So... It's about 10:45PM and I'm about to head out when i hear a very wound Unit Secretary (16yrs) talking about how fun it is to do blood sugars and encouraging our Unite Secretary who is also 16 to dop them as well.
I went up to her and asked her who did she did a blood sugar on and she turned pale white and said one patient but apparently she did 16 blood sugars because the RN's asked her to on another unit because they didnt have a CNA.
I had a total melt down and told her how dangerous that is and how she should never do that again her job is to answer the phones, call bells and enter orders/consults, never was it to perform patient care in any way shape or form.
I'm just amazed how some people do not really understand where they stand in the nursing field and how a simple mistake can cause some serious problems. What if a patient had a blood sugar of 40 and because she did not know what is an action range number did not report it to the RN?
This unit secretary did something that was completely out of her range of practice and responsibility, and is totally unsafe to the patients. She is not formally educated on blood sugars, hypoglycemia, hyperglycemia, and would not know what to report back to the nurses. It's a scary thought that the nurses would tell her to do this rather than erring on the side of caution and doing their own blood sugars even if there were no cnas. Sounds to me like an incident report should be filled out. Management needs to know, because these nurses may need remedial education on delegation, and the unit secretary needs to know that accepting tasks related to pt. care is inappropriate.
I don't post that often here, but felt that I had to reply.
While I understand the concerns about minors working in the healthcare setting, not all 16 year olds are the same. This specific instance could have happened regardless of age.
I was 15 when I started taking my pre-requisites, and 17 when I began clinical courses in nursing. I was on the floors in clinicals for a year before I became 18 (the director of my nursing program and all of my instructors were aware and I checked with everyone I could to make sure that this was legally acceptable before I began the nursing program). Because I was younger, I had to prove to all of my nursing instructors that I was capable of becoming a nurse. And honestly, I don't think it's fair to judge someone on their age. You should judge them by their abilities and their actions. I was taught about HIPPAA, and would never release medical information to anyone, including my family. I was taught all the critical thinking involved in nursing, and while others had a hard transition from learning basic skills to learning complex assesments and pt evaluation, I found that that was one of my favorite parts of nursing. No one even knew how old I was until they asked (outside of my instructors) and my preceptors at the hospital I did work study in never had any issues with me. Once they got to know me, they trusted me with more and more responsibilities (within my scope of practice and under their supervision). I graduated nursing school in December and I'm an RN in a Level III NICU. Even the instructors that thought I wouldn't last when they heard how old I was, wrote me letters of recommendation for that job.
I'm not trying to toot my own horn, here. I'm not a genius, and I'm definitely not a perfect nurse (as a new nurse, I learn that more and more every day!) I have so much to learn, and hope that someday I can be as great as you experienced nurses! I just wanted to illustrate that just because someone is young doesn't mean that they can't understand HIPAA, scope of practice, or even be able to critically think and assess patients. So, please don't judge someone because they're young-get to know them first and you may be surprised.
no one is passing judgement on an individual, but the lack of complete brain development in teens in making judgement calls and assessing risk is a documented medical fact. that, combined with the sensitive nature of nursing today combined with a lititagous society makes this a legal no-brainer.
and yes, i know many bright, mature teens..but in the eyes of the law they are minors, and not totally accountable for their actions legally. i can't believe risk mgmt is fine with this!
..btw, i was a 16 year old college freshman who was a commissioned officer in the army before i turned 21. i was very mature..but not nearly as mature as i thought i was at the time.
no offencce intended, but are these places letting kids be cna's and unit sect's somewhere in the boonies...because i can't think of any reason except a severe labor shortage for this practice?? a legal & moral nightmare..
minor children can't vote, sign contracts, join the military without parental permission, get a commercial driver's license, or marry in most states. their brains are immature and not fully formed, esp. re: judgement....and some state thinks they can be giving direct patient care, and handling sensitive medical info???
sorry, but this is wrong and dangerous. when someone's 16 year old daughter has to deal with a suggestive 72 yr old with an erection , or some 17 year old starts discussing her classmates' std in algebra class the next day, the brown stuff will hit the fan...
sheeeeeeeeeeesh I'm an almost GN (pinning is the 16th lol) working as unit clerk until I start orientation and I won't set foot in a pt room unless it's a fall situation in which all on the unit even me respond, beyond that I do NOTHING which the nurses on the unit are understanding of the scope of practice and would never ask me to do anything outside the UC position regardless of my education because A) they know it's illegal and B) they know I'll say uh uh no way no how am I going to jeopardize my license before I even get it. our facility can't cross train me as a PCT because I refuse to pay the 160$ for the CNA license this close to NCLEX, now if they wanted to put out the money I'd be more than happy to extend my scope to PCT/UC lol
I found your post today while I about to post a similar story of my own. Apparently, a med/surg unit secretary was asked to help out in our wound care center while their secretary was out on a leave. She came to me all excited because she got to perform her first dressing change. The first thing I asked her was "do you even have BLS?" She said no. Being just a floor nurse, do you think it should be my responsibility to report this somebody? If so, to whom? HR? There is no department manager in the wound care center, just the WOCN who let her do this. Or is it no big deal and I'm blowing things out of proportion?
Specializes in Critical Care, Capacity/Bed Management.
I would just pull the secretary aside and tell her that she should never do anything like that again, explain to her that not only is it dangerous to her and the patient, it can also jeopardize her chances of receiving her RN license in the future. It is the truth and it might help her understand the severity of what she has done.
If she continues to boast about the dressing change then it might be time to report it to a higher authority such as your nurse manager.
I found your post today while I about to post a similar story of my own. Apparently, a med/surg unit secretary was asked to help out in our wound care center while their secretary was out on a leave. She came to me all excited because she got to perform her first dressing change. The first thing I asked her was "do you even have BLS?" She said no. Being just a floor nurse, do you think it should be my responsibility to report this somebody? If so, to whom? HR? There is no department manager in the wound care center, just the WOCN who let her do this. Or is it no big deal and I'm blowing things out of proportion?
What about BLS would have made her more prepared to do a dressing change? I think if the WOCN that would be responsible for charting it was done correctly was ok with the secretary doing the dressing change (I'm betting under her supervision), then it was done right. Heck, a secretary under the supervision of a WOCN would probably do a nicer dressing change than me, an RN that only does them occasionally with no "expert" supervision.
These are procedures people do on themselves at home. They aren't rocket science. I don't get paid for my ability to do a fingerstick glucose check. I get paid for my decision-making skills after I get the results of that glucose. People sure do get excited about someone going out of their way to do more than their job requires of them. It's like they can't win. Either won't get off their behind to do anything other than the bare minimum. Or they get off their behind and do more than the bare minimum, how dare they!!
Specializes in Critical Care, Capacity/Bed Management.
I was accused of going beyond my scope of practice because I would get the nurses IV tubing, or Normal Saline flushes. I was just being a Nurse's Assistant. I learned that in order to protect yourself you have to do everything within your scope. As a secretary she should not be doing dressing changes, however she could make sure that all the printers are stocked with paper, that the nurse's station is neat and organized, she could also get an admission packet ready for the nurse, to help save time.
Exactly, My former SIL was NOT terminated from her job, and should have been. She leaked information to the local media (this was back in 1991) regarding the identity of an 18 year old single mom (a former classmate of mine) who killed her newborn. She also gave out who the MD on duty in the ER was. The next thing you know, there are 1/2 dozen cars in our neighbor's driveway (the MD's).
My former SIL admitted to us she gave out the information. I suspect she was paid for the information, she was a real piece of work. Mind you, she was in her 30's, had two children, and obviously should have known better. But this was before HIPPA, I think, and no one really looked into who leaked the information.
Age doesn't necessary equate to morals, values, and professional integrity. I have mixed feelings on teens/under age working in these areas.
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If the 16 year old is caught violating a Hippa, then they will be terminated, just like a 26year old would be. I know of many 16 year olds who are on the academic path-college bound who show more maturity and responsibility than some of the 30something CNA I have worked with before.
I see good in this program, I have seen it 1st hand the past few years and it has been a win win for all involved.
You are seeing the negative which yes there can be. They are very selective on who is allowed to join this program. If I would just hear the blanket statement of 16 year old giving patient care I too would think "what the heck??" but since I have seen it, supervised them and now am parenting one. I feel I know this program well, and it does work.
I am sure in your life you have encountered many adults who you wouldn't trust to do patient care ..I am also willing to be you have met 16 year old whose maturity and responsibility has impressed you. Those are the kids they are seeking out for this program.
I found your post today while I about to post a similar story of my own. Apparently, a med/surg unit secretary was asked to help out in our wound care center while their secretary was out on a leave. She came to me all excited because she got to perform her first dressing change. The first thing I asked her was "do you even have BLS?" She said no. Being just a floor nurse, do you think it should be my responsibility to report this somebody? If so, to whom? HR? There is no department manager in the wound care center, just the WOCN who let her do this. Or is it no big deal and I'm blowing things out of proportion?
? wound care center, is this clinic or Dr off? if so, doesn't the concept of on the job training come in? like for MAs? as long as the person is trained/supervised,,,,,the supervisor is the responsible party....
It's an Outpatient Wound Care Center within our hospital. She is actually an employee of med-surg/tele, but was asked to help out in the wound care center. She has not completed any patient care training whatsoever. However, since she is a US in a patient care area, she went thru the usual HIPPA, infection control training, etc. So when I mentioned BLS, I was hoping to hear she had some kind of patient care experience. But no. Should I recommend they train her on a few competencies so it's documented? I hear Joint Comission is on their way over...
I just wanted to illustrate that just because someone is young doesn't mean that they can't understand HIPAA, scope of practice, or even be able to critically think and assess patients. So, please don't judge someone because they're young-get to know them first and you may be surprised.
lilywater
18 Posts
This unit secretary did something that was completely out of her range of practice and responsibility, and is totally unsafe to the patients. She is not formally educated on blood sugars, hypoglycemia, hyperglycemia, and would not know what to report back to the nurses. It's a scary thought that the nurses would tell her to do this rather than erring on the side of caution and doing their own blood sugars even if there were no cnas. Sounds to me like an incident report should be filled out. Management needs to know, because these nurses may need remedial education on delegation, and the unit secretary needs to know that accepting tasks related to pt. care is inappropriate.