Seasoned nurses eat their young?! - page 5
I am a nursing student, who by the way will graduate in December, and am sick of being eaten alive every time my clinical group hits a new floor. I don't understand how so many hateful people have... Read More
Aug 9, '03Originally posted by study4nursing
In order to ensure the best level of care possible, the staff nurse should be open to questions and be willing to give input to the student.
Yes, to a point, but as mentioned, the INSTRUCTOR should be your primary teacher. The nurse may not have the time, and her priorities may be different than yours.
Example. I had a patient with a history of CVA's who had been immobile for a extended period of time. The patient was complaining of lower extremity pain, crying out in pain if her calves were touched. Her feet were also cool to the touch. When I reported these findings to the nurse, she smiled politely at me and went on with what she was doing. She hadn't done a head to toe assessment when she started the shift, and she didn't come to check the patients legs during the rest of my shift. Hello? What am I missing here? The patient was gone the next time that I worked on the floor, and I didn't know who to ask about her progress. I pray that she was alright. I did tell my instructor about the incidence during post conference, and she just talked about how we were new on the floor and had to earn the nurse's trust. TRUST, I'm talking about standard of care here!
Your patients will thank you for it
I see the generalizing and judgments start early...in nursing school. I (like most older nurses) just try after 27 yrs to get through my short staffed shift and do my best, in a workplace that increasingly asks me to do more with less. I deserve a little respect from students. We ALL do. And yes, it goes both ways. But, if a student comes on my unit and expect me to immediately prioritize with THEIR needs amongst the chaos, and judges me as a bad nurse if I don't, they may get a smile and no comment from me too. Maybe worse.
Regarding a student going to to an instructor talking about a seasoned nurse she/he thinks is' bad?' Hmm. Such impudence from a 'baby' nurse. When I was a student (in the stone age) this was NOT tolerated. Can we talk about students trying to eat the seasoned nurses here??? <sigh>
But I'm an old cranky nurse...part of the problem I guess...I know nothing.
PS: I agree with SJoe...this entitlement has gotten out of control, and I predict students with attitude WILL encounter problems in their clinicals...no doubt.
Aug 9, '03Well mattsmom a nursing student is supposed to discuss what they see on the floors with their instructor. So I don't know what you mean by that wouldn't be tolerated when you were a student. I was a student not too long ago and after each clinical day we would talk as a group about our day and our observations. A clinical instructor is their to educate the students about what may or may not be going on based on their experience. But from this students assessment maybe the nurse should have looked at the patients legs. And as far as you knowing nothing this may not be true but you sure show ignorance and a lack of respect for people in general by attacking this student.
As for students. Just suck it up is my advice. I hated clinicals and I really disliked a lot of the nurses I had to deal with during clinicals. But nursing schools is not that long and if you can suffer through it then you can chose who you want to work with when you graduate. You will find bad nurses no matter where you go but you find that in any job too. Find the ones you enjoy working with and stick with them. You will also find that 2nd and 3rd shift nurses aren't as high strung and are easier to work with, IMO. That's why I volunteered to do evening and night clinicals in nursing school.
Aug 9, '03When I was in nursing school, the students didn't go to the patient's primary nurse, we went to our instructor. It was our chain of command. This avoided experienced nurses feeling criticized, so to speak, by the students. If our instructor felt there was something to our observation, then she would talk to the nurse. It avoided a lot of conflict - and I can not really think of any bad experiences with experienced nurses while in school. Guess I was lucky. But we do all know that there are some pretty crabby nurses out there - and some pretty aggressive students too. And when those two get together, look out...
Aug 9, '03It is very interesting to read the different perspectives here. I agree that some students do have the "sense of entitlement" attitude, but most do not. Most enter the floor with fear and trepidition. Most sincerely want to learn and make their patient's day brighter. I have not been an instructor long, but I have seen a wide range of clinical experiences. Most clinical sites have been very hospitable. One, in particular, rolled the red carpet out for us and could not have been better. On the other hand one floor was a floor from and several of the nurses were HORRIBLE to the students. One cursed at one of my students, another tried to pin a med-error on another (the student was without fault). Another tried to blame the student for a patient incidence (again, the student was without fault). Trying to conduct a clinical on that floor was like having a clinical in a snake pit It was awful. I will quit before I return there. Thank God, that was only one site out of many.
Aug 9, '03CougRN, I have zero ignorance on being a practicing nurse. A student, however, does.
My posts are MY opinions, and are not attacks. Please refrain from calling people ignorant. I would say THAT is an attack.
This thread is discussing why students feel eaten. The post I responded to was a clear example of why some nurses are not warmly inviting to students.
We ALL have a responsibility to live by the Golden Rule..nurses and students alike.
Perhaps this practice of students' being allowed to critique staff nurses sets everyone up for the catty backstabbing behavior we encounter today. When I was in school instructors were quick to STOP this behavior in the aggressive student. I'm amazed it is condoned now.
I taught for a short time. I avoided criticizing a fellow practicing nurse (how unprofessional) I WOULD say to my students 'there are lots of ways to accomplish a task, and shortcuts you will learn later...but for now THIS is how I want you to proceed and why.'
The dysfunction in our profession appalls me sometimes.
Aug 9, '03I don't even know where to begin... It's true that nursing is full of this horizontal violence and it benefits the management of any given organization because if the nurses are busy fighting amongst themselves, then they can't organize and initiate change. This is even true in a union facility.
Example: I'm new to a unit, but been in the same hospital for 2 years. The other day, I arrived half an hour early and the charge nurse said "Can you start early?" I said sure and did. She told me I could home early. I work in the PACU. Not only did I not get to go home early (i got the last pt), but everyone else did. They all walked out at 11 (our shift ends at 11:30). Typical. Let me add that none of them signed out early. They barely know me, they totally dis' me and then have the nerve to walk out and not sign out early. I could be anybody -- like the son of the CFO or something...
Example 2: A veteran nurse on the unit sits and reads the newspaper with back to me while I get an admit. Most blatant example of how unhelpful people can be on the unit. I was sure to be at this nurses bedside eveytime they got an admission. Kill them with kindness!
The unit is full of new nurses and travellers and this is how we are welcomed. Having worked in another area of the hospital, I can say that it isn't just the PACU nurses that behave this way. It amazes me!Last edit by ANnot4me on Aug 9, '03
Aug 18, '03Whew! I just had to reply to this discussion because it brought back such memories....good and bad!! Nurses have been on both sides, from being a nursing student to a seasoned RN who is trying to balance a busy floor plus help train and supervise the new nursing students. I so agree w/ PJ on the idea of "killing them w/ kindness". Believe me, the "mean" nurses will remember you long after your clinicals, and if you decide to work there after graduation; they will be your "allies" when you are working. It is hard to take the "hatefulness" of some floor nurses; but, hang in there Cyndi! I always treated the students very well, and taught them what I could. I do know that it is sooo much harder now that nursing schools have cut down the "clinical" hours on the floors. Nursing students lose so much valuable clinical time to learn hands on nursing. After graduation; the new RN is thrown out to learn all of this on a floor as a "preceptor period". I know the reality of both sides. I am just glad that I went to a diploma school where I received book learning and good clinical teaching. I thinkare doing a disservice to new nursing students.
Aug 18, '03It's soooo unfortunate that your feeling that nurses eat their young. I felt the same way when I started my job, and don't have any idea how that phrase came into exsistence, but there has to be some truth in that statement, for many people experience it!
My only advise: You CAN'T change the people around you, and you CAN'T change some of your circumstances, but you CAN change YOU, and you CAN change how you RESPOND to those circumstances, THAT, is key!!!
So, just do your best, and know that, "and this too shall pass."
Best of luck to you, keep going forward, and be the best nurse YOU can be to someone else, K?
Aug 18, '03I also experienced this kind of behavior, I would like to say I made it a point to NEVER treat another like this. Having an RN degree just not give a person a license to be a jerk. I have seen new grads pick up this attitude too! SO I would think it is a factor of self esteem more than anything. I agree it is a sad thing.
Aug 19, '03Seasoned nurses eat their young?!
or is it
Nurses eat their young seasoned. Please pass the pepper.
Aug 20, '03In nursing school I encountered a couple nasties. But the 3 nurses who stick in my memory are the ones who were so good and professional. I remember their names and they exhibited the attitude and abilities that I wanted to emulate as a nurse.
So go with the flow kid. Here's to hoping that your next experiences on the floor will be more positive. Good luck in school and in your future career.
Aug 20, '03try to assesed yourself maybe more, maybe your are just reacting a little too pesky.Some nurses during discharges of their duties really are too much indulged on how they give out their best to perform their load. And making it sure for themselves that they wont be making any mistakes or failure that makes them subject for such scrutiny or negative feedback from the next shifting nurse staff.
what you have to do is be very observant on them on how they perform their functions. Make sure you are writing them down correctly and try to reason them out with the correct rationale as a basis for the right actions. get help from the book. and when the rightful turn comes for you. I am sure you maybe a lot better than them. Be good.