2.5 billion.

“The Fiscal Burden of Illegal Immigration on U.S. Taxpayers provides a definitive response to the question of whether illegal aliens are a net benefit or a net drain on government coffers,” stated Dan Stein president of FAIR. “The report examines virtually every federal, state and local government program to determine the impact of illegal immigration on the bottom line. That bottom line $113 billion a year, and growing makes our nation’s failure to control illegal immigration one of the largest preventable burdens borne by American taxpayers.”

“If political leaders in Washington and state capitals want to understand why the American public is demanding enforcement of our immigration laws, The Fiscal Burden of Illegal Immigration on U.S. Taxpayers, provides 113 billion good reasons,” Stein concluded

If Healthcare is not a basic human right, then why is it given, no questions asked, to illegal immigrants, who have never paid into the system.

The cost estimates are based on an extensive analysis of federal, state and local spending data. The Fiscal Burden of Illegal Immigration on U.S. Taxpayers examines dozens of government programs that are available to illegal aliens and their U.S.-born children, both legally and fraudulently. The report provides detailed analysis of the impact of illegal immigration on education, health care, law enforcement and justice, public assistance, and other government programs.

The report also accounts for taxes paid by illegal aliens about $13 billion a year, resulting in a net cost to taxpayers of about $100 billion. However, the study notes that government at all levels would likely have realized significantly greater revenues if jobs held by illegal aliens had been filled by legal U.S. residents instead.Federal spending on illegal aliens amounts to $29 billion, finds Fiscal Burden of Illegal Immigration on U.S. Taxpayers. The lion’s share of the costs of illegal immigration is borne by state and local taxpayers an estimated $84.2 billion. In 18 states, expenditures on illegal aliens exceeded the size of those states’ budget deficits in FY 2009.

Among the key findings of The Fiscal Burden of Illegal Immigration on U.S. Taxpayers:

  • The $113 billion in outlays for services and benefits to illegal aliens and their families represents an average cost to native-headed households of $1,117 a year. Because the burdens of illegal immigration are not evenly distributed, the costs are much higher in states with large illegal alien populations.
  • Education for the children of illegal aliens represents the single largest public expenditure at an annual cost of $52 billion. Nearly all of that cost is absorbed by state and local governments.
  • The federal government recoups about one-third of its share of the costs of illegal immigration in the form of taxes collected. States, which bear a much greater share of the costs, recoup a mere 5 percent of their expenditures from taxes paid by illegal aliens.
  • Granting amnesty to illegal aliens, as President Obama and others propose, would not significantly increase tax revenues generated by current illegal aliens. However, over time, amnesty would dramatically increase public costs as newly-legalized aliens become eligible for all means-tested government programs.
  • Arizona’s annual cost of illegal immigration is $2.5 billion.

“The Fiscal Burden of Illegal Immigration on U.S. Taxpayers provides a definitive response to the question of whether illegal aliens are a net benefit or a net drain on government coffers,” stated Dan Stein president of FAIR. “The report examines virtually every federal, state and local government program to determine the impact of illegal immigration on the bottom line. That bottom line $113 billion a year, and growing makes our nation’s failure to control illegal immigration one of the largest preventable burdens borne by American taxpayers.”

“If political leaders in Washington and state capitals want to understand why the American public is demanding enforcement of our immigration laws, The Fiscal Burden of Illegal Immigration on U.S. Taxpayers, provides 113 billion good reasons,” Stein concluded.

Now, someone explain to me, why this country is providing free health care to illegal immigrants, who take in BILLIONS more than they contribute, but this country cannot and willnot provide health care for its native born citizens and legal residents. I rest my case!

JMHO and my NY $0.02.

Lindarn, RN, BSN, CCRN

Somewhere in the PACNW

So what of the way this country was founded...were we not all "illegal" immigrants at some point? How do you define "legal"/"illegal" all vague, societal contracts anyway. We need more post-conventional thinking in this world not less! Why are you so selectively forgetful? Not to mention the slaughter of so many native people...was it not also there right to life, liberty and the pursuit of happiness? Or do only "we" (actually you) have these desires/rights/ (whatever configuration we are using now...)What do you suppose we do now...send them all back? And then what? How do we test(uniformly mind you...we must be "fair") who is a "real" American and who is not. Wow...it could be worse than the "death panels" this line of thought always seems to gravitate toward. Sounds vaguely/if not directly like the rhetoric of so many "supremacists" who want to send so many "back to Africa." I imagine with groups like FAIR and people like J. Tanton, you are bound to see things in a way that discounts the fact that the world is no longer flat...

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Specializes in Critical Care.

i love people who say we should deport immigrants, i doubt they would enjoy doing to jobs that many immigrants must do to make ends meet. Once you have to go clean a business from 2-6 am, then cook/clean for some rich person in their house all day, then get home in time to put your kids to bed, then sleep for 3 hours. (i have multiple immigrant friends who must do this). When it comes down to it, it is a hard life, and we need to help people who come to our country for a better life.

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Specializes in Emergency.
i love people who say we should deport immigrants, i doubt they would enjoy doing to jobs that many immigrants must do to make ends meet. Once you have to go clean a business from 2-6 am, then cook/clean for some rich person in their house all day, then get home in time to put your kids to bed, then sleep for 3 hours. (i have multiple immigrant friends who must do this). When it comes down to it, it is a hard life, and we need to help people who come to our country for a better life.

Yes yes!!! Just look what happened in Georgia when they tried to pull this B.S...people(yes they are people) LEFT IN DROVES! Not a few months later we got to hear all the farmers whining and complaining that the crops were not harvested etc...etc...It serves them right. It is the same idea that the southern supremacists want...sure their economy was booming as long as they had the slaves to do the "dirty" work!

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The idea behind universal health care is this: you're sharing resources, so that everyone has some. You're not taking away or removing anything. It does work, although certainly, every system has flaws. As a Canadian, I've only known universal health care, and I couldn't imagine the alternative. The same is true for many Americans wondering how universal health care can work. You know what you live and what you're familiar with.

Yes, the notion of sharing resources so everyone has some is a foreign concept for some people. Coming from the UK I too know about universal health care. It is not perfect, as you pointed out, but everyone has access to health care from birth till death. The whole point of health insurance is to spread the risks and the costs among many. In the UK the risks and costs are shared through taxation as a means of paying for health care.

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Specializes in SICU/CVICU.

My opinion is that everyone has the right to health care. With rights come responibilities and everyone has the responsibility to contribute to the monies used for health care.

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So what of the way this country was founded...were we not all "illegal" immigrants at some point? How do you define "legal"/"illegal" all vague, societal contracts anyway. We need more post-conventional thinking in this world not less! Why are you so selectively forgetful? Not to mention the slaughter of so many native people...was it not also there right to life, liberty and the pursuit of happiness? Or do only "we" (actually you) have these desires/rights/ (whatever configuration we are using now...)What do you suppose we do now...send them all back? And then what? How do we test(uniformly mind you...we must be "fair") who is a "real" American and who is not. Wow...it could be worse than the "death panels" this line of thought always seems to gravitate toward. Sounds vaguely/if not directly like the rhetoric of so many "supremacists" who want to send so many "back to Africa." I imagine with groups like FAIR and people like J. Tanton, you are bound to see things in a way that discounts the fact that the world is no longer flat...

I was born here. Those who came before me, who are now dead, who are not related to me, are no concern of mine. I did not kill anyone. My family did not kill anyone. All those who committed those acts are long dead.

I believe the reference to illegal immigrant is to those who violate federal law and enter the country illegally or violate their legally given immigrant status.

EDIT:

In case you are curious, my mother immigrated here LEGALLY. My great grandparents on my father's side immigrated here legally.

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i love people who say we should deport immigrants, i doubt they would enjoy doing to jobs that many immigrants must do to make ends meet. Once you have to go clean a business from 2-6 am, then cook/clean for some rich person in their house all day, then get home in time to put your kids to bed, then sleep for 3 hours. (i have multiple immigrant friends who must do this). When it comes down to it, it is a hard life, and we need to help people who come to our country for a better life.

From what I hear there is a recession and jobs are hard to come by.

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Yes yes!!! Just look what happened in Georgia when they tried to pull this B.S...people(yes they are people) LEFT IN DROVES! Not a few months later we got to hear all the farmers whining and complaining that the crops were not harvested etc...etc...It serves them right. It is the same idea that the southern supremacists want...sure their economy was booming as long as they had the slaves to do the "dirty" work!

To compare the immigration issue to southern supremacy and slavery is silly and insulting. You are attempting to skew the debate by throwing out terms that will slander anyone who attempts to debate you.

Please use logic, not pejorative terms.

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In addition, how humanitarian is it to acknowledge and encourage underpayment to a group of people? I also believe that it may take awhile however if the jobs that are being filled by non-residents were to be vacated due to them going home Americans who are not counted in the unemployment figures ( due to they have stopped looking), would fill them thus putting more Americans to work.

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