The Guys Club: Guy Students Come on In!

romansten9 · Sep 30, 2006

piper, are you also a Paramedic? I'm curious why you think that way? Are you working as a nurse now, or is that something you overheard others talking about? In my area most Paramedics are highly respected. Some of the smaller towns have in-experienced medics that might give us a bad name, but the urban medics are awesome. I teach ACLS and PALS and my best students are medics, the nurses don't know the drug calculations, don't know how to start IVs very well, and have never intubated someone even once! medics have to work under low light conditions, all weather, also bouncing around in a vehicle going 100 mph. Most nurses around here have a high respect for medics and ask them questions to learn. Medics also don't need a doctor's verbal permission to do things, we make our own decisions.

romansten9 · Sep 30, 2006

hey guys, I have worked around a lot of nurses. I didnt mention that I also have 17 years experience working in 2 major hospitals in my city. I have prepared myself for what it will be like working as a nurse, and waiting for a doctor to make most of my decisions for me, etc. etc. It will be a humbling experience for sure. Hey guys, I just got here and I feel like I'm being attacked already. Most of you guys aren't even nurses and you have a bias against medics already! where did you get it? I don't have that bias against nurses, I have a high degree of respect for them as well. I have worked on the nursing side most of my life as a CNA, longer than the ambulance side, trust me I know the politics involved from both sides!

romansten9 · Sep 30, 2006

Piper, to summarize what I'm saying, I agree that there are some lousy medics in the world (but please dont lump us all together) Your comment was the start of all of this. There are just as many lousy doctors and nurses out there. but I am not going to come in here and start making comments like yours. can't you allow a medic in here that wants to become a nurse? or is my former job too offensive to you guys? come on, cant we be friends?

Corvette Guy · Sep 30, 2006

piper, are you also a Paramedic? I'm curious why you think that way? Are you working as a nurse now, or is that something you overheard others talking about? In my area most Paramedics are highly respected. Some of the smaller towns have in-experienced medics that might give us a bad name, but the urban medics are awesome. I teach ACLS and PALS and my best students are medics, the nurses don't know the drug calculations, don't know how to start IVs very well, and have never intubated someone even once! medics have to work under low light conditions, all weather, also bouncing around in a vehicle going 100 mph. Most nurses around here have a high respect for medics and ask them questions to learn. Medics also don't need a doctor's verbal permission to do things, we make our own decisions.

Romansten9 - I realize after being a Paramedic for 17 years you have great pride for Medics, as you should! I know in the Army Medical Dept. [AMEDD] Medics are highly trained, highly skilled, and very valuable. Maybe Piper is thinking along the same lines as my wife, that was an ER RN for +4 years [now in a Stepdown Unit]. She has told me how some of the Paramedics drop off the patients in ER w/o giving a full report, or failed to start an IV, etc. This does not mean all Paramedics are weak, or that RNs are superior to all other health care professionals. Health Care Professionals are all part of a team, at least in the AMEDD. I've worked with some outstanding Medics, LVN/LPNs, as well as RNs in the military.

BTW, in the AMEDD critical care setting ANC RN officers have a lot of autonomy & are well respected by the MDs. We are asked all the time for input & suggestions regards to care of our critically ill patient. So, please let us not turn this into which health care position is better, etc.

Again, glad to see you come aboard.

:beer:

I do think you will gain a better appreciation of nurses after you become an RN, and work around other RNs.

romansten9 · Sep 30, 2006

Corvette guy,

Thank you very much for saying that. (I feel like I'm welcome here now) I certainly don't think one is better than the other. I'm only frustrated because they are essentially "interchangeable fields" in many ways (at least medics and ER nurses) and I have been "forced" to go back to school, simply to feed my family....I believe there is a wide range of experience from new medic/experienced and also new nurse/experienced and each one of those 4 can give a range of impressions from poor to great.

I'm sorry your wife had those experiences. I know that medics get pulled in all directions. When its a short drive to the ER, we sometimes don't have time for an IV (remember we do it all ALONE we don't have a team in the back!) and when the pager goes off, the paperwork has to wait (lives take precedence over paperwork) ...or maybe your wife just ran into some crappy medics that didn't give a **** (burnout is very high in medics) You're right that I take pride in what I do. I study everything I get my hands on and I have a great reputation with the nurses because I care, they trust my decision making, and they don't cringe when I bring them patients.

Corvette Guy · Sep 30, 2006

Corvette guy,
Thank you very much for saying that. (I feel like I'm welcome here now) I certainly don't think one is better than the other. I'm only frustrated because they are essentially "interchangeable fields" in many ways (at least medics and ER nurses) and I have been "forced" to go back to school, simply to feed my family....I believe there is a wide range of experience from new medic/experienced and also new nurse/experienced and each one of those 4 can give a range of impressions from poor to great.
I'm sorry your wife had those experiences. I know that medics get pulled in all directions. When its a short drive to the ER, we sometimes don't have time for an IV (remember we do it all ALONE we don't have a team in the back!) and when the pager goes off, the paperwork has to wait (lives take precedence over paperwork) ...or maybe your wife just ran into some crappy medics that didn't give a **** (burnout is very high in medics) You're right that I take pride in what I do. I study everything I get my hands on and I have a great reputation with the nurses because I care, they trust my decision making, and they don't cringe when I bring them patients.

I'd bet you will make an outstanding RN!

romansten9 · Sep 30, 2006

Corvette, thanks for that as well. Even though some have had bad experiences with medics, it has always been my dream to elevate the profession to the highest standards. Nursing is very fortunate, it is well established, has a long history and is repected very very well (I know some physicians don't give the proper respect, but thats not my point) :) Unlike some Paramedics, I have a relentless pursuit of perfection in many ways. I worked as a Telemetry tech for years with the goal of knowing EKGs better (or equal to) cardiologists. I took Phlebotomist jobs inside and outside the hospital to give my best shot at mastering IVs. I did autopsies as the assistant to the ND medical examiner to understand anatomy. I worked in ER for years to get to know the inside scoop. (and to get to know the nursing profession as well as many nurses) (not to mention about 30 other jobs in medicine) Don't get me wrong, I'm not saying this to brag by any means. (I have a lot more to learn- medicine is extremely vast) My point with all of this is also my best advice for students: If you want to understand something, attack it from all angles, and use experiences to your benefit. My job has been so much easier because of experience.

romansten9 · Sep 30, 2006

Lets hear from some of you other guys. It seems like nursing is not a "first" career for many men. Is that true or not? Are men more likely to come to nursing from another health care field or not? (On the other hand, I think its becoming more acceptable to go straight into nursing from high school than it used to be).

piper_for_hire · Sep 30, 2006

What I was referring to was the "We do much of the same work as RNs, but get paid 1/3 as much" part of the post. The jobs are very very different, but more often than not the medics seem to think it's the same job and can't wait to tell you all about it. It's very odd and often seems like there is some kind of ongoing fight. Most people in our ICU dread direct admissions from the field because they have to deal with the medics. Personally I just keep my mouth shut and get to work. I think there is a small amout of overlap between nurses and medics, but it's small.

-S

romansten9 · Sep 30, 2006

Thats my fault for not clarifying from the beginning. You are right, a Paramedic and Nurse are different jobs. I did clarify later when I said that an ER nurse and Paramedic are very similar jobs. In fact, many ERs hire Paramedics to help with the Nursing shortage. And many flight services hire Nurses and Paramedics as interchangeable employees. (they are all scheduled the same and can switch/trade shifts) A Paramedic is not well suited for long term care, (such as a medical floor) but is an excellent worker in an ER. As a matter of fact, many ERs allow the medic to utilize his skills in ways that Nurses are not allowed. For example, Medics often intubate patients or do the hard IV sticks. Many ERs allow Medics to be the team leader in code blues because they have so much experience in running codes. (thats right, the ER doc and nurses allow the medic to lead because he/she knows the ritual so well) That is extremely common here and all across the country. I feel qualified to comment on the differences between Medics and Nurses because I have 20 years of hospital experience and and 17 years in ambulances. I am just as likely to be biased in favor of Nurses as medics, since I actually have more years with the Nurses! I shouldn't compare salaries with Nurses and medics, since not all Nurses have the same job, but don't you agree that medics deserve more than the pizza delivery guy? (can't they get at least 2/3 of a nursing salary??) instead of 1/3? In a typical ambulance response, the bill is well over $500 and the medic would receive $5 or $10 of that amount for saving that persons life! (based on a 30-60 minute length of the transport) I'm not comparing the two professions to say one is better or worse, just to say that ER Nurses and medics are very similar and something has to be done about medics pay!

romansten9 · Oct 1, 2006

To clarify the pay issue, I should mention that ERs pay Medics more than ambulances services do. (sometimes they pay is the same as RN pay in ER, and sometimes its a bit lower) I would say this might be because about 99% of nurses in our state have Bachelors degrees, and most Medics have Associates. The medic training is about 100% related to the job, and the nursing training has a ton of non-work related training as we all know (such as statistics, etc.) Now would someone please change the subject, I never intended to get into the medic topic, I simply wanted to defend the profession from the earlier attack. :)

neko101 · Oct 3, 2006

My dad was a nurse . I look up to him and i think that male nursing is an interesting experience . Being that its such a female dominated profession and all . Glade to see im not the only guy out there ! Guys , keep doing what your doing !