vet techs using the term nurse - page 7

what do you guys think of the growing controversy of vet techs calling themselves nurses?... Read More

  1. by   JLSL95
    Thanks!
  2. by   RN2B2005
    I forgot to add, the various designations given by various states to veterinary technicians who have passed both the NAVTA and state licencing boards are:

    C.V.T. (Certified Veterinary Technician), L.V.T. (Licenced Veterinary Technician), R.V.T (Registered Veterinary Technician), L.V.N. (Licenced Veterinary Nurse), A.H.T. (Animal Health Technician), and probably some other variations on the theme. ONLY SOMEONE WHO HAS TAKEN, AND PASSED, THE LICENCING EXAM IN HIS OR HER STATE CAN USE THESE INITIALS.

    So, if you see someone with a "C.V.T." (or any of the above) after her name, then she's actually licenced. Each state uses its own terminology--even though all of the above are essentially equivalent. If you see someone with "Veterinary Technician" or "Veterinary Assistant" on his or her namebadge, but without the abbreviation, then it's a safe bet he or she is NOT licenced.

    I've never seen an unlicenced assistant referred to as a C.V.T.; I think that would be outright fraud, similar to putting "R.N." after your name if you're really an unlicenced home health aide. The distinction, though, between 'Jane Smith, Veterinary Technician' and 'Jane Smith, C.V.T., Veterinary Technician' is pretty subtle and most owners aren't going to notice or care.

    Interestingly, as an L.V.T., I found our most difficult owners to be R.N.'s and M.D.'s--they figured that since they could d/c sutures or intubate or whatever a human, then they could do it on a dog/cat/hamster. More than one medical professional has killed their pet by giving it acetominophen...fine in humans, lethal in dogs. My favourite was an IV therapy R.N. who decided her Chow needed IV fluids (without ever seeing a veterinarian, natch)...then attempted to place a catheter. The thing is, Chows as a breed tend to have very friable skin, which peels off like butter when shaved, and this woman ended up blowing all of the dog's easily accessible veins before finally attempting a femoral cath. The dog ended up bleeding out on her living room floor and had to have surgery to repair the damage, as well as being hospitalised for acute pancreatitis. Even after we saved her dog's life, her attitude was, well, I'm an R.N. so of course I can treat a stupid dog. She never acknowledged her arrogance or her mistake, and she certainly wasn't disciplined for practicing veterinary medicine without a licence.

    I wonder how fast C.P.S. would be here if I decided that as an L.V.T. I could place an I.V. catheter in my son?

    It doesn't matter what L.V.T's are called (when I worked for the university, my name badge actually read "Veterinary Nurse, Primate Research Unit")--the profession will never receive as much respect as 'real' (read: human) medicine.

    And now that I work with humans, I don't have to explain myself or my job, nor do I get peed on or bitten nearly as often, and I've never had a veterinarian come in and announce that he knows how to start an I.V. on his son, so I don't need to charge him for that.
  3. by   SKM-NURSIEPOOH
    originally posted by rn2b2005
    ...interestingly, as an l.v.t., i found our most difficult owners to be r.n.'s and m.d.'s--they figured that since they could d/c sutures or intubate or whatever a human, then they could do it on a dog/cat/hamster. more than one medical professional has killed their pet by giving it acetominophen...fine in humans, lethal in dogs. my favourite was an iv therapy r.n. who decided her chow needed iv fluids (without ever seeing a veterinarian, natch)...then attempted to place a catheter. the thing is, chows as a breed tend to have very friable skin, which peels off like butter when shaved, and this woman ended up blowing all of the dog's easily accessible veins before finally attempting a femoral cath. the dog ended up bleeding out on her living room floor and had to have surgery to repair the damage, as well as being hospitalised for acute pancreatitis. even after we saved her dog's life, her attitude was, well, i'm an r.n. so of course i can treat a stupid dog. she never acknowledged her arrogance or her mistake, and she certainly wasn't disciplined for practicing veterinary medicine without a licence....

  4. by   susanmary
    Here we go again (and again and again) -- legally you are licensed as a nurse if you have completed the requisite nursing curriculum, passed the boards, and have a license to practice. Those who attempt to pass themselves off as nurses (NURSE WANNA B's) are committing fraud -- and it is criminal. Tsk...tsk....
  5. by   SmilingBluEyes
    Originally posted by RN2B2005
    IInterestingly, as an L.V.T., I found our most difficult owners to be R.N.'s and M.D.'s--they figured that since they could d/c sutures or intubate or whatever a human, then they could do it on a dog/cat/hamster. More than one medical professional has killed their pet by giving it acetominophen...fine in humans, lethal in dogs. My favourite was an IV therapy R.N. who decided her Chow needed IV fluids (without ever seeing a veterinarian, natch)...then attempted to place a catheter. The thing is, Chows as a breed tend to have very friable skin, which peels off like butter when shaved, and this woman ended up blowing all of the dog's easily accessible veins before finally attempting a femoral cath. The dog ended up bleeding out on her living room floor and had to have surgery to repair the damage, as well as being hospitalised for acute pancreatitis. Even after we saved her dog's life, her attitude was, well, I'm an R.N. so of course I can treat a stupid dog. She never acknowledged her arrogance or her mistake, and she certainly wasn't disciplined for practicing veterinary medicine without a licence.

    I wonder how fast C.P.S. would be here if I decided that as an L.V.T. I could place an I.V. catheter in my son?

    .
    As an RN, I know much better than to do such a thing to an animal, cause you see I KNOW THE DIFFERENCE between MYSELF and a VETERANARIAN and/or VET TECH, and know my limitations. ARE YOU SAYING THIS IS THE RULE W/YOUR CLIENTS????? I can't believe that RN's as a rule (or MD's for that matter) would as a rule do such things!
  6. by   Ortho_RN
    They do.. I have experianced it myself..... They are trying to save money, because you know how the vets just charge so much
  7. by   SmilingBluEyes
    So, the majority of animal abuse such as this is committed by RN's? Just curious, I cannot imagine an RN being so stupid and abusive! Before I forget, do you recommend PET INSURANCE? does your office accept any of it? JUST CURIOUS! thinking of insuring my 2 year old GOLDEN while she is young and healthy.
  8. by   911fltrn
    Wow, Im way late in this post. Call yourself a nurse. Against the law in every state i know of! Unless you have gone to school to be an a l.v.n or r.n.
  9. by   RN2B2005
    Nah, the most difficult owners--'difficult' not being equal to 'abusive'--are definitely those guys with Ph.D.'s in, say, English, who try to intimidate the veterinarian by identifying themselves as 'Doctor'. Chiropractors (and other pseudo-physicians) also have a tendency to do this--calling up and saying "This is Doctor So-and-So....". No different than in human medicine.

    The R.N.'s and M.D.'s who try to expand the scope of their practise into veterinary medicine tend to be those whom, I would guess, do not themselves represent the best and brightest of their professions. Most R.N.'s and M.D.'s make fabulous clients--they understand what we're doing, and why, and they understand why it costs what it does.

    The problem is, when an R.N. or M.D. decides to attempt home veterinary practise, they tend to have more supplies (IV caths, meds, fluids) at their disposal and thus can wreak more damage on their pet before bringing it in for proper care.

    ANYHOW! Enough of this thread for me. When I graduate from nursing school, I'll call myself a nurse. I won't worry about whether calling someone a "veterinary nurse" diminishes the RN licensure, the graduate degree or the nursing profession, because I know that licenced veterinary technicians are proud of their profession, and because I know that NOBODY is dumb enough to confuse an L.V.T. wrestling a Rottweiler with an R.N. cradling a newborn. I WILL worry about cheap-a$$ hospitals and doctors who call any breathing body in scrubs a "nurse".

    SmilingBlu, check your PM's re of pet insurance.
  10. by   RN2B2005
    Oh, and to CLARIFY...I have NEVER known ANY licenced veterinary technician to call herself a 'nurse' without the modifier--and the MODIFIER in this instance, for those who are grammatically impaired and/or insecure about their position in life, is the word 'veterinary'. That would just be stupidness.

    Susan, read the WHOLE thread before "tsk, tsk"-ing me. The point of the thread is, the term 'veterinary nurse' is a PHRASE (not a single word) used to identify veterinary assistive personnel who have completed a certain set of national licensing exams and boards and who meet certain standards imposed by the North American Veterinary Technician Association. I called myself a 'veterinary technician', as do most vet techs here in the States, but the PHRASE 'veterinary nurse' is considered INTERCHANGEABLE with the former and in fact appears on some state and provincial licences, as in "Jane So-And-So, Registered Veterinary Nurse". The point of the thread is, there is no cohesive identification for licenced veterinary technicians as there is for registered nurses.

    And yes, I know that identifying oneself as an R.N. or L.P.N. or 'nurse' (as a single word) without actually being an R.N. or L.P.N. is fraud. Duh. I work in HUMAN medicine now, and I certainly don't consider myself or refer to myself as a 'nurse'--and I won't until I have the A.D.N. degree in one hand and the R.N. licence in the other.
  11. by   SKM-NURSIEPOOH
    originally posted by rn2b2005
    oh, and to clarify...i have never known any licensed veterinary technician to call herself a 'nurse' without the modifier--and the modifier in this instance, for those who are grammatically impaired and/or insecure about their position in life, is the word 'veterinary'. that would just be stupidness.

    susan, read the whole thread before "tsk, tsk"-ing me. the point of the thread is, the term 'veterinary nurse' is a phrase (not a single word) used to identify veterinary assistive personnel who have completed a certain set of national licensing exams and boards and who meet certain standards imposed by the north american veterinary technician association. i called myself a 'veterinary technician', as do most vet techs here in the states, but the phrase 'veterinary nurse' is considered interchangeable with the former and in fact appears on some state and provincial licenses, as in "jane so-and-so, registered veterinary nurse". the point of the thread is, there is no cohesive identification for licensed veterinary technicians as there is for registered nurses.

    and yes, i know that identifying oneself as an r.n. or l.p.n. or 'nurse' (as a single word) without actually being an r.n. or l.p.n. is fraud. duh. i work in human medicine now, and i certainly don't consider myself or refer to myself as a 'nurse'--and i won't until i have the a.d.n. degree in one hand and the r.n. license in the other.
    i think you've made your point about the *veterinary* being the qualifier for the title of veterinary nurse...whether registered veterinary nurse or licensed veterinary nurse...i think the general public would understand & *know* the difference between nurses & veterinary nurses ...they aren't *that* far gone...yet !

    but i guess it's *o.k.* to place dozens of other qualifiers in front of the title tech (surgical, respiratory, physical/occupational, patient care, etc)...no one seem to mind that though . why??? because...what...techs aren't seen as valuable or educated as nurses???....this should be a no brain-er here...hell, why the title: cna has the nurse as part of it & *they* are not licensed nurses....man this sounds like another case of superiority (i'm better than you because i'm a nurse & you're just a tech) again :angryfire! it seems that nurses that have a problem with the concept of the title nurse being used with the veterinary qualifier must feel threaten in some way...sounds like insecurity to me....i can't understand why they would feel insecure though...this *is* two different field of practice...like vets & dos/mds have very different philosophies & scopes of practice. christ...if veterinarians are docs & the ama have no problems with *them* using the title (dr.)...as long as they (the vets) don't practice medicine on humans...why can't the title veterinary nurse be used with the same stipulation??? if states *are* now applying the title of veterinary nurse with certification/licenses after individuals have *satisfied* all required didactic & clinical education/hours at *accredited* colleges/universities....& of course they pass all written state exams....what's the big deal with awarding the title veterinary nurse ???

    why are nurses so threatened with this??? can anyone justify this question without coming-off sounding superior to, dismissing of, looking down on, or disrespecting veterinary techs/nurses??? just a thought~

    cheers!
    moe
  12. by   RNFROG3
    I have to agree with Deb & opalm here.Every profession has highly trained individuals who deserve respect. Anyone who has to deal with the public for clients deserves respect-even cashiers at the the grocery store, but I wouldn't call them nurses. Be proud of whatever title your job or degree gives you and act professional- then some of the time some of the public (on a good day) might give you the respect you are due. But don't count on it. Joe public have their own agenda. I'm proud to be a nurse and I know I value and respect what vet techs do cuz I know fer sure I can in no way shape or form do that job. (to much empathy for the animal and anger with the folks that own irresponsibly! Thank you for what you do now and welcome and goodluck to your choice to go into nursing.
  13. by   fab4fan
    The post about RN's treating animals made me think of something that happened to me a few years ag

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