Emergency Nurse Relief Act 2009- Update

Hushdawg · Jun 19, 2009

SO if you can tell me the foreign students go to bed hungry often, work long hours and attend school, have no phones, live in very poor conditions, and don't have proper clothes. I apologize, I read on the boards here, most live in homes often with maids. Do not work while going to school and must have computer access since they post here.

You have no idea.

The ones who are posting here on Allnurses are frequently the more fortunate nurses.

Let me take an aside to explain about having a maid in the house. While this is a luxury only for the very rich in the USA, it is very common in places like the Philippines. Domestic helpers make very little money and stay in the house with the family. Domestic helpers sometimes have a primary family that they work for and then go out to clean for other families on break times in order to earn more money.

A majority of the nurses that I meet and deal with on a daily basis do not have domestic helpers though.

I do not have a domestic helper because of my upbringing even though I could technically afford it and my income level is not what one would consider even middle class for the Philippines.

Also, don't measure wealth by internet access. It costs only P15 an hour to use an internet cafe. P15 is less than a soda.

The reason many do not work while going to school is because of the employment dynamic here in the Philippines and in other countries. While in the USA you can get hired and work in conformity with a student schedule things are not as flexible here. If you are hired for full time then you work 48 hours a week, 8 days each day for 6 days. If you are hired part time then you work when the boss tells you to work. Most frequently you will work 3-4 full days rather than working half days. If you work half days then you must report to work 6 days a week.

Employees are looked at as disposable commodities here so employers are unwilling to work with a student's schedule.

Therefore it is not an UNWILLINGNESS to work but the lack of options.

That being said, many students find ways to earn an income after classes, some with newspaper delivery, some running convenience shops called "Sari-Sari" stores but none of these pay very much at all.

Frequently a student nurse's meal is P25 which consists of rice and a small bit of topping. (P25 is about 50 cents)

Student nurses frequently travel via multiple modes of transportation for more than 2 hours each morning and evening to get to classes because they cannot afford dormitory stay.

Come here for a month and see for yourself. Walk the streets I walk and talk to the prospective nurses that I talk to and you'll change your tune fast.

Shame on the Americans peddling this to poor people to spend more money they don't have. American Immigration has been successful when the immigrate embraces America as there home like my Dad did when he escaped communism. He was so proud to be an American and did everything to advance the American cause. What makes the US great is immigrants who desire to make this there home, not a place to work.

Why is it that there is a right and wrong reason to come to the USA?

Do you honestly think that people coming to the USA for employment and business opportunity is a NEW thing? Heck no! LOTS of people came from Europe to "the colonies" for purely financial reasons.

Back then they were "Pioneers" and "Colonial heroes" but when people do it today they are unworthy of the American Dream? Puh-LEEZ!!!

I am shocked that you, the child of an immigrant, would have such an obtuse view on immigration.

You missed my points, there are checks when employing a US nurse, you can contact the school, instructors and previous employers. And I am taking this up with my state board. US students have an big advantage working in the field while going to nursing school. I also believe all new grads should have an extensive new nurse program to ready them for there career. I am basing this as a Mastered Prepared Nurse educator, do you have an education background at all ? Have you worked in the healthcare industry as a manager?

Again, the state boards of nursing already demand transcripts with detailed course descriptions which include instructor names from foreign nurses. An employer can ask whatever he darn well pleases when he is hiring a nurse.

So first I don't get to have an opinion because I'm not a nurse and now you don't want me to have an opinion because I'm not an educator? what sense does that make?

I have many years of public relations, marketing and media management. I have been the host of a radio program and I have worked for a humanitarian aid organization coordinating efforts for disaster response. So in effect, I have managed medical personnel for these disaster response efforts. I have worked in this regard directly with physicians, nurses, EMTs and various other medical professionals to coordinate efforts over wide areas of need.

Now what do I do?

I help nurses.

Period.

I help nurses. I do not help myself. I do not recruit. I do not staff. I do not find jobs for them. I do not convince them to immigrate.

A nurse comes to me and tells me what he/she wants to do in his/her career and I do everything I can to help that take place quickly, easily and safely. I protect nurses from scam artists and I help them locate reputable companies to work with for parts of the process that I cannot handle.

So do I deserve to have an opinion yet?

Oh you have got to be kidding CEUs are so easy to get, I often get them on my lunch break, no testing involved" They are better then nothing but the CEUS do not prepare you for current nursing practices. This is not accepted as keeping skills up for any nurse American or Foreign.

Again, you look at this from an American perspective. You have no idea what foreign nurses are really having to deal with. Contact Hour credits have to be certified in very specific ways.

Again, these nurses are adhering to guidelines set forth by the BONs.

Are you really willing to say here that the BONS are doing a poor job of maintaining licenses in the USA?

I personally feel nursing issues should be made by nurses not recruiters or lawyers.

Good thing I'm neither a recruiter or a lawyer.

Unfortunately I have to disagree, saying that nursing issues should only be addressed by nurses is like saying drivers should be the ones to decide on traffic laws and license issuance.

Kinda goofy if you ask me.

Home Health Columnist / Guide · Jun 19, 2009

when posting/debating at an, please remember to focus on topic and not individual poster. this makes it a more enriching discussion.

employees are looked at as disposable commodities here so employers are unwilling to work with a student's schedule.

bingo!

that was the viewpoint of many american business men in early 20th century until workers unionized and social reformers pushed for legislation and laws focusing on workers rights to have secure scheduled hours, fair wage standards, equal compensation and unemployment pay along with governement required notice when cutting jobs. american workers are no longer willing to be treated that way.

how a company is entwined in a community creates dramatic effect on sustainability of area. same goes to how engaged staff is in employment setting to creating thriving workplace when staff support each other, provides excellence in care works as team for betterment of patinets, staff and community verusus just showing up to get paid for perfoming work. one only has to look at economic impact auto makers have had on detroit michigan area now spilling over to healthcare system there along with other communites who's businesses have shuttered dorrs and moved down south or out of the country. we desire to change the notion that nurses are a dispossable commidity, instead of the reason hospital exists: excellence in nursing care that keeps patients alive due to assessment and intervention we provide.

there are usually 2-3 divergent opinions on every piece of legislation. how to make your voice heard (beyond an postings) is to

a. track legislation

h.r. 5924 [110th]: emergency nursing supply relief act (govtrack.us)

b. write members of congress:

u.s. senators – search for your senators by name, state, or congressional class; and visit their websites.

u.s. representatives – find contact information for your u.s. representative by typing in your zip code.

c. educate your colleagues, family and friends on effects of legislation

Ginger's Mom, MSN, RN · Jun 19, 2009

It seems to be this bill's life is almost over, since the push is for overall Congress Immigration Reform and there seems to be little interest in pushing this bill.

I am visiting DC today and ensured my voice was heard on Capital Hill.

I believe every American has a voice in every piece of legislation. The process usually includes subject experts, for a nursing bill that would be nurses, health care adminstrators and patients.

I agree with you Nurse Karen all Americans should be more proactive. Nurses to monitor and communicate their opinions to their reps, but more importantly vote. There is a saying you get the government that you elect. I would hope my government listens to Americans and what is in the best interest of all Americans.

Hushdawg · Jun 20, 2009

...and I firmly believe that what is in the best interests of Americans is to ensure that there are sufficient nurses in hospitals to provide healthcare to Americans when they are ill.

I don't care whether they hold a green card or were born in that same hospital.

I just want to know that if my father has a heart attack and is hospitalized that his nurse will not be having to divide time among 50 other patients.

Ginger's Mom, MSN, RN · Jun 21, 2009

...and I firmly believe that what is in the best interests of Americans is to ensure that there are sufficient nurses in hospitals to provide healthcare to Americans when they are ill.
I don't care whether they hold a green card or were born in that same hospital.
I just want to know that if my father has a heart attack and is hospitalized that his nurse will not be having to divide time among 50 other patients.

Of course, when one is sick, a competent nurse should be available, it is immaterial the race, the age, the creed, the sex,

of the nurse. States have nurse patient ratios, department of public health and Joint Commission monitor that patients get safe care. I have never seen one nurse with 50 patients, ever in a hospital. Most ratios are between 4-6 patients.

I think this is the crux of the issue, I don't see they need to bring nurses in. Not today in 2009, who knows what the need is 2010 it would be guess. The current national trend is decreased hospital admissions and decreased services.. And you would need a crystal ball to predict what the need will be.

Right now hospitals are downsizing, with some hospitals closing. Health care reform is looming, last time there was a shift in healthcare ( 1980s and 90s) with the birth of HMOs and many many nursing positions were cut. The focus of this reform is to streamline care, in my state where we have had reform with Mandatory Health Care for all nursing positions were cut.

It is more expensive to import foreign nurses, I believe that hospitals will be looking for the least expensive option to recruit nurses.

When the dust settles and their is a vision for National Healthcare, that all Americans who wish to practice nursing have had the option to go to school, and there the vacancy rate is high over 10%. The hospitals should follow the ethical guidelines to allow foreign nurses to come to practice. In my opinion as a practicing nurse who is on the front line, there is no emergency.

Hushdawg · Jun 22, 2009

States have nurse patient ratios, department of public health and Joint Commission monitor that patients get safe care. I have never seen one nurse with 50 patients, ever in a hospital. Most ratios are between 4-6 patients.

True, but when the nursing shortage hits big time then we will see ratios expanding if there are not nurses available to stand in the gap. The States will threaten to fine the hospitals and then, in scrambling, the hospitals will grab any nurse they can to fill the void instead of doing careful recruiting like they have the comfort to do RIGHT NOW.

I think this is the crux of the issue, I don't see they need to bring nurses in. Not today in 2009, who knows what the need is 2010 it would be guess. The current national trend is decreased hospital admissions and decreased services.. And you would need a crystal ball to predict what the need will be.
....
In my opinion as a practicing nurse who is on the front line, there is no emergency.

You are talking from opinions while others are talking from facts.

The FACTS are that a shortage is looming, big time.

Nobody said that there is a massive shortage RIGHT NOW.

The whole issue has been that the shortage is coming and that US nursing schools cannot in any way meet the demands that will be placed. THAT is what the bill is about. If the shortage is already here then it is too late to do anything about it but survive. For ONCE in this world can we do some preventative measures instead of rushing around to do repair jobs all the time?

This bill is about preparing for a massive nursing shortage that hospital administration KNOWS is coming.

The recession has pushed the date back about a year and a half because people are not taking early retirement, are delaying retirement and some nurses have returned to the profession after spouses have lost their jobs.

These are FACTS, not OPINIONS.

You don't need a crystal ball to see that within 5 years more than 50% of the currently employed nurses MUST retire and that the nursing schools in the USA are completely incapable of filling that many positions in that amount of time even if they ramped up admissions TODAY by an additional 35-40% (basically taking in EVERYONE that is out of work and trying to convert them to nurses).

Ginger's Mom, MSN, RN · Jun 22, 2009

I agree that the perfect scenario would be to allow all qualified US citizens into nursing school and then do an evaluation of the work force. It would be perfect to hire foreign nurses before the shortage to allow for a transition. But the reality every FTE is being evaluated and jobs are being cut.

http://www.businessweek.com/bwdaily/dnflash/content/jun2009/db20090619_970033.htm