Nurses: Delighted or Annoyed by Nursing Students?

[AthensICURN]

In the hospitals where I have done clinicals thus far, I feel like some of the nurses hate the nursing students and others are delighted to see the students. I was wondering what the general concensus is about helping nursing students out by having them tag along. Do you get annoyed or do you find that they are helpful? Sometimes, I feel like everyone hates the students because it is extra work for them.

Also, what is the point of getting a BSN instead of a ADN if you do not plan to move up from being a floor nurse?

Thanks for taking the time to read this and responding. It is very appreciated.

[Kelly_the_Great]

And HIPAA is still a consideration, no matter how we feel about the students' motives. QUOTE]

:yeahthat: too!

[Corvette Guy]

Last year, one of our assignments was to call our assigned clinical preceptor prior to performing clinicals on the floor & ask what the top 5 medical dx. were for the floor & also what were the 10 (I think - might've only been 5) meds. rx. Then we had to complete a small report of each of these.

I could tell when I called my preceptor it was a busy time, so I offered to call back and fortunately I knew this nurse from previously working with her as a fellow so it was all fine. But I can certainly see how, even in this instance, when you're busy taking care of patients, you're busy! Let alone if you were callin' requesting a detailed H&P w/tx. plan, etc.

The info. (dx. & meds) was helpful knowledge for the students preparing for clinical rotation. However, a better alternative might have been for us to meet with the unit managers of each assigned clinical unit and gotten this info. from her/him @ a convenient time for the manager. I could see how getting phone calls with no prior heads-up from the instructors that they were coming (the questions) could set-up the beginnings of a break down in communication between both the student & preceptor.

IMHO, your instructors were way out of line in regard to an assignment that has students calling the hospital for info. When I was a nursing student we had to physically go to the floor & read ahead of time [before the clinical day] the patient's chart.

[kadokin, ASN, RN]

I'm not so sure you were doing her homework for her; it sounds like she just wanted the bare facts, like vitals, etc ~ the homework is her interpretation of, or careplanning around, that data. Her copying down the data whether she's looking at it or getting it over the phone isn't requiring anything other than time and the ability to read and write.

Who knows why she asked? Perhaps she had a 45-60 minute commute to the hospital just to copy down statistics. Perhaps she couldn't arrive at the hospital at o-dark-hundred to get the data before clinical because of childcare issues. Perhaps she had a dying father.

Or perhaps she was lazy. At any rate, she was creative and assertive. Good qualities in a nurse-to-be imo.

Yes, she was lazy. She had about a 15 minute commute, no kids, and no dying father. She pretty much told me she "just didn't want to come in". Myself, as a nursing student, had any where from a 30 to 45 minute commute and 2 small children that I had to arrange childcare for. Many's the night I would have loved to have been at home w/them at o-dark-hundred, but had to be at the hospital, meeting my pt and gathering data for the next day.

[kadokin, ASN, RN]

I'm not going to defend the student who called. We had to go in. Maybe he/she did go in and just wanted an update, but it did take balls to do that and I wouldn't have given him/her a bit of information over the phone.

However, in the real world do we not rely on each other as part of the gathering of data. We aren't completely on our own. I personally rely on shift change report, report from the charge nurse, report from case managers/discharge planners, doctors, all sorts of people to give me information.

Part of learning to be a nurse is collaboration with peers. If we as staff nurses shoot them down, that's not good either is it?

She was supposed to come in, too. As I stated earlier, I enjoy teaching students and give them a lot of info and tips when they are on the floor. I didn't aim to shoot this girl down, but I wasn't going to do her work for her, either.

[kadokin, ASN, RN]

Physically going to the unit and copying down a list of medications is not a learning process.

Looking up the medications and figuring out how they interact with one another or the patient's condition IS.

HIPAA considerations yes should be accounted for, naturally.

I am not saying I would advocate my students to do this; I am saying that I don't necessarily find this as doing the student's homework for her. The homework is the actual work and thinking, not copying down words.

I beg to differ. Part of what a student learns from gathering data before actual clinical time is the process of gathering the data. You can't learn how a chart is set up or where in the chart to look for information if you "phone it in". I didn't savor those late nights away from my family, but I did learn a lot. This was many years ago and HIPPA wasn't an issue.

[SmilingBluEyes]

I beg to differ. Part of what a student learns from gathering data before actual clinical time is the process of gathering the data. You can't learn how a chart is set up or where in the chart to look for information if you "phone it in". I didn't savor those late nights away from my family, but I did learn a lot. This was many years ago and HIPPA wasn't an issue.

thank you....also.... I can't admire laziness; to me this certainly was not resourceful or clever, just plain lazy.

[kadokin, ASN, RN]

Nah, it was worth a shot on the part of the student. Depending on how desperate my situation was, I might have attempted the same thing.

Part of what irks me about education, especially in the medical field, is the whole "pay yer dues" mentality (not saying you have that). What's more important ~ that the student drive to, walk to, or wake up early for the needed information, or gets the needed information, interprets it correctly and provides excellent patient care?

I'm sure I'm in the minority, but that's okay. :)

It's not just the medical field, my friend. Name one profession where newbies DON'T have to "pay their dues". I sincerely believe you learn a lot (if you are interested in learning at all) by doing the scut work, leg work, dirty work, busy work. It's all part of the process, and beneficial to the learner if they are paying attention. I do believe there are experienced nurses who are deliberately harsh to students/newbies. I am not one of them. I also, however, believe there are students/newbies who tend to whine and complain when things get uncomfortable/inconvenient or their instructors/preceptors expect them to actually EARN their grades or who think they are being slighted if they have a personality conflict w/their instructors/preceptors and complain that they are being "mean". It seems mostly the younger ones that have these difficulties. I see these sorts of things and a general lack of work ethic in a lot of young people today. Not just nurses. This is getting too long. Maybe I am old fuddy-duddy and I hope these young people gain some understanding as they mature, but really, how many of you over the age of 35 actually expect to get something for nothing or to get along swimmingly w/everyone around you, especially your superiors (i.e.-instructors, supervisors). Oops, I just thought of something, I know a few people over 35 who display some of these characteristics. Oh well, I should stop.

[geekgolightly, BSN, RN]

:chuckle No reason to get upset. I just thought it was odd you put such an emphasis on she the nurse, rather than just write the nurse.

Have a nice day. :)

I guess I find it odd that you insist on nursing being gender neutral when in every other area of life it is the "he" which is the preferred gender in speech.

You have a nice day too!

[Corvette Guy]

thank you....also.... I can't admire laziness; to me this certainly was not resourceful or clever, just plain lazy.

:yeahthat:

[Corvette Guy]

I guess I find it odd that you insist on nursing being gender neutral when in every other area of life it is the "he" which is the preferred gender in speech.

You have a nice day too!

IMHO, when gramatically appropriate gender neutral reference should be used all areas of life. I'm in favor of equal opportunity/equal reference in all walks of life.

:flowersfo or :beer: ... your preference.

:)

[Q.]

It's not just the medical field, my friend. Name one profession where newbies DON'T have to "pay their dues".

I never said it was limited to the medical field, nor was I talking about a new job in a profession. I was talking about education and just mentioned in particular the medical field. As an educator, I don't feel that the "pay your dues" mentality should exist in education.

As to your comments about copying down data as a learning experience (i.e. sifting through a chart) I still don't find that valuable or consider it "homework." If the student becomes familiar enough with YOUR charting system enough to function for 15 weeks, that is all (s)he needs. At the next clinical experience, the charting could be completely different or even be an EMR. I highly doubt the objective for clinical is to be able to look for the "Labs" tab in a chart and copy down the information.

The real work is the interpretation and application of the information copied down, which is NOT what the staff nurse did for the student in the least. That is my point.

[kadokin, ASN, RN]

I never said it was limited to the medical field, nor was I talking about a new job in a profession. I was talking about education and just mentioned in particular the medical field. As an educator, I don't feel that the "pay your dues" mentality should exist in education.

As to your comments about copying down data as a learning experience (i.e. sifting through a chart) I still don't find that valuable or consider it "homework." If the student becomes familiar enough with YOUR charting system enough to function for 15 weeks, that is all (s)he needs. At the next clinical experience, the charting could be completely different or even be an EMR. I highly doubt the objective for clinical is to be able to look for the "Labs" tab in a chart and copy down the information.

The real work is the interpretation and application of the information copied down, which is NOT what the staff nurse did for the student in the least. That is my point.

OK. Just so you know, I didn't originally use the phrase, "pay your dues", just quoted it from another post, maybe yours, I don't remember. My point was, EVERYTHING can be a learning experience for someone who is wanting to learn. I guess I am equating learning w/education. Not EXACTLY the same thing though. Sorry, I stand corrected. But I also stand by my decision to let the student in question do her own legwork.