Rn to medic

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Anyone here had any experience in challenging the paramedic exam as an RN in la county! Always been interested in being on both sides of the ER doors!

I think an RN just challenging the Paramedic exam without any EMS training is a recipe for disaster, regardless of how much hospital experience they have. The two environments are just so different, and some really experienced ER nurses probably get a little set in their ways and might have trouble adapting. At the very least they should be required to have an EMT license, as some people who have lots of hospital experience struggle with the operations side of things and lifting and moving patients, handling the cot and driving the ambulance. I worked with an experienced RN/brand new EMT who took longer than most to get those things down and I rarely let her drive the ambulance because I valued my life and she was often a nervous wreck driving on calls. She finally decided it wasn't for her and stopped working the road, and to my knowledge never attempted Paramedic.

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No, no and oh hell no!

No RN should ever be allowed to challenge the Paramedic exam without taking the whole Paramedic program. An RN isn't even trained to the EMT-BASIC level. Ever seen an RN try to help at an MVA? Freakin' disaster!!

Start at the beginning with EMT-BASIC. Work on an ambulance for 1 - 2 years as an EMT and then apply to a Paramedic school. It does not matter if you have RN behind your name. Nothing in RN school will compare to what you go through in Paramedic school. You will be taught critical thinking and the ability to act on your own. You better have a strong back and be prepared to do some hard work outside of a clean cozy hospital where you have lots of help.

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Specializes in Emergency.
No no and oh hell no! No RN should ever be allowed to challenge the Paramedic exam without taking the whole Paramedic program. An RN isn't even trained to the EMT-BASIC level. Ever seen an RN try to help at an MVA? Freakin' disaster!! Start at the beginning with EMT-BASIC. Work on an ambulance for 1 - 2 years as an EMT and then apply to a Paramedic school. It does not matter if you have RN behind your name. Nothing in RN school will compare to what you go through in Paramedic school. You will be taught critical thinking and the ability to act on your own. You better have a strong back and be prepared to do some hard work outside of a clean cozy hospital where you have lots of help.[/quote']

Your comments about RNs in your very brief stint on AN so far show how little you know about our role, scope and education. Yes there is a difference in how paramedics and nurses operate, no, you don't seem to understand it.

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Specializes in Critical Care, ED, Cath lab, CTPAC,Trauma.
No, no and oh hell no!

No RN should ever be allowed to challenge the Paramedic exam without taking the whole Paramedic program. An RN isn't even trained to the EMT-BASIC level. Ever seen an RN try to help at an MVA? Freakin' disaster!!

Start at the beginning with EMT-BASIC. Work on an ambulance for 1 - 2 years as an EMT and then apply to a Paramedic school. It does not matter if you have RN behind your name. Nothing in RN school will compare to what you go through in Paramedic school. You will be taught critical thinking and the ability to act on your own. You better have a strong back and be prepared to do some hard work outside of a clean cozy hospital where you have lots of help.

While I think nurses should take the paramedic training...there are nurses, particularly trained in emergency medicine, who can take the medic exam IF they have trauma training AND have access to the protocols of that state. It is true... most nurses are not trained to do site immobilization and accident scene protocol. However that does not mean that they cannot perform the task.
Ever seen an RN try to help at an MVA? Freakin' disaster!!
I think the same thing can be said of the paramedic helping in a code situation of a fresh heart transplant...it would be a "Freakin' disaster!!"

I think that anyone who deals with patients need a strong back. However, at least on the street you have the entire fire department (mostly males) to help you carry these patients and not have to lift them on and off the commode every hour by yourself (mostly female). Admittedly...dealing with the family dog in your face while trying to resuscitate Momma! can be distracting....you have the police to help control the situation.

I think to disrespect other health professionals is really bad form.

I have been both. Medic and RN. They are completely different focus of patient care. While medics "critically think" as well and "act on their own" they follow a strict medical protocol dictated by the state and their medical control....Some would not feel that is "critical thinking". Nurses also "critically think" and act within their set of protocols and standards. It is true.... most of nursing is in a climate controlled environment. I think it is unfair to assume that there is "lots of help" just hanging around to help. Hard work is what all of us in healthcare are exposed to.

It is a tough job all around.

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Specializes in Emergency.
While I think nurses should take the paramedic training...there are nurses particularly trained in emergency medicine, who can take the medic exam IF they have trauma training AND have access to the protocols of that state. It is true... most nurses are not trained to do site immobilization and accident scene protocol. However that does not mean that they cannot perform the task. I think the same thing can be said of the paramedic helping in a code situation of a fresh heart transplant...it would be a "Freakin' disaster!!" I think that anyone who deals with patients need a strong back. However, at least on the street you have the entire fire department (mostly males) to help you carry these patients and not have to lift them on and off the commode every hour by yourself (mostly female). Admittedly...dealing with the family dog in your face while trying to resuscitate Momma! can be distracting....you have the police to help control the situation. I think to disrespect other health professionals is really bad form. I have been both. Medic and RN. They are completely different focus of patient care. While medics "critically think" as well and "act on their own" they follow a strict medical protocol dictated by the state and their medical control....Some would not feel that is "critical thinking". Nurses also "critically think" and act within their set of protocols and standards. It is true.... most of nursing is in a climate controlled environment. I think it is unfair to assume that there is "lots of help" just hanging around to help. Hard work is what all of us in healthcare are exposed to. It is a tough job all around.[/quote']

Esme, you have more energy than me.

What she said.

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Specializes in Critical Care, ED, Cath lab, CTPAC,Trauma.

NO...I just have too much spare time....LOLOLOL

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No, no and oh hell no!

No RN should ever be allowed to challenge the Paramedic exam without taking the whole Paramedic program. An RN isn't even trained to the EMT-BASIC level. Ever seen an RN try to help at an MVA? Freakin' disaster!!

Start at the beginning with EMT-BASIC. Work on an ambulance for 1 - 2 years as an EMT and then apply to a Paramedic school. It does not matter if you have RN behind your name. Nothing in RN school will compare to what you go through in Paramedic school. You will be taught critical thinking and the ability to act on your own. You better have a strong back and be prepared to do some hard work outside of a clean cozy hospital where you have lots of help.

Even non-bridge programs range from 6 months to 4 years. So-"whole program" seems to have a lot of range. How long was your whole program, and what other education did you have prior?

A program taking into account rn training and experience makes sense. Sure, I could sit through the same medication calculation training as a basic EMT. On the other hand, given my experience in balancing inotrophic and chronotropic pressors to maximize cardiac output, I might just be a little ahead of the Basic who had never given a Tylenol. And, in an ICU with no doc around at night, I might have even picked up a couple of critical thinking skills.

There are many examples in which the two curricula overlap. Teaching paramedic level pharmacology to an RN isn't really a productive use of time. And, don't forget- RNs also have an independent scope of practice with drugs. ACLS, PALS, and hospital protocols.

Ever seen an RN try to help at an MVA? Freakin' disaster!! As luck would have it, bridge programs require basic EMT training, which covers scene safety.

And, if you know of a clean cozy hospital where I could get lots of help, please let me know. It sounds nice.

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While I think nurses should take the paramedic training...there are nurses, particularly trained in emergency medicine, who can take the medic exam IF they have trauma training AND have access to the protocols of that state. It is true... most nurses are not trained to do site immobilization and accident scene protocol. However that does not mean that they cannot perform the task. I think the same thing can be said of the paramedic helping in a code situation of a fresh heart transplant...it would be a "Freakin' disaster!!"

I think that anyone who deals with patients need a strong back. However, at least on the street you have the entire fire department (mostly males) to help you carry these patients and not have to lift them on and off the commode every hour by yourself (mostly female). Admittedly...dealing with the family dog in your face while trying to resuscitate Momma! can be distracting....you have the police to help control the situation.

I think to disrespect other health professionals is really bad form.

I have been both. Medic and RN. They are completely different focus of patient care. While medics "critically think" as well and "act on their own" they follow a strict medical protocol dictated by the state and their medical control....Some would not feel that is "critical thinking". Nurses also "critically think" and act within their set of protocols and standards. It is true.... most of nursing is in a climate controlled environment. I think it is unfair to assume that there is "lots of help" just hanging around to help. Hard work is what all of us in healthcare are exposed to.

It is a tough job all around.

Double standard as I thought I would find on a nurse forum. I guess you don't like being questioned by someone in a group nurses tend to look down upon as a lesser profession.

You think it is perfectly okay for a nurse to just challenge a test and then work as a Paramedic? Paramedics come out of school ready to start IVs, intubate, do central lines, EJs, work a code, do a cricothyrotomy, and decompress a chest. I don't know of any nursing school which allows a nursing student to intubate. According to this forum, most don't even get a chance to start an IV.

You don't want us around your high acuity patients until you need us to transport them to a center of higher care. Then we are great as long as we get what you don't want in your hospital out real fast.

Do you have no problem letting a new grad RN or a nursing home nurse work in your heart unit.

And, don't forget- RNs also have an independent scope of practice with drugs. ACLS, PALS, and hospital protocols.

Nurses are not independent of anything unless they are nurse practitioners and even then they have to answer to a doctor.

ACLS and PALS do not give you independent practice either or the right to push drugs. It definitely does not allow you to intubate. Look at the first page of either of these text books and you will see this all clearly explained.

What is a 4 year bridge program and who would be stupid enough to go through one for a Paramedic certificate which is about 1000 hours to an Associates degree?

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I can see I have to start at the beginning here with first explaining what EMTs and Paramedics are.

Paramedics do much more than just spinal immobilization. This part is directed at Esme12. Paramedics can give meds, do IVs, intubate, do central lines, EJs, work a code, do a cricothyrotomy, and decompress a chest.

EMTs do not get drug calculations in their training. They are first aiders and barely have enough time in class to learn all they should know. An EMT-Basic probably will not be giving Tylenol. This is directed at hherrn.

If you just challenge a Paramedic test even if you do have EMT, how in the hell are you going to tell your employer you are ready to intubate, put in a central line or even an IO, run a code with just an EMT partner, decompress a chest or perform a cric? Did you learn it from youtube?

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Specializes in Emergency.
I can see I have to start at the beginning here with first explaining what EMTs and Paramedics are. Paramedics do much more than just spinal immobilization. This part is directed at Esme12. Paramedics can give meds do IVs, intubate, do central lines, EJs, work a code, do a cricothyrotomy, and decompress a chest. EMTs do not get drug calculations in their training. They are first aiders and barely have enough time in class to learn all they should know. An EMT-Basic probably will not be giving Tylenol. This is directed at hherrn. If you just challenge a Paramedic test even if you do have EMT, how in the hell are you going to tell your employer you are ready to intubate, put in a central line or even an IO, run a code with just an EMT partner, decompress a chest or perform a cric? Did you learn it from youtube?[/quote']

I can put in an IO and would feel confident challenging any medic I have ever met to an IV contest. I have co-workers (RNs) who can intubate, decompress a chest and perform crics. We didn't learn these things from YouTube, we learned them from years of experience in emergency and critical care nursing.

My colleagues with the largest psychomotor skill set (which seems to be what you are hung up on) are flight and northern outpost nurses. They could waltz onto the job of our city medics and kick butt with no problem (although maybe they wouldn't want to do the driving).

No one is suggesting that an RN straight out of school should be able to challenge an exam and be a fully licensed paramedic... but, to think that an RN who is experienced in trauma couldn't learn your protocols with relative ease is silly, as is the thought that s/he couldn't pick up the psychomotor skills necessary (if not already possessed).

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I can put in an IO and would feel confident challenging any medic I have ever met to an IV contest. I have co-workers (RNs) who can intubate, decompress a chest and perform crics. We didn't learn these things from YouTube, we learned them from years of experience in emergency and critical care nursing.

My colleagues with the largest psychomotor skill set (which seems to be what you are hung up on) are flight and northern outpost nurses. They could waltz onto the job of our city medics and kick butt with no problem (although maybe they wouldn't want to do the driving).

No one is suggesting that an RN straight out of school should be able to challenge an exam and be a fully licensed paramedic... but, to think that an RN who is experienced in trauma couldn't learn your protocols with relative ease is silly, as is the thought that s/he couldn't pick up the psychomotor skills necessary (if not already possessed).

Your hospital allows the RNs to do needle decompression, intubate and place IOs in the ICU? Are they flight nurses in training? I bet your nursing board would love to get hold of this info if these nurses are doing this on the sly. Are all ICU and ER nurses required to do this? Don't you have doctors who can do central lines and chest tubes in your hospital? This hospital sounds like a real mess to be working in.

Where are RNs going to get practice in the real world to do intubation, crics, needle decompression and IOs enough to waltz up to an ambulance service with just a piece of paper saying they passed a test? That is very naïve on your part.

The NCLEX is a breeze from what I am told. Any Paramedic with an Associates degree should be able to challenge the NCLEX and get the title of RN also so they can work in the heart units as an RN.

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Specializes in Emergency.
Your hospital allows the RNs to do needle decompression intubate and place IOs in the ICU? Are they flight nurses in training? I bet your nursing board would love to get hold of this info if these nurses are doing this on the sly. Are all ICU and ER nurses required to do this? Don't you have doctors who can do central lines and chest tubes in your hospital? This hospital sounds like a real mess to be working in. Where are RNs going to get practice in the real world to do intubation, crics, needle decompression and IOs enough to waltz up to an ambulance service with just a piece of paper saying they passed a test? That is very naïve on your part. The NCLEX is a breeze from what I am told. Any Paramedic with an Associates degree should be able to challenge the NCLEX and get the title of RN also so they can work in the heart units as an RN.[/quote']

You have misread my post.

With the exception of IOs (which btw are really not as exciting as you seem to feel) we are not doing these skills in my urban ER where we have doctors in spades. My point was that I have colleagues who can and do do these skills in their roles as flight and northern outpost RNs.

I have confidence that some of my coworkers would excel as paramedics, and I'd pick them to care for me in a heartbeat. I precept paramedic students and have an excellent grasp on the skill set and critical thinking they have as new grads, as I'm sure is the case with many of the nurses on this board reading along, you aren't providing anyone with new information.

I know nothing about the NCLEX as I never took it, and my college knows what our scope of practice and activities are, so don't fuss yourself on our account ;)

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