What do you do when you come across a...

CNL2B · Jul 30, 2010

I still don't really think that follows. Some people come to work drunk, smelling like booze. This happens lots of other places, too, outside of the hospital, with no nurses there to assess them. It doesn't take a license to recognize the smell of alcohol on someone's breath. If you smell booze on a co-worker, that would seem like reasonable enough suspicion to warrant reporting it.

pedicurn, LPN, RN · Jul 30, 2010

I still don't really think that follows. Some people come to work drunk, smelling like booze. This happens lots of other places, too, outside of the hospital, with no nurses there to assess them. It doesn't take a license to recognize the smell of alcohol on someone's breath. If you smell booze on a co-worker, that would seem like reasonable enough suspicion to warrant reporting it.

Actual booze on someone's breath? Yes of course they must be reported.

My worry here is that some people are willing to jump into the situation without careful consideration.

Listerine or hand sanitiser smell? Being familiar with the smell of both products I would feel confident that I would be able to identify them. Comes down to proper assessment and skill when dealing with such a situation.

I know that most of my coworkers use mouthwash and we all use hand sanitiser ....am pretty sure that we could all differentiate these from booze.

Honestly, if I worked in a unit where people couldn't do this .... I would stop using mouthwash/breath freshener/hair products/gargles for sore throat/colognes ..... this situation would be quite concerning and I would choose not to continue working there.

Afterall, we are pretty good at determining when our p'ts have been drinking vs using listerine (even before the blood alcohol comes back). Can we pls apply the same assessment skill to our coworkers

morte, LPN, LVN · Jul 30, 2010

Actual booze on someone's breath? Yes of course they must be reported.
Listerine or hand sanitiser smell? Being familiar with the smell of both products I would feel confident that I would be able to identify them. Comes down to proper assessment and skill when dealing with such a situation.
I know that most of my coworkers use mouthwash and we all use hand sanitiser ....am pretty sure that we could all differentiate these from booze.
Honestly, if I worked in a unit where people couldn't do this .... I would stop using mouthwash/breath freshener/hair products/gargles for sore throat/colognes ..... this situation would be quite concerning and I would choose not to continue working there.
Afterall, we are pretty good at determining when our p'ts have been drinking vs using listerine (even before the blood alcohol comes back). Can we pls apply the same assessment skill to our coworkers[/quote)
the bold part is pretty naive, do you really think the drinker isnt aware and covering his/her tracks?

TDCHIM · Jul 30, 2010

Look, the volunteer may not be a mandated reporter, but that doesn't mean that she should just pass the buck to the RNs and LPNs on the floor to report and blithely assume someone else will take care of reporting it. That kind of mindset can lead to harm to patients. There are scenarios in which reporting could have been bypassed (i.e., a tighly bonded nursing unit unwilling to betray a member of the group) by the existing staff. The volunteer's information could prove to be very important.

Reporting the smell to a direct supervisor is the responsible thing for the volunteer to do, IMHO. She should CLEARLY not report any assumptions or assertions that the individual was intoxicated unless she noted problems with the nurse's gait, speech, etc. However, reporting the presence of an ETOH-like scent is any responsible adult's ethical duty, regardless of whether he or she is a legally obligated reporter. Clearly no one wants to start a witch hunt, but patient safety has to come first. It isn't slander to report (without making assumptions about its source) the presence of an ETOH-like scent on someone's person/breath.

pedicurn, LPN, RN · Jul 30, 2010

Look, the volunteer may not be a mandated reporter, but that doesn't mean that she should just pass the buck to the RNs and LPNs on the floor to report and blithely assume someone else will take care of reporting it. That kind of mindset can lead to harm to patients. There are scenarios in which reporting could have been bypassed (i.e., a tighly bonded nursing unit unwilling to betray a member of the group) by the existing staff. The volunteer's information could prove to be very important.
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Well ... this sounds all very odd. Sounds like something a nursing instructor with hardly any proper experience would dream up.

I hope this is not what they are teaching you :eek:

I have NEVER EVER seen such an unusual situation where a tightly bonded nursing unit protected such a nurse (and the volunteer comes along and saves the day)...it just doesn't happen.... period.

And if it could happen ....that unit would have multiple issues and the boozed nurse would be the lesser of many of them

CNL2B · Jul 30, 2010

Well ... this sounds all very odd. Sounds like something a nursing instructor with hardly any proper experience would dream up.
I hope this is not what they are teaching you
I have NEVER EVER seen such an unusual situation where a tightly bonded nursing unit protected such a nurse (and the volunteer comes along and saves the day)...it just doesn't happen.... period.
And if it could happen ....that unit would have multiple issues and the boozed nurse would be the least of many of them

It happens, all the time. Friends protect their friends behavior. No one wants to squeal on the nurse that's 3 months from retirement. Maybe the whole unit is using/boozing, and they are all covering for each other. Maybe they are all afraid to report for fear of retaliation - nobody wants to be the bad guy (really, I think that last one is the most common scenario.)

You are totally naive if you think these kind of workplace dynamics don't occur.

Nicole Anderson · Jul 30, 2010

Correct me if I am wrong here (I am just a nursing student) but doesn't uncontrolled blood sugars also present this as a symptom (the smell of alcohol on someone's breath)?

pedicurn, LPN, RN · Jul 30, 2010

It happens, all the time. Friends protect their friends behavior. No one wants to squeal on the nurse that's 3 months from retirement. Maybe the whole unit is using/boozing, and they are all covering for each other. Maybe they are all afraid to report for fear of retaliation - nobody wants to be the bad guy (really, I think that last one is the most common scenario.)
You are totally naive if you think these kind of workplace dynamics don't occur.

Gosh I'm not naive at all ... I graduated in the early 1980's and have worked in several different environments and have never seen such a thing. I have seen many nurses report a boozed coworker ...even in quite dysfunctional and unhealthy units.

A scenario where the WHOLE unit is boozing/using and they are all covering for each other is just so far-fetched and unreal .... maybe in the movies, not in real life

pedicurn, LPN, RN · Jul 30, 2010

Correct me if I am wrong here (I am just a nursing student) but doesn't uncontrolled blood sugars also present this as a symptom (the smell of alcohol on someone's breath)?

That would be a ketosis smell .... kinda similar to alcohol but quite easy to tell the difference once you have experienced a few :)

CNL2B · Jul 30, 2010

Gosh I'm not naive at all ... I graduated in the early 1980's and have worked in several different environments and have never seen such a thing. I have seen many nurses report a boozed coworker ...even in quite dysfunctional and unhealthy units.
A scenario where the WHOLE unit is boozing/using and they are all covering for each other is just so far-fetched and unreal .... maybe in the movies, not in real life

I have personally known CRNAs that have placed IVs on each other for the sole purpose of diverting/shooting up. It's real.

pedicurn, LPN, RN · Jul 31, 2010

I have personally known CRNAs that have placed IVs on each other for the sole purpose of diverting/shooting up. It's real.

Yes yes it's real ...but lets keep this matter in perspective whilst remaining alert.

Cripes this thread has made me think. I am a non-drinker but am now prepared to stop using my mouthwash, mints and hair products....which I use every day before work. I spritzed my hair with my high alcohol L'Oreal product this morning ... it reeks of alcohol when sprayed. It's flu season down here and last week i had a slightly sore throat and gargled with a alcohol based medication at work.

Maybe not such a good idea if, one day, I might be working with people who are going to confuse these products with booze.....and report me.....which may result in some cost to me.

Now then....if there were a lot of people like that in my workplace ....it would like working in a snake pit :uhoh3:

PS Don't you think a IV drug injecting CRNA would be finding their own vein ? Just wondering. Would think they would be smart enough to do this in private.

Nicole Anderson · Jul 31, 2010

That would be a ketosis smell .... kinda similar to alcohol but quite easy to tell the difference once you have experienced a few :)

Thank you! I learn something new everyday! LOL:)