NP education - a rant - page 3

I came to the site today and saw lot's of posts of wonderfully excited people interested in becoming NP's. The vast majority of the tones of education were: "I have the opportunity to become and NP... Read More

  1. by   Sheri257
    Quote from RN4NICU
    I wonder how they are getting away with this. The AANA requires 1 year of critical care experience as an RN to enter an accredited CRNA program. The bachelors can be in something other than nursing (but I think it still has to be a science), but how do they get around the experience requirement - I thought that one was non-negotiable?
    You're right. If this info is correct it is VERY worrisome. I wouldn't want someone who took shortcuts pushing drugs into MY veins.
    Sorry if I wasn't clear on that point. From what I understand, they do the one year ICU, after they do a one year accelerated BSN, then the CRNA program. The bachelors does have to be in science.

    I just think it's weird that these people aren't even RNs, much less experienced RNs, when they're accepted. That's not the norm at most schools. I thought that was the point of the requirement, that is, to be an experienced ICU nurse, which is why so many schools prefer more than the minimum one year's ICU experience.

    Maybe it's ok. But I just have doubts about accelerated programs in general.

    Last edit by Sheri257 on Jun 11, '04
  2. by   suzanne4
    Quote from lizz
    Sorry if I wasn't clear on that point. From what I understand, they do the one year ICU, after they do a one year accelerated BSN, then the CRNA program. The bachelors does have to be in science.

    I just think it's weird that these people aren't even RNs, much less experienced RNs, when they're accepted. That's not the norm at most schools. I thought that was the point of the requirement, that is, to be an experienced ICU nurse, which is why so many schools prefer more than the minimum one year's ICU experience.

    Maybe it's ok. But I just have doubts about accelerated programs in general.

    Lizz,
    Which school is it that is doing this. I would love to see thier websit and find out more information. Are they even credentialed for prepapring nurses to be CRNAs?
  3. by   Sheri257
    Quote from suzanne4
    Lizz,
    Which school is it that is doing this. I would love to see thier websit and find out more information. Are they even credentialed for prepapring nurses to be CRNAs?
    From what I've read on the CRNA board, Georgetown and Columbia are doing this with a small number of students in their programs. I don't have the links handy, but they've been posted there. Maybe you could find the info with a board search.

    And, someone just posted that they applied to three accelerated CRNA programs, but I don't know what the third program is.

  4. by   suzanne4
    Quote from lizz
    From what I've read on the CRNA board, Georgetown and Columbia are doing this with a small number of students in their programs. I don't have the links handy, but they've been posted there. Maybe you could find the info with a board search.

    And, someone just posted that they applied to three accelerated CRNA programs, but I don't know what the third program is.

    Has anyone actually graduated from this program? :uhoh21:
  5. by   Sheri257
    Quote from suzanne4
    Has anyone actually graduated from this program? :uhoh21:
    Oops. Just FYI, there isn't a third program (at least that I'm aware of). I just checked and misread that post. Sorry.

    Yeah, there are people who have graduated from those programs. You can find those posts on some old CRNA threads.

  6. by   suzanne4
    Quote from lizz
    Oops. Just FYI, there isn't a third program (at least that I'm aware of). I just checked and misread that post. Sorry.

    Yeah, there are people who have graduated from those programs. You can find those posts on some old CRNA threads.

    If some have actually graduated, then they are not brand new programs. They would have to have been in existance for at least 4 years. What is their graduation rate from the number of students that have started?
    Don't you find it odd that more haven't followed suit if these programs are that successful?
  7. by   Sheri257
    Quote from suzanne4
    If some have actually graduated, then they are not brand new programs. They would have to have been in existance for at least 4 years. What is their graduation rate from the number of students that have started?
    Don't you find it odd that more haven't followed suit if these programs are that successful?
    You got me there. I don't know much more than what I've read on the CRNA board.

    Here's the link to the Georgetown "direct entry" program info:

    http://snhs.georgetown.edu/content.cfm?objectID=1470

    They do require experience in a "clinical setting," whatever that means. But, obviously, it's not ICU.

    Last edit by Sheri257 on Jun 11, '04
  8. by   bwalston
    Sorry - this was a blatt
    Last edit by bwalston on Jun 12, '04
  9. by   samosa
    It was a great overview of the NP program by Catskill. The school where I am accepted into the program require students to have at least 15 months of recent clinical experience in their fields along with GPAs and GREs. Finally the school interviews qualified candidates. Once accepted into the program, students are required to have 600 hrs. of clinical experience. I think it also falls on the schools to drill into students that NP jobs are not to be taken lightly. It has its privileges but has more responsibility.
    I have met NPs who are dedicated and truly involved in the patient care and safety. I hope to be one like that.
    I again commend CATSKILL for a great posting.
  10. by   gredeemer
    Hi,
    I am a FNP, BC, I chose to SPECIALIZE in FAMILY practice. When you choose your track (Family,Acute Care, Neonatal, Pediatric, Adult, Geriatric, Adult/Pedi/ or Family Psych) you have chosen your speciality. In the typical NP program, your application will state which track you are applying toward. The minimum of 2 years experience will help you decide your track or speciality- waiting until you are halfway through the program can yield mismanaged course focus.


    Quote from youngRNstudent
    No, I do not know what I want to specialize in, but I do know I want to be a nurse practitioner. (That would be the point of the 2 years RN experience, before starting the program, and then 3 more during my program!) You don't start to specialize until your MSN, halfway through the FNP program.

    I'm sorry I think its smarter to continue with school than to stop, work for 10 years, and then try to go back. Experience is needed, as everyone has said, but I think its ridiculous to try and hold someone back from doing what they really wanted in the first place. That's my opinion
  11. by   CapeJaz
    Direct entry programs have been graduating qualified NPs for 25+ years. I have worked with people who have gone thru these programs and most are intelligent critical thinkers who are caring practitioners that practice evidence based medicine. There are some less than stellar graduates, but that's no different from any other field.

    No matter where a person goes to school - a hospital diploma program, community college, 4 year university, does an MSN thru distance learning, in a classroom, in 2 years or 5 years - they still have to pass the same exams, find a job (and keep it) and continue learning. Experience is the best teacher, but it always comes down to the abilities of the student. Just because someone worked as an RN for x number of years does not mean that they are good at their job.

    I wonder what the motivation is for the original post. It is a sad rant and I hope no one considering a direct entry program is discouraged by it - yet, it's actually very informative for those who weren't aware of the attitudes still present in nursing.
  12. by   fotografe
    Quote from lizz
    Actually, there are accelerated "fast-track" CRNA programs now. You don't have to be an RN to qualify. Just a bachelor's of science degree (not a BSN).

    Some people say it's OK and that there's no shortcuts with the requirements. But I have doubts. There seems to accelerated everything these days. It's worrisome.

    I think the "fast-track" programs you are talking about really are not any faster than the other route (Columbia and Georgetown are the 2 I am thinking of). You merely are reserved a space in the CRNA class if you complete all requirements -- including the year of Critical Care. You do get the RN in 16 months or so, but that is the same amount of class time as if you did an ADN program -- just no summer off. I think very few people actually go through the programs that way. They remind me of the Med programs some colleges offer -- you apply for med school right out of high school and are guaranteed a spot in the med school class if you meet all requirements along the way. These programs are for the very focused individual!
  13. by   Purlple
    [QUOTE=CapeJaz]

    I agree with CapeJaz. Working as an RN for years doesn't guarantee she is great in what she/he does. (When I was in hospital with my son the most experienced night RN set up the alarm for Oxygen Sat at a lower rate that Doc advised so she doesn't have to get up from her chair that often!!!).

    I agree that some experience as RN is very helpful before applying for NP. However, most of the NP programs I looked require minimum one or two years of experience anyway. For example - CRNA - 1 year, NNP - 1year, Acute or Gerontology 2 years.

    I am still in school for BSN and posted few messages about NPs earlier. And that is because I like to do my research early and possibly get my internship in the department I might get a job as RN later. And IF I like it I might do NP in that field. If I am asking questions about NPs responsibilities it is because I want to increase my knowledge and not because I'm applying for it tomorrow. I think first message on this thread is very angry.
    Last edit by Purlple on Aug 15, '04

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