Sexism in Nursing (a male point of view)

Nurses General Nursing

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As a male in nursing, I feel that I am sometimes treated differently because of my gender. I believe that I am expected to carry a heavier patient load with less assistance from my female coworkers. I also believe that men are more often assigned to care for obese patients; I am also sometimes pulled to the other end of the unit to assist in moving heavy patients because I am stronger.

For instance, I work in an ICU and our nurse to patient ratio is either 1:1 or 1:2; the other day 4 out of the 5 doubles (1:2) were assigned to men. On the same day, a female nurse said "We can get so and so to help, he's a big strong guy." I responded that I felt that was sexism and the nurse said "Are you saying that men aren't physically stronger than women." I replied that I agreed that, in general, men are stronger than women; however, they are not immune to back injuries or repeatative stress injuries. We are friends and this was a friendly and playful discussion.

I think part of what motivated me to post this topic is the Oregon poster to recruit men into nursing because more men in nursing would change the current culture. Nursing is female dominated; therfore, so is the culture. Most men (especially the real men to whom this poster is directed) are not used to being the "underdog" or to working in an environment where their way of dealing with stress may be viewed as inappropriate. The adjustment can be difficult. I have talked to other men I work with and most have agreed (quietly), but it isn't something that is talked about. I thought that this would be a great forum in which to discuss this topic.

My aim is not to attack female nurses or to be confrontational, it is to discuss this topic openly as I feel it to be important.

Specializes in Pediatric Rehabilitation.

Don,

I admit to being overprotective..it goes with the territory of my particular field of work. I'm not the only guilty party, but probably wouldn't change even if I were.

I'm obviously an idiot. I've read back through the whole thread and I still fail to see examples of sexism in nursing/by nursing. Will you strong, abused men please take some pity in a little ole' southern girl and spell it out in one simple reply?? Come on now, where is there gender biased sexism against men in nursing??

Specializes in LDRP; Education.
Originally posted by Dayray

Well Susy what makes you uncomfortable about a man cathing you?

I don't know, it was a general example thrown out there. Not sure how I feel about it. Knee jerk reaction is to prefer a female. I don't know why. If it came down to it, I'd probably be more upset at being cathed PERIOD than who it was done by.

Specializes in LDRP; Education.
Originally posted by nurs4kids

I'm obviously an idiot. I've read back through the whole thread and I still fail to see examples of sexism in nursing/by nursing.

Count me in as an idiot. I've read through all the posts and it all goes back to lifting help as the specific example, and other than that, broad generalizations.

I always like how people claim something is there, but never really can say what it is. :chuckle

Specializes in Pediatric Rehabilitation.

I'm seriously trying to understand this. I believe someone earlier made a reference to this same thing. Our hospital has a SWAT team, composed of men. Their job is to respond to restrain unmanagable patients. This, to me, is sexism. There is not one female on the team. Maybe this is what you guys are talking about, but this isn't the fault of the female's in nursing, it's management.

Other than the brutal strength issue, I just can't validate or understand your stance without some straight-forward examples. Doesn't look like we're going to get any, susy.

wonder why? :D

OK, I think, from a male perspective, and a somewhat calmer perspective as well, there are a few points that need to be addressed.

First, patient preferences: Whether the reason is sexist, a concerned mother watching out for her children, or the "little voices told me so," a patient preferring a female (or male) to provide cares stops all argument. Patient preference is paramount, and all our petty squabbling, all our hurt feelings matter not a hill of beans. If nurs4kids prefers a female nurse to cath her daughter, or provide any other cares, the matter is not open to discussion. We simply do the best we can to comply. By virtue of of being a patient, the patient is already uncomfortable enough. We don't increase that discomfort simply to advance our own political agenda. As a male nurse, who worked in an ICU, I have had female patients tell me directly they preferred females. I don't dislike them for it, I don't try to change their mind, I don't do anything but smile, tell them I understand, and go to the charge nurse to get assignments changed. In one case, I remember needing to cath a patient. When I told her what I was going to do (remember, I had been caring for her for most of the day), she got kind of tight lipped, and nodded. I asked her what the problem was, and she essentially told me she didn't like the idea of a male doing that, but she could handle it. In return, I told her she was handling enough being a patient in an ICU, and if it would make her more comfortable, I'd find a female to catheterize her. We did, and she and I got along wonderfully for the rest of her stay, and I personally felt pretty good about myself for picking up on what could have been a pretty uncomfortable experience for her. The idea to be indignant at her blatant sexism (rhetorical: her preference had to do with her generation, not sexism) never entered my mind. The point? Political agendas, personal axes to grind, or other personal issues of the NURSE have no place in patient care. It bears repeating: The concerns and desires of the patient are paramount, and WE DON'T GET TO QUESTION THOSE DESIRES OR THE REASON BEHIND THEM.

Said it before, I'll say it again, briefly: On the topic of lifting, coming to get me to help lift a patient who weighs 300 lbs isn't sexism. It's appropriate utilization of resources. Just as finding a female to cath my patient who was uncomfortable with a male performing the procedure was appropriate utilization of resources.

However, to nurs4kids, see my previous post in this thread. There is anti-male bias in nursing, and against male nurses in the general population. For me, the question isn't how do I rail against it, but rather how do I get around it to do my job? You wanted examples, I'll give you a couple more.

Before I ever became a nurse, I was in the Army. Knew I was getting out, many people asked me what I planned to do. Told them I was going to become a nurse. More than once, I was confronted with the comment "I didn't even know you were gay." (Not necessarily in those words, but that was the sentiment.) Heard it from both military members and civilians. There is a presumption among many that if a male wants to be a nurse, he must be gay. WTF? I could care less about anyone's sexual orientation, but this presumption continues a stereotype that helps no one.

In nursing school, during my OB rotation, I had an instructor who made my life miserable. She did the same for every male who came through the program. My first ever assignment was to care for a post-partum woman of middle eastern descent. She, and her husband, had gone to great pains, owing to their beliefs and heritage, to ensure no males were involved in her care. Her absolute right. My instructor managed to push me into the room just as the lactation consultant was giving breast feeding instruction to the woman. A very uncomfortable situation for all, and I have since learned that my instructor KNEW exactly what she was sending me into. Fast forward to the next semester. The same instructor, starting with a fresh section from the class behind me. She walked into the room on day one, noted that all the students were female. First comment out of her mouth? "I like to see this. Only women should be nurses."

Now, nurs4kids, does that meet your criteria for anti-male bias?

I will say that since becoming a CRNA, the bias seems to have disappeared. Hmmmm.... I guess men can be advanced practice nurses.

Kevin McHugh

Specializes in ED staff.

ERN ....I went out too, so sorry to be so late in replying to your post. A thousand bucks a week is fifty two grand a year that is not a six figure income (the zeros after the decimal point don't count). Good to see a post from you nurs4kids :)

Specializes in ED staff.

I hate to be dumb, but who is this Bob you keep referring to? Or is Bob an it? As in battery operated boyfriend?

Specializes in Pediatric Rehabilitation.
Quote
Originally posted by kmchugh

However, to nurs4kids, see my previous post in this thread. There is anti-male bias in nursing, and against male nurses in the general population. For me, the question isn't how do I rail against it, but rather how do I get around it to do my job? You wanted examples, I'll give you a couple more.

Before I ever became a nurse, I was in the Army. Knew I was getting out, many people asked me what I planned to do. Told them I was going to become a nurse. More than once, I was confronted with the comment "I didn't even know you were gay." (Not necessarily in those words, but that was the sentiment.) Heard it from both military members and civilians. There is a presumption among many that if a male wants to be a nurse, he must be gay. WOW!? I could care less about anyone's sexual orientation, but this presumption continues a stereotype that helps no one.

In nursing school, during my OB rotation, I had an instructor who made my life miserable. She did the same for every male who came through the program. My first ever assignment was to care for a post-partum woman of middle eastern descent. She, and her husband, had gone to great pains, owing to their beliefs and heritage, to ensure no males were involved in her care. Her absolute right. My instructor managed to push me into the room just as the lactation consultant was giving breast feeding instruction to the woman. A very uncomfortable situation for all, and I have since learned that my instructor KNEW exactly what she was sending me into. Fast forward to the next semester. The same instructor, starting with a fresh section from the class behind me. She walked into the room on day one, noted that all the students were female. First comment out of her mouth? "I like to see this. Only women should be nurses."

Now, nurs4kids, does that meet your criteria for anti-male bias?

I will say that since becoming a CRNA, the bias seems to have disappeared. Hmmmm.... I guess men can be advanced practice nurses.

Kevin,

Thank you for your non-defensive reply. As usual, you are capable of making an articulate debate w/o personal attack..I appreciate that.

Now, I do not deny or doubt one thing you've posted above. Nursing school was a nightmare for us all. I went to an all black nursing school and there were things I went through that I KNOW was because of my skin color. HOWEVER, that was nursing school and as we all know, nursing school is not nursing. I have never accused all blacks of being racist just because I had a few racist nursing instructors.

As for the "gay" issue. That is a societial view, not a nursing view. And I was informed earlier that THIS debate is not about society, but about nursing. However, I do think this is an unfair "label" and I do think as more and more men enter nursing, that stigma will leave.

So, Kevin, I guess respectfully..No, that does not meet my criteria. This post says there is "sexism in nursing (from a male perspective)". THAT is what I want to hear. Since entering the field of nursing, have you been treated differently by your boss or by coworkers?

I would like to make one more point about lifting...

Bigger people are frequently called on to help, whether they are men or women, as "big" is often equated with "strong".

Nurses who are "fluffy" like me are often asked to help with lifting. And as for myself, I may be larger now but I am much less stronger than when I was thin and fit.

Specializes in LDRP; Education.
Quote
Originally posted by nurs4kids

So, Kevin, I guess respectfully..No, that does not meet my criteria. This post says there is "sexism in nursing (from a male perspective)". THAT is what I want to hear. Since entering the field of nursing, have you been treated differently by your boss or by coworkers?

I agree here Kevin. Throughout this thread, we have been told that sexism here has absolutely nothing to do with how society views things, patient care choices, choices made with regard to capabilities, but that is a nursing issue. Not a social one, but a NURSING one; a nursing problem independent of any other social concern. Much like mandatory overtime and short staffing is a NURSING issue, we've been informed here that sexism is a NURSING issue. It is this evidence that I am looking for, otherwise, to pin sexism as a nursing issue or problem that needs addressing is somewhat inaccurate.

Lets see...hmmmm if as a male a female does not want me to cath her or take care of her...hell so be it...one less thing for me to do. Just find the charge nurse and let them worry about it. Just my two cents. Sexism is going to exist no matter what....get over it and get on with your life....racism should not exist and that should be stamped out completely and should not be tolerated. As men we went into this field knowing that women are the majority. I cannot even remember what it is like to have a male supervisor...does it bother me? HELL NO!! SO people just let this thread die a natural horrible death....

Dave

I tend to agree that a certain amount of sexism exists in OB in particular, because som male posters have actually been denied jobs because they are male. Clearly fits with the definition of sexism by nurses and shouldn't be ignored.

The larger question for me though, is does sexim in nursing cause damage to male nurses from a career pov? Despite all the negative aspects of being a male nurse, I have read that male nurses are promoted faster (over women with similar qualifications) and tend to get into leadership positions, so tend to make more money, etc. This seems to be a trend among males in general.

Did any of you see the 48 hours report about how boys are being left behind in schools? Girls are far better educated and prepared for college. In fact, many Ivy league schools have to practice affirmative action for men to maintain a somewhat even student body. The man responsible fo this research noted there was no public outcry to improve teaching to boys like there was for girls a few years back. Why? Because despite this, men go into the world, get better jobs and make more money. Is this like nursing?

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