Just wondering, down under.

fergus51 · Apr 1, 2002

It depends on where you go. Some states do use LPNs (Liscenced practical nurses) in this capacity, other LPNs have a more expanded role, others have a more limited role.

mattsmom81 · Apr 1, 2002

Also might be the equivalent of what we call a PCA (patient care assistant) who can do basic dressings, venipuncture, foleys, NG tubes, vitals (duties vary per facility policyalso) but cannot administer medication or plan care. They are not licensed here in the US, but function under the nurses' license: which is a source of contention for nurses here---- hospitals are utilizing them to save money and the nurse is liable.

Our LPN's are licensed to practice nursing but function in roles designated by different states and facility policy, as Fergus noted. Individual states dictate the limits and facilities can further restrict if they choose. Some have few limits ie can't be in charge, but may do anything else if trained and competent. Others restrict LPN's practice greatly and this has been difficult for many LPN's to have their nursing practice limited so severely.

If you've been reading our posts, there are lots of 'levels' in our nursing profession and this is quite a source of contention and divisiveness in the US! LOL! Do you see this in Australia?

I enjoy hearing from nurses in other countries...hope you post often Aime! :)

Home Health Columnist / Guide · Apr 1, 2002

This site lists a good explanation--compares US to Nursing in England.

Understanding current nursing education in the USA.:

http://www.fulbright.co.uk/eas/subjects/nursing.html

Aime · Apr 2, 2002

Thanks to Fergus 51, Mattsmom 81, and NRSKarenRN for your replys. It appears you don't have an equivilent to our Div 2's, but I was blown away by what you PCA's can do. A Div 2 in Aus is higher up the tree than a PCA, and yet they can ( at the moment ) administer certain meds, whilst we can't even offer an asprin, but that's about to change with a new course next year.

I'm not the only one who often checks out Allnurses, and a lot of the problems I see in your threads are unfortunately common in Aus too. Div 1's putting down Div 2's, full timer nurses spitting on agency nurses, hospital trained versus university trained...and on it goes. Love your site, love all you nurses worldwide. Thanks again.

Tookie · Apr 2, 2002

Hi there Aime

I was interested in your question as l am/was trying to work out the differences as well

Explanations above are good as is the question from Mattsmom81 -

'If you've been reading our posts, there are lots of 'levels' in our nursing profession and this is quite a source of contention and divisiveness in the US! LOL! Do you see this in Australia?'

I dont beleive that there is as much friction, we dont have the variables that occur with 50 states. Health care is federally funded here and regulated.

Our state boards have in general, similar standards and levels of education etc so it is fairly easy to register and work from one state to another - However we cannot work in a state (Div 1 and Div 2) unless we are registered there.

There can be a bit of pettiness between the acute sector and aged care section at times however l feel that is improving (that is another thread)

We havent got the differing levels (from reading posts, that you have over there) Our major levels are - the RN level,(Div 1) EN level (Div 2 ) and then Cert 3 (often referred to assistant in nursing or personal care worker) - In the acute sectors the RN's will specilise as do some EN's in different areas - In aged care we have RN's EN's and cert 3 we too specilise in this area -

We also have the uni degrees etc for post gradute studies and the TAFE sector updates and ongoing education.

Yes there can be horiziontal violence, pettiness and the usual grizzling that exists in any workplace and the ever ongoing question of new graduates Vs older style training (Like l did - the hospital training) but l dont belive that the heat in the discussions that seem to exist over there is as prevelent here - I stand to be corrrected by others who may read this post.

Of course there are resignations and people who get disatisfied because of burnout, stress and insufficent numbers of staffing levels - particularly in the aged care sector. (My area is aged care)

I think that we have some good nursing organistions that work together that are fairly effective at trying to improve our lot.

Just a thought here - unless we value ourselves and each other for what we each contribute to nursing, in what ever area we work we will never be fully valued by the general public and therefore the people who employ us.

I would be interested if other Australian nurses or any others who may have worked over here, who contribute to this BB think if we do have good relations with each other.

Hope l havent gone of on a tangent too much

Regards and good luck with your studies Aime,

Tookie

mattsmom81 · Apr 2, 2002

Interesting comments, Aime and Tookie! Australia is so interesting to me and hopefully some day I can afford to visit your lovely continent! :)

Best wishes!

danny · Apr 2, 2002

American and Australian nurses!!!

I think you are very lucky to be able to work in America and in Australia (my mother country). I was born in Australia and came to Europe 30 years ago!! I did nursing school in Italy, and I would just love to be working as a nurse down under!! I remember visiting hospitals as a child, and having so much respect for those "wonderful girls in their lovely uniforms" (are they still called sisters?)...It was then I decided to go for nursing, and here I am today, on the opposite side of the world. I have been working in the ICU for the past 15 years, and who ever knows...might visit my homeland in the future..!

I love you all! Please keep writing, because I will surely keep reading...CIAO CIAO (Italian for..BYE BYE)!

Aime · Apr 3, 2002

Glad you like our sunburnt country Mattsmom 81, and by all means, come on down. You'd be made very welcome. Same for you Danny, but you'll find that a few things have changed in the last 30 years. Nurses don't wear those formal white uniforms all that much these days. Navy blue pants or skirt, and a white shirt if you're a Div 1, blue/white flecked shirt for Div 2's. Personally, I kind of liked the old white uniforms, but times change.

danny · Apr 3, 2002

Aime, I suppose there are many other things besides nurses' uniforms that have changed in Australia in the past 30 years..?! Maybe deep inside that's the very reason that stops me coming back to visit my homeland...just too scared to come and find that all has changed. By the way, what does Div1 or Div2 mean?

Aime · Apr 4, 2002

Danny, yes things in Aussi land have changed a heck of a lot in the last 30 years, but it's not that scary. As soon as I get some money together, I intend to come to the states to visit friends, but they'll never convince me to stay. The Government is squeezing every cent it can from the workers and giving nothing in return, and we do have a little street crime now and then, but we also still have welfare for all who need it for as long as they need it, and every single person is covered by an excellent medical system, although the waiting lists are nothing to write home about, but anyone can access urgent medical treatment, so I believe I'm still living in the 'lucky' country. Trust me !!! It's not that bad. As for the Div 1 and 2 thing, a division 1 nurse does two more years of schooling than a division 2, ( called an enroled nurse in some states ) Div 1's are higher up the tree than us and are able to give most types of meds and venipunture. They do a lot more administrative stuff, and of course, are also paid more. Next year, Div 2's will be able to do a course which will enable us to administer all drugs ( except drugs of addiction ) and do venipunture, which will put us in a more employable position. It was in an attempt to find out if there was a U.S. equivalent to Div. 2's that saw me post my original thread. It appears there isn't. So Danny, don't be scared, and come on down.