I had some trouble with a CNA...should I talk to the manager?

Nurses General Nursing

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At the hospital I work at, everyone on the nursing staff is on probation for the first 90 days of employment. Then, there are peer evaluations done by the RNs. If the employee shows that they work hard and do well, then they'll be considered permanent employees after 90 days. If they perform poorly, they'll be given another 45 days of probation to "shape up or ship out". Then it's either permanent employment or dismissal.

I work with a CNA, hired for a different ward, but who floats over to ours occasionally, who recieved a lackluster evaluation after her first 90 days of employment. She's currently going through her 45 days. I became aware of all this when a nurse from this CNA's home ward asked me how she was doing over my ward, I gave her a briefing on her performance. She thanked me, saying that the nurses have to finish up the peer evaluations on her and any input is helpful.

Not too long ago, when the CNA worked with us, I brought some photos of a party that the people on our unit had a month or so ago. The CNA came up behind me to look at the pictures and said, "I'd like to look, because I didn't go to the party." At that point, I said, sarcastically, "Oh, well, that's because you weren't invited." Then I started chuckling a little bit, turned away from her, back to look at the pictures and said, "Oh, I'm just kidding, everyone in the hospital was welcome to-OW! Did you just punch me?!" After I turned back to look at the pictures again, she had decided to hit me on my back with her fist, right over my scapula. I said, "Why did you do that? Please don't hit me. That really, really hurt. It's always been a little sore since hurting it playing sports in high school" At that point she said, "Oh, I didn't know you had a bad shoulder" and apologized.

Now, yes, I admit, I probably shouldn't have been sarcastic. But, I know that right before she hit me, I was telling her that I was joking around and that she was welcome to go. I believe that she knew I was kidding around with her, and she just thought it would be funny to hit me for some reason. But isn't making jokes to someone, like I did, a little less offensive than hitting someone, like she did to me? It may just be the way I think, but I was raised to understand that there is no reason and no good excuse to hit anyone, and that there's certainly no reason to just sit there and take it. Having this mindset about people hitting others makes me feel like it's necessary for me to go to my manager, and tell her about the incident.

But, I don't know if I should. I understand she's had her probabtion extended for not performing well, so going to the manager with this could play a big part in her being fired. Part of me thinks that I'm partly at fault, because of my sarcasm right before her hitting me. The other part stands by the thought that she really had no right to hit me, and that the way she reacted was completely out of line. I do know that if I was the manager, I'd want to hear about someone who's working on my unit who reacts in such a way. I guess what I'm requesting from all of you who read through this long post is if I should just go to the manager and tell her what happened or, just leave it be since the CNA is aware that I won't tolerate being hit anymore, and not say anything at all.

Now, I'm just flabbergasted because I never thought, being a nurse working in a hospital with other health-care professionals, that I'd feel the need to write a post to request opinions and advice about a co-worker smacking me. The entire situation makes me feel like I'm in middle school all over again.

Specializes in Obstetrics, M/S, Psych.
This CNA didn't respond to an admittedly cruel remark by insulting the nurse. She didn't call her a b*tch or tell her off. SHE HIT HER WITH A CLOSED FIST HARD ENOUGH TO HURT FOR DAYS. If that isn't workplace violence, then how do you define it?

Just to clarify...the CNA hit her on a spot that was already chronically sore and she did not realize that was so. Sounded to me like if that weren't the case there would be no issue with pain. I am admittedly sensitive to this nurses dramatic response. Sure, workplace violence needs to be addressed, but we need to have a balance, as well. Abuse of power is just as bad. If you are rude and mean and someone retaliates, deal with it with some grace; talk it out. This was blown way out of proportion, IMO. There are too many victims in the world today. Changes were due, as is often the case when bad situations are allowed to spin out of control and reach a critical point where change is needed, but now I am just waiting for the pendulum to swing back just a little to the point of common sense.

Specializes in 5 yrs OR, ASU Pre-Op 2 yr. ER.

Whether it hurt or not, she hit someone. By most facilities' definition, that IS violence.

Whether it hurt or not, she hit someone. By most facilities' definition, that IS violence.

I truly believe that hitting is wrong, but don't forget that we are hearing from ONE side of the story-maybe the CNA would say "I didn't mean to; I was just goofing off" And let's not forget the very welcoming behavior of the OP "The CNA came up behind me to look at the pictures and said, "I'd like to look, because I didn't go to the party." At that point, I said, sarcastically, "Oh, well, that's because you weren't invited." Then I started chuckling a little bit, turned away from her," Wow, how humiliating for the CNA. Sounds like a bit of "I'm in and you're not" kind of behavior. To those of you rushing to cry "assault!" - do you REALLy think that this CNA should be charged with a criminal offense when you surely only have 50% of the facts? (grab your pitchforks and torches!)

Specializes in 5 yrs OR, ASU Pre-Op 2 yr. ER.
I truly believe that hitting is wrong, but don't forget that we are hearing from ONE side of the story-maybe the CNA would say "I didn't mean to; I was just goofing off"

I'm well aware we're hearing one side of the story, and i commented on what's presented.

The "welcoming behavior" is not an invition for a slap, no matter how tempting it is.

I am not defending the nurse's words or attitude, either.

Strangely enough I have had something of this same sort happen to me. We have a tech who is well "unmotivated". I ask her to do things such as daily weights and placing compression boots on pts at the beginning of the shift and she will pop off with " I already know, I will get to it". By the end of shift guess who is putting those pumps on and checking the weights, me. I have tried to joke around with her about those things without hurting her feelings and just being sarcastic. It doesn't work. She has pulled my hair numerous times and once got me in a headlock. She is young and is a rough houser to say the least. My breaking point was about 5 am one morning and I requested something simple. She stated "my head hurts" I said "if I had a head like that it would hurt too". Before I knew it she had smacked the fire out of my upper arm, open handed. Before I could say anything, she smacked me again in the same place. Trying to not start a scene I said " Do not hit me again, that hurt like hell". She replied "no it didn't you big baby". I had to go get an IV out of the fridge and place on my arm to help with the pain and the whelps that she had left. I personally do not know what to do about this girl. She sits at the computer most of the shift writing depressing poetry about relationships gone bad. I think this chick has some serious issues and am not really sure if she is safe around pt. I think that even if I said something she may be verbally reprimanded and that she would never help me again, things would get worse. I am a new nurse and have only been working 6 months and need to gain some respect but how?

:no: I believe that words hurt as much as or more than being hit....you were beating her with words. Hitting, punching is so so wrong too.

:typing Angelsarch

this all sounds childish to me. let's face it, CNAs and other lowly jobs (i am a CNA, so i can say that) are people who have not had the opportunities that other people with more socio-economic class have had. therefore their social skills are not the greatest. and it shows. of course, sometimes they are just young, but that comes with poor social skills--- usually--too. i don't think you should say anything to anyone. except maybe the CNA involved, if it bothers you that much.

Specializes in Infection Preventionist/ Occ Health.

In my opinion this is a potential patient safety issue, and I am surprised that more people haven't identified it as such.

If the CNA does not have enough self control to keep her hands to herself when her feelings are hurt, who's to say she will not become violent with a rude/combative patient? She should be reported to the manager, and if she gets fired it is nobody's fault except her own.

That being said, the OP should not have made that comment. Creating a positive work environment is everyone's responsibility.

Specializes in Infection Preventionist/ Occ Health.
Strangely enough I have had something of this same sort happen to me. We have a tech who is well "unmotivated". I ask her to do things such as daily weights and placing compression boots on pts at the beginning of the shift and she will pop off with " I already know, I will get to it". By the end of shift guess who is putting those pumps on and checking the weights, me. I have tried to joke around with her about those things without hurting her feelings and just being sarcastic. It doesn't work. She has pulled my hair numerous times and once got me in a headlock. She is young and is a rough houser to say the least. My breaking point was about 5 am one morning and I requested something simple. She stated "my head hurts" I said "if I had a head like that it would hurt too". Before I knew it she had smacked the fire out of my upper arm, open handed. Before I could say anything, she smacked me again in the same place. Trying to not start a scene I said " Do not hit me again, that hurt like hell". She replied "no it didn't you big baby". I had to go get an IV out of the fridge and place on my arm to help with the pain and the whelps that she had left. I personally do not know what to do about this girl. She sits at the computer most of the shift writing depressing poetry about relationships gone bad. I think this chick has some serious issues and am not really sure if she is safe around pt. I think that even if I said something she may be verbally reprimanded and that she would never help me again, things would get worse. I am a new nurse and have only been working 6 months and need to gain some respect but how?

This is assault and at the very least needs to be documented and reported to your supervisor. If the situation gets out of hand, you can file a police report. Do you have any witnesses? The only way to gain respect is to stand up for yourself and stop tolerating this abuse. You will be looking out for yourself as well as your patients. Good luck to you.

Specializes in med/surg, telemetry, IV therapy, mgmt.
We have a tech. . .Before I knew it she had smacked the fire out of my upper arm, open handed. Before I could say anything, she smacked me again in the same place. Trying to not start a scene I said " Do not hit me again, that hurt like hell". She replied "no it didn't you big baby". . .I personally do not know what to do about this girl. She sits at the computer most of the shift writing depressing poetry about relationships gone bad. . .am not really sure if she is safe around pt. I think that even if I said something she may be verbally reprimanded and that she would never help me again, things would get worse. I am a new nurse and have only been working 6 months and need to gain some respect but how?

Well, you certainly don't get respect by letting people beat you up! I am curious as to why you seem to be acting as if this is something you should endure? Here is what you do about this girl. Sit down today and write up the incidents where she has hit you giving as specific dates as you can. Don't be very concerned with anything you might have said to her that you think instigated her hitting you. Her rights ended where your upper arm began, no matter what you might have said to her. Then, you go in to your manager with this letter in your hand (keep a copy for yourself), sit down and have a pow-wow with her about this girl. Be prepared to answer why you didn't report this before. You do have to explain that, so at least be honest and tell her about your fears of reporting her. Your safety is at stake. If your manager doesn't do anything then you tell her you are going up the chain of command to her manager. You manager has a duty to make sure your workplace is safe. If something isn't done about this girl, you have to keep writing her up and reporting her every time she hits you or refuses to do what you have asked her to do (that's insubordination). Your manager and supervisor are there to help solve these kinds of problems--they can't know about them if you don't say anything!

I would also let the manager know about her fooling around on the computer--that's a big problem in today's workplaces. I would let your shift manager know what this girl is doing as well. If the supervisor makes an unscheduled visit to the floor and finds this girl on the computer, she can address it right then and there.

Please help yourself out here before you or a patient are seriously injured. If she is hitting you, someone she knows and works with, what do you think she's doing to patients she doesn't know from adam?

I'm well aware we're hearing one side of the story, and i commented on what's presented.

The "welcoming behavior" is not an invition for a slap, no matter how tempting it is.

I am not defending the nurse's words or attitude, either.

I totally agree. Although certainly there are situations where you might think in your mind "thwap" you never actually do it- and if you do you face the consequences.

When I was a CNA (going through nursing school at the time) I had the reverse happen to me. We had a new charge nurse who had gotten her license 20 years prior and never worked as a nurse. She had kept up her CEUs and everything. Needless to say, she was WAY over her head at an acute care hospital. Anyhow, one of my jobs was to set up a room for a patient when the ER or OR was sending us someone. One morning, when she was totally overwhelmed (as usual), she came running over to me and said "We're getting a patient in 20 minutes! Set a room up now!" Well, we set the room up differently depending on the patient and I asked what kind of patient it was (so I would know if I needed to set up traction, O2, etc). She grabbed me by my upper arms, shook me, and yelled in my face "Just do it!!!" Needless to say, I was in the shift coordinator's office very quickly with a witness. The nurse almost got fired- in fact, I was told that if I was no longer comfortable working with her, SHE would be the one moved. She was also made to go through an additional 3 months probationary period.

Some things you just don't do. Grabbing, hitting, etc are very basic examples. Noone has the right to physically assault you regardless of what you say. I have had patients say very cruel things to me. What is this CNA goign to do when that happens? Just find a way to explain the bruises and/or skin tears??? I would not want to work with someone who had no impulse control. It isn't safe.

this all sounds childish to me. let's face it, CNAs and other lowly jobs (i am a CNA, so i can say that) are people who have not had the opportunities that other people with more socio-economic class have had. therefore their social skills are not the greatest. and it shows. of course, sometimes they are just young, but that comes with poor social skills--- usually--too. i don't think you should say anything to anyone. except maybe the CNA involved, if it bothers you that much.

I don't care if you are a CNA or not, this is a VERY offensive post. So we excuse assault because it's just a dumb ole CNA? Please. If you lack the impulse control and intelligence to refrain from hitting your supervisor, you don't need to work around people! The majority of the CNAs I work with are intelligent, warm, caring people. I have never even heard the "I'm just a CNA so I can't control myself" excuse before.

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