VA Clinical Ladder

Specialties Government

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After years working in military and private hospitals ICU, ER & transport I have recently been hired as the Rapid Response nurse for a large VA hospital (well large by VA standards, it's actually quite small, like 275 beds). I was shocked when we went through the orientation class on the VA clinical ladder. They have Nurse I, level I, II & II, Nurse II, Nurse III, & Nurse IV. Nurse IV is for like the head nurse in a hospital. Nurse III is supposed to be for managers and others who have created a "change in practice", for example the RN who started the PICC team is a Nurse III. Nurse II is SUPPOSED to be a unit level competent RN who can care for any of the patient types in that unit, serve as charge and orientate new nurses.

What was shocking to me is that to move up through the levels depends on your nursing degree and projects you do. Like in services for skin care committee etc. No place in the promotion scheme is weather you are a good nurse taken into account.

We all work with those nurses who we know are not very good, the kind you hate to follow because the rooms are a mess, the patients haven't been given their PRNs for pain or hypertension or whatever, the patients say things to you like "I haven't seen my nurse in hours", or "your the first one to do that today" when you listen to heart and lung sounds during your normal assessments.

In the VA those nurses are on exactly equal foot for promotion to Nurse II as the awesome RN whose patients are always well cared for. In the nurse performance evaluation there isn't even a place to take high quality nursing into account. As I have worked in the hospital and responded to Rapid Response calls it is very noticeable who is on top of things and whose patients are getting great nursing care and whose are not. However it is impossible to tell weather the nurse is a Nurse I, Nurse II, or even Nurse III by he care they are providing for their patients.

This is exactly the opposite of every hospital I have ever worked in. Has anyone else noticed this in the VA or is my hospital unique?

I dont have a liscence yet ,need to pass the board ,preparing for it .Secondly I needed to get in there ,I have been trying for 5 yrs lol .That interview was the most demanding I had by the way for the VA . I pray I pass the pharmacy board .Can I transition into the residency program to be a clinical pharmacist and specialize as a psych pharmacists .How possible is that .Secondly any idea about the Nurse ladder stuff and pay range for Nurse II with my background .Can pharmD be considered a health related doctorate degree so I get credit salary wise with the nursing board

How long will boards take? Six months or less. And the residencies start at a certain time of year. What is your other PharmD cohort doing?

Yes, you could be a psych specialized pharmacist.

Idk if the PharmD will qualify or not. I started as a III with a M.S.

As a RN, Nurse II, I'd imagine you'd probably make about 50-55k.

If they hire you as a new nurse to them, it may not bode well if they know you want to immediately slip over to pharmacy. Frankly, I'd wait.

Double post. Oops.

The job ad said 65000-121000 .So a Nurse II cannot be less than 65000 .I will work and solidify my knowledge first as a nurse manager before I think about pharmacy .I am currently writing my paper for Nurse II .I have experience on what is required but need to put it written form to suit Nurse III so even if it fails ,I ll end up with Nurse II

The job ad said 65000-121000 .So a Nurse II cannot be less than 65000 .I will work and solidify my knowledge first as a nurse manager before I think about pharmacy .I am currently writing my paper for Nurse II .I have experience on what is required but need to put it written form to suit Nurse III so even if it fails ,I ll end up with Nurse II

Yeah, that all sounds weird. Nurse II isn't really a significant grade. Are you in an expensive locality? High COLA?

Specializes in Nursing.

Can you please share with me the names of the VA Hospitals who have these clinical ladders?

Specializes in burn ICU, SICU, ER, Trauma Rapid Response.
On 5/5/2022 at 11:53 AM, Sharonha said:

Can you please share with me the names of the VA Hospitals who have these clinical ladders?

They all do.

Specializes in Nursing.

Is everyone who posted comments speaking about the Nursing Standards Board or a Clinical Professional Advancement ladder? There is a difference and from what I have seen at my VA the NSPS will only promote for the most part if you do things for the organization whereas a ladder takes into consideration things done professionally and for the nursing unit. I had read that some VAs had clinical ladders but now cannot find that information.

I just got hired on as a nurse practitioner grade 3 step 3 at the VA. They said that after a year I could promote to a nurse 4. My question is what type of things are they looking for as a nurse practitioner in order to promote to a nurse 4? Also, can I promote at any point in my career, or just when they do the review after the first year? They made it seem as if I only had one shot to try to make it.to nurse 4.

Specializes in burn ICU, SICU, ER, Trauma Rapid Response.
OncRN2015 said:

I just got hired on as a nurse practitioner grade 3 step 3 at the VA. They said that after a year I could promote to a nurse 4. My question is what type of things are they looking for as a nurse practitioner in order to promote to a nurse 4? Also, can I promote at any point in my career, or just when they do the review after the first year? They made it seem as if I only had one shot to try to make it.to nurse 4.

I'm not an NP and can't answer your question about what they are looking for to promote to nurse 4 for NPs. But I can tell you for sure nurse 4 is not a permeant pay grade. You can only be a nurse 4 while in a nurse 4 position. If you leave a nurse 4 position you revert back to being a nurse 3. My former nurse manager, actually managed several departments recently left her position and stepped down to a single unit manager for personal reasons, but she lost her nurse 4 and is now a nurse 3, which is a permanent pay grade. Yes you can promote any time in your career, it's not a one shot deal. 

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