Content That klone Likes

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klone, MSN, RN 58,899 Views

Joined Apr 2, '03 - from 'Denver, CO, US'. klone is a Charge Nurse, Women's Health/Public Health. She has '10' year(s) of experience and specializes in 'OB/Gyn, research, lactation'. Posts: 10,815 (54% Liked) Likes: 25,519

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  • Aug 22

    Quote from GeneralistRN

    However, working off the clock is definitely a trashy blue collar mentality. By working off the clock, you are essentially declaring to everyone else, coworkers and managers alike in a loud, bold voice:

    "In my estimation, my skillset is so basic, and my time is so lacking in value, that I don't even have an expectation of being compensated fairly for my time and effort spent working in my role as a nurse."

    That is why working off the clock hurts nursing. It doesn't matter in what capacity you are working off the clock either. Researching patient information is part of a nurse's professional role too, and so you should be paid for doing it. Rationalizing why it's okay to do it without pay just helps to hold back the profession further.
    I'm salaried -- not paid by the hour. Like most upper-level workers, my compensation is determined by my expertise and overall contribution I make to the organization. Some weeks, I work less than 40 hours, some weeks more than 40 hours -- but my pay is the same. That's the way it is in most professions.

    It's the "I'm paid by the hour regardless of the value of my contribution" mentality that is non-professional -- and is generally the attitude of only the lowest level workers. Professionals think more in terms of outcomes, contributions, and value than the ticks of a clock.

    That's not the same as advocating for or being accepting of abuse. It's being sophisticated enough to understand the differences.

  • Aug 22

    Quote from GeneralistRN
    It isn't ageism; it's a rather well known generational phenomenon. If you're even mildly familiar with sociology, you might even know about it.
    This is the OP trying to hide her agism behind a sociological theory that may or may not be ageist in itself.

    1. We've all seen young nurses with poor organizational skills. Many of them post here on allnurses about their need to stay later than the experienced nurses to get all their work done. Yet the OP chose to ignore those young nurses in her post -- unnecessarily bringing up the age factor.

    2. And by the way ... people in their 40's are not "baby boomers." The youngest members of the Baby Boom generation (born in 1965) are now in their 50's. Those people in their 40's you wrote about are Gen X'ers -- which kind'a blows the credibility off your theoretical argument about it being a Baby Boom weakness and not a problem for Gen X'ers.

    3. Just because it is a theory you read somewhere doesn't mean it is ageist.

    An alternative (and kinder) interpretation of the phenomenon would be that older workers have learned some lessons in life that the younger people haven't learned yet -- and have decided that spending a little extra time to assure safety and thoroughness is worth a little inconvenience for them.

    Older workers may also realize that as older workers, they will have more difficulty on the job market should the "young whipper-snapper" manager decide to fire them because they are prejudiced against older workers and/or don't want to pay extra for the experienced judgment those older workers bring. So those older workers work harder to keep their jobs by demonstrating loyalty and making sure that everything is done properly before they leave for the day.

    Now ... I don't do much work off the clock either ... but I am willing to put in extra work hours when the situation calls for it. It's called "professionalism" vs "blue collar mentality."

    ... and I know ageism when I see it. Bringing age into the discussion was unnecessary. It indicates that you see it as an age issue -- and you condemn a particular generation for doing certain things. That's ageism.

  • Aug 22
  • Aug 21

    Quote from dangerous1
    Let's talk about being told the truth, families are not explained the whole truth of how the organs are harvested in details and process, it's rather gruesome. I witnessed it. I can see how people or non medical people were told the truth it'd be a deterrent.
    OP, I believe this statement reveals the true essence of your argument and driving force of your rather defensive and rude replies. You find the entire concept to be distasteful, and you're verbally twisting disagreeing arms.

    Yes, families are in a state of grief, and this is certainly an unpleasant time for anything other than tears and hugs. But the reality is that FAR too many bodies go straight into the ground or furnace without so much as a useful cell left behind. Advance directives are wonderful, but the fact is that most of our younger and healthier potential donors don't live their lives in anticipation of a horrific injury tomorrow. Therefore, no advance directive.

    You state that if people were told "the truth" (your truth), it would be a deterrent. I believe that if the miracle of organ/tissue donation and transplantation was discussed with more altruistic and societal benefit in mind, rather than a default "follow the money" cynicism that often times impedes progress, we'd all be better off.

    I am donating everything available, should it be possible. While I absolutely hope that you live a long and healthy life, I also hope you're granted a life-extending miracle, should it be needed.

  • Aug 21

    Quote from NurseGirl525
    In my state, we are not allowed to mention it. At all. We do not talk about it even if they bring it up. They are promptly referred to our state's organ team.
    I've worked in multiple states and this has always been the policy- for hospital staff not to discuss donation with the family at all, under any circumstances- if they initiate the conversation, we still can't, they're referred to the organ donation organization.

    I don't think it's accurate to assume that families changing their minds after talking to someone trained in donation issues must necessarily have been coerced. In those cases I've seen where the family changed their minds, it was because they initially had misconceptions about donation (that it would change the care their loved one would receive, that it would prevent an open-casket funeral, etc) and decided in favor once those concerns were allayed, and having considered the positive aspects (so many people are looking for some glimmer of positivity in a terrible situation).

    It's not wrong to consider the ethics of these things but I don't know how this could be done in a way that entirely allays the concern of coercion or potentially upsetting a family by raising the issue at all, other than simply never addressing the issue with anyone who didn't positively affirm their wish to donate in life. And that itself has major ethical issues- it denies the family the opportunity to make the donation (something many people value in retrospect) unless they happen to think of and raise the issue on their own under extreme stress within the narrow window (unlikely), and it would almost certainly massively reduce the number of donations (already inadequate to the demand) leaving many more people to die and suffer needlessly.

    Those seem like harsh costs for the possible benefit of avoiding a possibly uncomfortable conversation, even for the grieving.

  • Aug 20

    ICU nurse here. I agree that nursing isn't all about "working hard," and yes we are highly trained.

    That said, I also agree with the PPs that other specialties do have their own areas. Labor and delivery? I'd be clueless. Their skill sets are a huge part of why most women/babies today survive childbirth. Public health? Their skill sets are vital to keeping the public well, and they are highly trained to practice nursing at a systems level. LTC/Geriatrics? The elderly are a vulnerable and an extremely important population, and their nurses are top-notch at assessing patients without the help of monitoring. Med-surg? They are so much better at patient teaching than I am, especially when it comes to discharge planning and readmit prevention than I am. Psych? Their skill sets keep their patients safe from themselves, and help prepare them for a healthy and productive return to the community

    There is no way in hades I could float to one of those units and be competent. Why not -- I'm a highly trained ICU RN. It's because RNs in other specialties have different​ skill sets. Not less, just different.

  • Aug 20

    Quote from CardiacDork
    Thank you for your respectful response

    No, our ICU work is not more important but does require specialized skills in comparison with medsurg. More skills and more liability. Do you think these are not reasons for higher compensation? Opinions please.
    Sorry, I added this to my original response but clearer to post it here:

    If you're extending your role with skills like PICC insertion, taking charge, etc, then that I believe is worth a pay bump. But training so that you can function in the post you were hired for? No.

  • Aug 18

    You're a straight manly-man you say? Definitely not gay? Maybe add that in a few more times, I wasn't quite sure ^.^

    You seem to be projecting your own insecurities onto your job here, friend-o. Leaving aside the whole "most male nurses are surely feminine and/or gay" thing (which: how charmingly regressive) why do you even care about how your patients and coworkers perceive your sexual orientation? When, pray tell, would that even enter into your day-to-day work life?? If you were truly comfortable in the knowledge of who you are in your personal life you probably wouldn't be stressing about what random people at work think.

    Anyway, my main question is- ladies, do you find male nurses attractive? Do you like the idea of a man taking care of you? Or does it seem unmanly and unattractive?
    Let's leave off the assumption that women going to a hospital for work or as a patient also must be on the lookout for a date, because eww. As a straight cis-gender female I'm attracted to men in general, yes. Am I sizing up each male nurse I encounter as a sexual object? Uhh no. No I don't, because like many adults I keep that part of my life separate from my professional life. If I found out a man I was attracted to was an RN, would I be like "oh noes, he suddenly appears effeminate and therefore probably gay!!!" No. No. Are you kidding me with this?

  • Aug 18

    This is kind of a ridiculous question. If you want to know if women find male nurses attractive, you need to tell the women you're talking to and find out the hard way. However, any man who initially lied to me about his career choice would be throwing down all kinds of red flags from the get-go.

  • Aug 18

    Quote from Sykadia
    Hi

    So I'm a young, single, heterosexual male nurse, and I'm well aware that I'm somewhat of a minority, as most nurses are female, and the ones that aren't, are often gay (yes, I know that is just a silly stereotype, and there's nothing wrong with being gay, but that's beside my point).

    Thing is, I'm not even remotely feminine- I have a beard, I listen to heavy metal, I climb mountains, I work out, etcetera. But I get paranoid that most people probably perceive me as a little "girly" or "possibly homosexual", when I talk about being a nurse. I feel especially insecure about my masculinity when I'm walking home wearing my uniform past some heavy set dudes doing roadworks or construction or something "manly". Sometimes, I've even lied about studying nursing at uni- I've sometimes said I'm studying engineering, to seem more masculine.

    I'm not ashamed of being a nurse- I'm damn proud! But I feel a little insecure due to the silly non-masculine stereotypes associated with my career choice. I'm also single and looking for a girlfriend, but I sense that women might think I'm gay, or unmanly, due to my profession. Maybe I'm just being paranoid.

    Anyway, my main question is- ladies, do you find male nurses attractive? Do you like the idea of a man taking care of you? Or does it seem unmanly and unattractive?

    Regards - Sykadia
    Are you seriously asking females if they "like" a man taking care of them?? As in being attracted to a manly nurse? (Which, by the way, has no place in the discussion of appropriate nursing care.)

    In my opinion, male nurses put way too much thought into their gender/genitalia.

  • Aug 18

    A woman who is not attracted to you would probably say it has nothing to do with your profession, and everything to do with your insecurity and lack of confidence.

  • Aug 18

    Some of the male nurses I know are gay, but most are not. Males in nursing are not even interesting or remarkable these days because there are so many of them.

  • Aug 18

    You're projecting your insecurities, amigo. Any lady worth knowing won't overlook you for being a nurse.
    Edit* Visit the 'men in nursing' section here to see that this question gets asked somewhat often. Usually it's young dudes like yourself that just need to experience life a bit more to feel comfortable in their chosen life.

  • Aug 15

    Whatever position is comfortable for mom and tolerable for babe. There is no required or recommended position. That said, leaving mom on one side for too long can give analgesia that is greater on one side.

  • Aug 12

    Quote from nursejaclynxx
    Im
    wondering if there's a possibility for private clinic nurses to move into the hospital. Worried that it gets harder and harder every year
    It's going to be a whole lot harder if you shoot yourself in the foot by breaking your contract and job hopping. If you still want to get into L & D in a year, find a way to make it happen. For now, concentrate on the job you have, and do it well.


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