Are CNA's considered "Nurses"?

Nurses General Nursing

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I am a new nurse but was a CNA for 15 years before going to school. I was never referred to as a nurse when I was a CNA. I recently went to work in a Doc office where the CNA refers to herself as a Nurse and all of the office personelle refer to her as a nurse. She does everything that I do. I was suprised at this. I have since found that many Doc offices utilize CNA's as nurses. Is this a new thing? I don't want to sound caddy but it just kind of seems like my blood, sweat and tears I put into Nursing school was for nothing if a CNA can do my job. Please don't think this is a smack to CNA's because I have much respect for them as I was one myself for so many years. I would just like to hear some opinions.

Are CNAs nurses? No.

Are LPN's nurses? Yes

Do I look down on them? No

CNA's, NA, LPN....need to go by the way side....safe care comes from broadly "educated" and "trained" RN's and ARNP's. The time has come to eliminate so-called caregivers who's only training is how to do a BP, change a diaper, d/c an IV, and administer a limited amount of drugs. The times are a changin', and the need for poorly prepared wannabees is ending. What we need is to increase the standards, require that ALL health care providers take the same pre-reqs as a pre-med, pre-nursing, pre-PA...after the pre-reqs are met, one may choose the MD/DO route, nursing route, Paramedic route, PT route. This will place ALL on the same playing field, and eliminate further discussions about who is better prepared, better educated, better trained, etc. The only differences, in the end, may be compensation, but what you choose, after your pre-reqs, should not get in the way of having earned the respect and privilege of a well educated and trained health care provider.

"Go by the way side"? :confused: If we ALL were as educated as you, then who would do your dirty work? Do you want to change diapers and give bedbaths?

I have a problem with your quote "The times are changin', and the need for poorly prepared wannabees is ending". There is a need in health care for all of us. I am an LPN and I am a Nurse. I have a great deal of respect for those who have had the opportunity to obtain the BSN. If everyone had a BS degree, yes, we would all be educated. But that would not make you respected or a well trained health care provider. If you treat the people who work under you in the manner that you speak, you are probably not as respected as you might think.

I have been working as a CNA for the past 6 months while finishing my prerequisites for nursing school. I previously earned a BA in Multimedia 10 years ago. Many nurses have told me that working as a CNA is an invaluable experience when you become a nurse. As a side note, the CNA's are also treated with the respect they deserve. To completely smack down the role of a CNA is uncalled for and rude. I know many CNA's who are not only well educated, but valuable to the RN's about changing conditions of patients etc. To say that CNA's are wannabees is abhorrent. Many people who work as CNA's are forced to do so by retraining programs in their state. We also save time for nurses who are busy with meds and treatments (I work in LTC). Furthermore, many states are requiring individuals to be CNA's before starting nursing school. With the amount of people applying for nursing school who think it's a great job in theory, might work as a CNA and find that they are uncomfortable caring for patients. CNA's are also paid poorly for doing very difficult work. I can't tell you how many times daily I lift and transfer patients, and also take the time to hold someone's hand who is scared. Working as a CNA has made me realize how much I want to be a nurse, and I will treat CNA's with the same respect that I expect.

Specializes in CCU/CVU/ICU.

CNA's 'do' nursing at it's base level. They clean, bathe, feed, sooth, and attend to patients....the same way NURSES did throughout history.

In our modern world, however, nurses have evolved and become something quite different (due to technological revolutions, medical science, etc.). The role of say an icu nurse, ER nurse, Nurse anesthetist, etc.(for example) are all modern variants of nursing that would be alien to nurses 100 years ago.

The point i'm trying to make i guess is that a good 'CNA' would have been a good 'nurse' in Florence nightengale's time....but the nurses around Florence (including Florence herself) would require a great deal of re-training, re-education, and culture-shock if expected to 'step in' for one of us today. Modern nursing has an identity all it's own.

So..if you want to split hairs, No, a CNA is not a nurse..BUT, a CNA does the work that has it's roots set firmly in what nursing Is, was, and always will be.

CNA's 'do' nursing at it's base level. They clean, bathe, feed, sooth, and attend to patients....the same way NURSES did throughout history.

In our modern world, however, nurses have evolved and become something quite different (due to technological revolutions, medical science, etc.). The role of say an icu nurse, ER nurse, Nurse anesthetist, etc.(for example) are all modern variants of nursing that would be alien to nurses 100 years ago.

The point i'm trying to make i guess is that a good 'CNA' would have been a good 'nurse' in Florence nightengale's time....but the nurses around Florence (including Florence herself) would require a great deal of re-training, re-education, and culture-shock if expected to 'step in' for one of us today. Modern nursing has an identity all it's own.

So..if you want to split hairs, No, a CNA is not a nurse..BUT, a CNA does the work that has it's roots set firmly in what nursing Is, was, and always will be.

totally agree with you. and some nurses miss that aspect of spending quality time with thier patients and providing holistic care. nowadays the cna's are spending more time with the patients while we get to do paperwork

RNs, in general are taught in school that LPNs and CNAs are not good enough. Just becasue the LPN and CNA do not have degrees does not mean they are not quite capable of doiong the job they do.

Dixiedi, where are you getting this perception that ALL RN's have such a low opinion of LPN's and CNA's? Have you had bad experiences with RN's or something? I work with four awesome LPN's and have worked as a nurse tech (like a CNA) myself, and trust me, I know how valuable they are. :nurse:

Don't let a few bad eggs spoil your perception of all of us.

I am a new nurse but was a CNA for 15 years before going to school. I was never referred to as a nurse when I was a CNA. I recently went to work in a Doc office where the CNA refers to herself as a Nurse and all of the office personelle refer to her as a nurse. She does everything that I do. I was suprised at this. I have since found that many Doc offices utilize CNA's as nurses. Is this a new thing? I don't want to sound caddy but it just kind of seems like my blood, sweat and tears I put into Nursing school was for nothing if a CNA can do my job. Please don't think this is a smack to CNA's because I have much respect for them as I was one myself for so many years. I would just like to hear some opinions.

:angryfire I am now quick to point out to CNA's who claim that they are NURSES....that they are nursing ASSISTANTS...not nurses and it is fradulent to claim you are a nurse when you are not. I used to ignore these often common misconceptions. I too worked as a nursing assistant for many years before I became a nurse, but I never referred to myself as a nurse then. I realize that CNA's are very valuable...but I also realize that a CNA who acts as a nurse can be dangerous. There is a big difference between a CNA with a few months training and a nurse with a college degree and a license. I have a BSN and I believe that there should be more distinction between the various levels of nurses and nursing assistants. A CNA passing themselves off as a nurse or a doctor passing a CNA off as a nurse is very wrong. It's small acts like these that decreases our professional standing as nurses...and we shouldn't allow it anywhere.

Where do those RNs go to school?! We were most certainly NOT taught that CNAs and LVNs were not as good as we were!! Major generalizations like that can really get under folk's craws!! I value the members of my care team regardless of their educational level -- we all have important roles and if we do them well, we make a great team!! My level of respect tends to drop when someone (rn, lvn, aide, tech, transoirter, volunteer) gets a major chip on their shoulder and "cops a tude" -- being a hard working, ethical professional is what counts and knowing the differences in the LEGAL division of labor -- YOUR SCOPE of PRACTICE -- that's what we were taught!

Ya'll haven't been readin ghte posts in this forum (many threads on different topics.) The world is full of RNs that feel that way. If I did not say that it does not apply to all RNs, I stand corrected. I DO sometimes make generalizations and ASSUME (we all know about that!) folks will understand. My error.

I first worked in a Docs office as an MA, long before I started nursing school and I did injections, put in I.V.'s, monitored patients recieving infusions, allergy skin testing, H-pylori testing, lactose intolerance testing, drew blood,......etc. The list goes on and on. What I am getting at is that all though I did all of these nursing type skills, in no way was I a nurse. I corrected many patients, and the Physicians quite often. I think a big problem is the Physicians. They can hire an MA for $8.00 an hour and tell the patient, "Go have a seat and my NURSE will call you in to have your blood drawn"

I think the Docs need to be more educated. If I wasn't an honest person I would have went along with all the nurse calling that I got for the 4 years that I worked here. The scary thing is that I cannot now believe that I did some of the things that the Docs delegated to me. Sure I could do the "skill", but I had no idea why I was doing it, or the response that could happen from me doing it. It's almost like Doc's love to try and pass their MA's off as nurses to their patients, and all on less than half the salary as an RN. I think we should start calling Doc's PA's and see how they would like it.

I certainly did not mean to cause all of this controversy. I respect all areas of the nursing profession despite their level of education. One thing I have learned is that noone, not LPN or RN graduates, know it all. When I graduated as an LPN there were several new RN graduates working along side me. They didn't know anymore than I did and we learned together each day as we all still are. Infact, it was the graduate nurses who were previously CNA's who caught on the quickest. Forgive me for stirring up such stink and again I respect you all no matter what your level of education and I pray that each of you use your education mixed with compassion and mercy as you practice, what I believe to be, the most noble profession there is.

Specializes in Geriatrics/Oncology/Psych/College Health.
I certainly did not mean to cause all of this controversy. I respect all areas of the nursing profession despite their level of education. One thing I have learned is that noone, not LPN or RN graduates, know it all. When I graduated as an LPN there were several new RN graduates working along side me. They didn't know anymore than I did and we learned together each day as we all still are. Infact, it was the graduate nurses who were previously CNA's who caught on the quickest. Forgive me for stirring up such stink and again I respect you all no matter what your level of education and I pray that each of you use your education mixed with compassion and mercy as you practice, what I believe to be, the most noble profession there is.

Sherry, your original post was in no way offensive. One responding post stirred things into a hornet's nest (as sometimes happens :).) Your question was legitimate - many folks here have run across the same issue of people who, while performing a very valuable function, are not nurses but call themselves that. It's important to draw boundaries as far as scope of practice, etc. The general public has enough trouble understanding what a nurse is/isn't and can/can't do without health care workers confusing them further lol.

i certainly did not mean to cause all of this controversy. i respect all areas of the nursing profession despite their level of education. one thing i have learned is that noone, not lpn or rn graduates, know it all. when i graduated as an lpn there were several new rn graduates working along side me. they didn't know anymore than i did and we learned together each day as we all still are. infact, it was the graduate nurses who were previously cna's who caught on the quickest. forgive me for stirring up such stink and again i respect you all no matter what your level of education and i pray that each of you use your education mixed with compassion and mercy as you practice, what i believe to be, the most noble profession there is.

this is a very tough topic for all of us. i truly believe anyone who says it's not isn't being true to themselves.

i'm an lpn. proud to be an lpn. i am knowledgeable and capable. however, i do not believe any one else to be "more of a nurse" than i simply because they went to school longer or less of a nurse than i because they went to school less time than i.

yes, cnas and mas are not licensed nurses, but that does not mean they are not a nurse. this is what merriam webster has to say on the subject. the docs who call their cnas and nas nurses are not wrong!

"main entry: 1nurse audio.gif

pronunciation: 'n&rs

function: noun

etymology: middle english, from old french nurice, from late latin nutricia, from latin, feminine of nutricius nourishing -- more at nutritious

1 a : a woman who suckles an infant not her own: wetnurse

b : a woman who takes care of a young child:

drynurse

2 : one that looks after, fosters, or advises

3 : a person who is skilled or trained in caring for the sick or infirm especially under the supervision of a physician

4 a : a member of an insect society that belongs to the worker caste and cares for the young b : a female mammal used to suckle the young of another

definition #3 is the one i have been referring to. and scope of practice is not an issue if instructed by the md (or other) to perform this prcedure, if you are confident in your abilities then there is no problem. however, i wouldn't want to perform a procedure if i didn't know how it affects the pt both advantageously and adversely.

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